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Wikipedia talk:In the news. Thanks.
A further 20 million people in
England are placed into
Tier 4, the level with the strictest
COVID-19 restrictions. All secondary schools in England are to remain closed for an additional two weeks.
(BBC News)
The
United Kingdom reports a record 55,892 new confirmed cases in the past 24 hours, bringing the nationwide total of confirmed cases to 2,488,780.
(ITV)
Health officials report that at least 26 residents of a
retirement home in
Mol have died from complications related to COVID-19 since a volunteer dressed as Sinterklaas, who later tested positive for the virus, visited the home on December 5. Officials, however, have not confirmed that the volunteer was the source of the outbreak at the home, where 85 others have also tested positive.
(AFP via The Straits Times)
The
Czech Republic reports a record 16,939 new confirmed cases in the past 24 hours, bringing the nationwide total of confirmed cases to 718,661 as the positivity rate reaches 52%.
(Irozhlas)
Tokyo reports a record 1,337 new cases in the past 24 hours. It is the first
prefecture to surpass 1,000 daily cases since the beginning of the pandemic.
(The Asahi Shimbun)
Nationwide, a record 4,520 new cases are reported in
Japan in the past 24 hours. It is the first time that the country has reported more than 4,000 daily cases since the beginning of the pandemic.
(NHK World)
Victoria tightens their restrictions as three new cases are reported, bringing the total number of cases in the state to six. Under the new restrictions, in-home gatherings will be limited to 15 people, masks must be worn indoors, and people are advised to stay out of the
Melbourne city centre on New Year's Eve.
(The Guardian)
The authorities arrested dozens of protesters in
Minneapolis as they demanded answers into the fatal police shooting of 23-year-old Dolal Bayle Idd on December 30. The protests came after the
body camera footage from a deadly traffic stop was released. At least 15 people were detained for allegedly
rioting and 21 people were cited and released.
(KSTP-TV)
U.S. SenatorDavid Perdue and his wife test negative for COVID-19, but will quarantine ahead of his upcoming
runoff matchup against
Jon Ossoff after coming into contact with a person in his campaign who later tested positive for the virus.
(CBS News)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: American politician; among his career titles, he served as the U.S Attorney General under Presidents Reagan and HW Bush and was the Governor of Pennsylvania before that
Tunestoons (
talk)
07:26, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. Stubby, some possible translation infelicities. There is nothing about her career outside politics, and what she did in office when she achieved it. Also no personal life at all (spouse, children). The date of her post-grad study would be useful (at least was it immediately after her undergrad education or later). Plenty to time to expand. I can't assess the given sources, which are nearly all Polish language.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
07:00, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Stephen, and, fwiw -- this article was NOT ready. It clearly fails the Spencer test. The article is just a listing of political offices and elections contested. There is absolutely nothing about the Fedak's political career in terms of work done, topics and policies advanced.
Ktin (
talk)
00:53, 2 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Spencer's views on how much detail is necessary in a political biography are not shared by all of us here and should not hold up posting an item that meets the RD criteria.
P-K3 (
talk)
14:01, 2 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Pawnkingthree, water under the bridge now, but, expecting an article to have details about the work that a person did rather than just a listing of positions / elections seems reasonable to me. That said, other than that vital detail, this article is clean and meets hygiene requirements for homepage / RD. While I continue to maintain that this posting was rushed and also that was posted from the top rather than the bottom, I do not / will not make a case for removing this article from homepage. I would also want to acknowledge
MurielMary and
TJMSmith 's efforts in shaping the article. Onwards and upwards. Cheers.
Ktin (
talk)
14:11, 2 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Support – The death has also been reported by
HipHopDX and
XXL. According to his family and current reporting, Dumile died on 31 October; however his death was not publicly disclosed until today, 31 December. —
BLZ ·
talk21:46, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
OpposeComment – I know I'm at risk of being "that guy" by saying this, but this isn't a recent death, and that fact won't change no matter how good the article gets.
AllegedlyHuman (
talk)
22:29, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Indian mountaineer. Article requires some work on sourcing, but, doable in case someone can get to it before me. Else, I will get to it sometime this afternoon. Comprehensive rewrite of the article completed. Took a little longer due to my off-wiki commitments. But, the article is well sourced and is ready to go.
Ktin (
talk)
18:58, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, No one has worked on the article yet. I was to work on it. Managed some sourcing before having to attend to off-wiki stuff for most of the day. Too late now for the day, so, maybe tomorrow. If you have some time and want to attack the sourcing and / or the tone go for it. Both need to be addressed.
Ktin (
talk)
06:54, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
If you are expert on Indian issues, it would probably be best if you work at it first. I've hacked a bit out of the lead on neutrality grounds. Probably wise to run it through Earwig before working on it, chunks probably originated elsewhere.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
07:09, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
It's looking better now, but there are still multiple small copied phrases. I've purged those from two sources but they're still coming up from other places. Not looked at this in detail otherwise, but just to start with the list of awards in the lead could do with pruning to the most prestigious and the tone is still a bit too laudatory.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
02:43, 2 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Support. Comprehensive rewrite of the article completed. Here's the Copyvio report
link. Article is well sourced and good to go. RIP.
Ktin (
talk)
21:32, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Comment. Please can I get an additional pair of eyes on this one? The latest Copyvio report can be accessed
here. There are two direct quotes that are hits, as expected, but, with the rewrites done, this should be good to go to the homepage.
Ktin (
talk)
03:16, 2 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Ktin, if it helps, I think for instance it’s things like
this where the phrasing about absolving responsibility had been a quotation and then was lifted into the article without quotes. It’s a drag when that happens, tedious to locate and remove once already well into editing process. (I will go fix this one, it’s just as a for-instance. I did not look at the rest, Earwig kept timing out on me.)
Innisfree987 (
talk)
03:34, 2 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Looks fine from a copyvio perspective: highest hit in
Earwig is 13.8%. I've lost track of all the various versions, but perhaps revdelling before 17:32, 1 January 2021 (which is apparently when I ran the problematic Earwig report) would be wise.
AleatoryPonderings (
???) (
!!!)
17:18, 2 January 2021 (UTC)reply
AleatoryPonderings, whatever earwigs is catching now isn't a problem as you also point out. Previous copyvios are have been sorted. I have not introduced any intentional close paraphrasing.
DTM (
talk)
13:45, 3 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Support. Nicely done
DiplomatTesterMan in expanding the article and categorizing it as well. I toned down the language and made a few minor copyedits, otherwise it looks good. Latest link to CopyVio report is
here. Just for the record, this article was ready as of
this revision with the corresponding CopyVio report
here. This article should not have had to wait an extra day. But, anyways here we are, and the article expansion is definitely a positive. Nicely done.
Ktin (
talk)
20:30, 2 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Support. Okay I’ve been through all the Earwig pings (two searches, one of cited sources and one of web broadly), removed three small phrases, and now I find only the kind of matching titles and other proper nouns you would expect. Looks ready to me.
Innisfree987 (
talk)
20:29, 3 January 2021 (UTC)reply
@
Stephen,
Dumelow,
Black Kite,
MSGJ, and
Amakuru: - Admins, please consider restoring this article on the RD carousel and temporarily going to a count of 7. This article spent less than 10 hours on homepage / RD and has just fallen off the carousel. Greatly appreciate your consideration.
Ktin (
talk)
20:17, 4 January 2021 (UTC)reply
MSGJ, Thanks much for trying Martin. Much appreciated. The article stayed on for 2 more minutes before being reverted. Please pardon my emotions seeping through the text. I worked ~5-6 hours between new years' eve and new year day, taking time away from family, to get this article to the state that it could be posted to homepage. I am sure other editors here including
DiplomatTesterMan invested a good amount of time in working this article. That the article spent less than ~10 hours on the RD carousel is demotivating. Thanks again for attempting to restore. Much appreciated.
Ktin (
talk)
22:09, 4 January 2021 (UTC)reply
If I interpret
Stephen's revert summary correctly then there were several other entries which had more reason to be re-added, i.e. other entries that spent even less time on the main page. Is that correct? How many entries would we have needed in this case to give everything 24 hours exposure? — Martin (
MSGJ ·
talk)
07:46, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Ktin: It's frustrating when one sees "their" nomination get less time than they think it deserves. On the positive side, this same nomination would likely have already been stale with the previous sorted post model. In the new model, this still qualified and was posted, albeit less time than you might think is fair. The issue is that there is no consensus yet on the minimum post time, or if there should even be a minimum at all. In the meantime, each poster is applying their individual best judgement, which also varies. —
Bagumba (
talk)
09:01, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: UNAMID, begun in 2007, was one of the largest and most controversial UN peacekeeping missions. Its mandate expires on 31 December, beginning a six-month drawdown period. In common with much of our UN coverage, the article is unfortunately not in a good state and needs quite a bit of TLC. —Brigade Piron (
talk)
10:38, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
With the state the article is in, probably not ready to post. Also, just the mission ending (with the transition period) probably does not make a good ITN story. I'd support if there is any further development, such as mission renewal or restructuring. --Tone11:01, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The mandate expires, so UNAMID itself expires? That is a notable consequence. It will explicitly not be replaced, and its activities are now restricted to securing its own withdrawal. Please actually read the links before voting. —Brigade Piron (
talk)
21:36, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support It's the end of a notable UN mission, who cares if the end date is arbitrary. The notable consequences are that the mission is ending. What more do you want? Bzweebl (
talk •
contribs)
04:42, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article:Alto Reed (
talk·history·tag) Recent deaths nomination (
Post) News source(s):Billboard Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
At least 25 people are killed and more than 110 others wounded in an attack at the
Aden International Airport, shortly after a plane carrying the newly formed
government arrived from
Saudi Arabia.
Prime MinisterMaeen Abdulmalik Saeed is taken to safety along with the Saudi
ambassador and all remaining government members. The
Houthis are blamed for the attack, but the group has denied responsibility. Another blast was later reported at the presidential palace, where the cabinet was meeting.
(The Washington Post)
North Dakota records 96 hospitalizations in the past 24 hours, making it the first time since September 24 that there have been less than 100 hospitalizations in the state.
(AP)
Ontario reports a record 2,923 new confirmed cases in the past 24 hours, bringing the total number of confirmed cases in the province to 178,831.
(CBC)
Germany reports a record 1,129 deaths in the past 24 hours, according to data from the
Robert Koch Institute, marking the first time that the country has surpassed 1,000 daily deaths since the beginning of the pandemic.
(DW)
TaoiseachMicheál Martin confirms that the
country will close all non-essential retail under full level 5 restrictions that will remain in place for at least one month and will also delay the reopening of schools until January 11. Authorities also agree to extend travel bans to
South Africa and the
United Kingdom until January 6.
(RTÉ)
Malta reports its first three cases of a new variant of
SARS-CoV-2 from the
United Kingdom. Two of the cases are reported in people who travelled from the UK, while the third is still being investigated.
(Times of Malta)
As a result of this case, Taiwan will ban all non-resident foreigners from entering the country beginning on January 1. Legal residents, as well as people given special permission, and the spouses and children of
Taiwanese nationals will be excluded from this ban.
(Radio Taiwan International)
Thailand imposes a ban on large gatherings and events in controlled zones across the country in order to reduce the number of cases. 250 new cases are reported in the past 24 hours.
(Bangkok Post)(CNA)
Bobi Wine, challenger to the incumbent
PresidentYoweri Museveni who has been in office since 1986, is arrested along with his entire campaign team in the town of
Kalangala. No information about the arrest has been made available.
(CNN via MSN)
Scientists at the
Russian Academy of Sciences announce the discovery of a "well-preserved"
woolly rhinoceros carcass in
Abyysky District,
Sakha,
Russia, which was revealed by melting permafrost in August. The Russian Academy of Sciences says that the woolly rhinoceros was likely 3 or 4 years old when it died by drowning in the river, and could be anywhere from 20,000 to 50,000 years old.
(ABC News)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Support Article is in the main well sourced, though some of those sources could be added to support confirmed and suspected victims sections
JW 1961Talk18:52, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Strong Support Article is well written and subject is clearly notable - "involved in at least fifty murders, the largest number of proven cases for any serial killer in United States history". Died on December 30 though not December 31.
Inexpiable (
talk)
20:50, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment: There's no source for the "Confirmed murder victims" list and the "Suspected murder victims" list is only partly referenced (the source at the end of the explanatory sentence does not have a list of victims). From a BLP point of view I feel this should be addressed -
Dumelow (
talk)
21:51, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I found a second source for the suspect list (newer page from the FBI). The Confirmed ones would appear to be those already mentioned in the body so it would be a matter of bringing references down. --
Masem (
t)
05:09, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Comment. This might be just a visceral dislike for articles of this sort, but the long list of suspected cases struck me as hugely problematic. It feels like a discography or filmography, glorifying his work. These victims will probably have living family. Personally I'd just delete it -- any notable ones can be discussed in the text -- but I don't edit such articles at all. It certainly needs every entry individually cited to a reliable source.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
06:01, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Oppose The "suspected" list strikes me as an
WP:UNDUE enumeration. Sure, he defined by his collective murders, but not to the extent that they need to be in a
WP:FANCRUFT table of trivial data. Do not need this on the MP.—
Bagumba (
talk)
09:13, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Indian radio broadcaster. A bit on the shorter side, but article has shaped to be a solid Start-class biography. C-class biography.
Ktin (
talk)
20:28, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Sorry, I can't assess this (per request below), as the key source isn't in a language I can read. The lead/infobox facts currently lack direct citations eg the year of birth. The lead could do with making clear that the two broadcasting positions mentioned are actually the same under different names. There's a lack of detail on her career, versus her childhood and personal life. Also not 100% sure on notability, to be honest -- radio news announcers have a hard time demonstrating notability; I've even seen such articles speedy tagged by new-page patrollers. I notice the two broadcasters she notes as inspiration do not appear to have articles. I don't think the two English-language articles are enough alone to fully satisfy GNG, they're very brief, and a lot of the other sources are not notability conferring.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
03:46, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, The lede and infobox have computed dates. Don't think we will need citations for those. Regarding foreign language sources, we consistently use them. I personally have used (and others too use) a good amount of German and occasional Spanish resources on the RD submissions. That should not preclude the article, nor should it cast questions on overall notability. That said, if you'd prefer you can use a translator such as Google translate. I ran one now, and the results are not too shabby. Thanks.
Ktin (
talk)
05:30, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Sure, foreign language sources are fine, but someone has to check them! I can read German a little, so I tend to check those here. I would never use Google translate except to just get a quick ballpark idea of what the source might cover. Also the standards of checking necessary for a new article are higher than for an older one; anything that's survived six months here with multiple editors working on it can usually be assumed to be broadly notable. A new article can't.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
06:29, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, I am tagging @
Tachs: whom I consider as an SME on Malayalam language / Kerala related topics and articles on WP to review the sources, particularly the ones in Malayalam.
Tachs pardon the bother -- can I request you to look at the Malayalam language sources if you have a bit. Thanks.
Ktin (
talk)
06:49, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support The article is reasonably well sourced, three of them, The Hindu, Indian Express and Mathrubhumi, are reliable sources. Regarding the quality of the article, it is a decently written one. I have suggested a few alterations, which are minor ones. --
jojo@nthony (
talk)
07:42, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak oppose per Espresso Addict. I looked at this one last night, and was struck by how little detail the career section had, for what was a 34 year career. Other than a catchphrase used to open her radio show, it's not clear from the article why she's significant. I decided to just pass it by rather than Oppose, as maybe others feel differently. But now EA has said the same thing I will echo it. If she really meets GNG, then there must be more detail available than what we're giving now. Cheers —
Amakuru (
talk)
10:12, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Question: Other than the filmography (presumably), what are the other parts of this article that people think need citations? I don't see any cn tags there right now.
KConWiki (
talk)
01:59, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Article:2020 Aden airport attack (
talk·history·tag) Blurb: Explosions rockedAden airport in
Yemen killing at least twenty five people soon after a plane carrying the new government arrived from Saudi Arabia. (
Post) Alternative blurb: An attack at
Aden airport shortly after the arrival of
Yemen's new unity government leaves dozens dead and over one hundred injured. News source(s):BBC,
AP,
Reuters,
Guardian Credits:
Oppose For now, article is a tiny stub with little to no information on the attacks themselves. Support If article is cleaned up, already 16 deaths and it's only been about an hour or two.
Gex4pls (
talk)
15:46, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Post-posting comment. I've reduced the injuries count to >50 as latest BBC this morning states that. The AP source used for 110 is dated yesterday. I think it's better to be conservative here.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
08:24, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Oppose Like gay marriage/rights, I don't think we can afford to recognize anything but the 1st country in a region to recognize abortion rights, barring other factors. --
Masem (
t)
17:58, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Masem, why not? We also post all the recurring sports events, elections and natural disasters, not only the first ones in the respective region. And many of these are less impactful than policy decisions of this magnitude with global coverage. Support. Sandstein 21:09, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I'm just saying that this is approach we have taking with past "social change" like gay rights/marriage. Where do we draw the line? Until all 200+ countries in the world pass such laws? Identifying the first few countries that take these key steps seems to be accepted, but beyond that, its part a trend that we don't continually need to report at ITN, unless it is something extremely significant (like Suadi Arabia and women's rights). --
Masem (
t)
21:16, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose per Masem. Similar to Arab countries making relations with Israel and maybe countries going into national lockdown, the first one to do so is significant, the third not really. —
Amakuru (
talk)
01:45, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak support on reader interest (there was a spike, but only 3k page views yesterday); oppose on article quality as it needs to be updated. (And yes, we can post a blurb like this for every country; the 2020 World Rally Championship was on ITN for three weeks of December, we have plenty of space.)
Levivichharass/hound18:56, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Now oppose as reader interest has waned and there are noms that are of more interest to readers now. This would have been a good one to post a few days ago, had the article been of sufficient quality. Too bad.
Levivichharass/hound19:10, 4 January 2021 (UTC)reply
No, but is a rebuttal to the argument that we can't post every country because we don't have enough space. (And anyway, I disagree with your essay. Screen real estate is a legitimate consideration for anything main page-related.)
Levivichharass/hound19:36, 4 January 2021 (UTC)reply
I'm not saying we shouldn't post every single country because we "don't have enough space", I'm saying we shouldn't post it because, much like gay marriage or lockdowns, after critical mass countries moving in a certain legislative direction is not interesting enough for the Main Page. (Also, we shouldn't stoop to the 24-hour news cycle and have suboptimal filler when nothing else (except for a really big thing in the banner) is happening; this is stale, however, and I digress.) –
John M Wolfson (
talk •
contribs)
19:49, 4 January 2021 (UTC)reply
You say "stoop" as if Wikipedia is above the news cycle, and by extension, the news media. We're actually below them. We rely on them to tell us what's happening, not the other way around. The news cycle produces much more content, of higher quality, much faster, than Wikipedia. Wikipedia would be rising to the 24-hour news cycle, not stooping. (Now I've joined you in digression.)
Levivichharass/hound04:20, 5 January 2021 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
A magnitude 6.4
earthquake strikes
Petrinja,
Croatia, destroying half of the town. Several other cities in the country are also affected. At least seven people are killed, five of whom were in
Glina, one in Petrinja, and one in
Žažina. Several others are also injured.
(BBC News)
Ontario reports a record 2,553 new confirmed cases in the past 24 hours, along with 1,939 new cases yesterday, bringing the total number of confirmed cases in the province to 175,908.
(Global News)
Quebec reports its first case of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2 in a person who had been in contact with a family member who travelled from the United Kingdom on December 11 and tested positive for COVID-19 on December 13.
(Montreal Gazette)
Ireland reports a record 1,546 new cases in the past 24 hours, bringing the nationwide total of confirmed cases to 88,439.
(The Irish Times)
Ireland officially begins a
vaccination programme against COVID-19 using
Pfizer-
BioNTech's
tozinameran vaccine, with a 79-year-old woman from
Dublin becoming the first person to receive the vaccine.
(RTÉ)
Denmark extends its hard
lockdown until January 17 due to substantial increases in numbers of cases and hospitalizations in the country.
(The Straits Times)
India reports six cases of a more contagious variant of SARS-CoV-2 in individuals who travelled from the
United Kingdom and are now in isolation.
(BBC News)
Japan reports its first case of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2 from
South Africa in a 30-year old woman who arrived in Japan on December 19 and later tested positive for COVID-19.
(The Japan Times)
Pakistan reports its first cases of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2 from the
United Kingdom. The patients are three people who travelled from the UK to
Sindh and later tested positive for COVID-19.
(The Hindu)
The
Philippines extends its travel ban to 19 "flagged" countries and territories from midnight until January 15 in order to prevent
new variants of SARS-CoV-2 from entering the country.
(CNA)
Queensland reports Australia's first case of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2 from
South Africa in a woman who arrived in the state on December 22 and later tested positive for COVID-19.
(ABC Australia)
The
Investigative Committee of Russia accuses opposition leader and anti-corruption activist
Alexei Navalny of fraud for allegedly using public funds from his organization for personal needs. The accusation comes after the federal prison service demanded that Navalny report to its office today or face jail time.
(DW)
The
Senate begins to debate the legalization of
abortion up until the 14th week of pregnancy. If passed, Argentina will become the third
Latin American country to allow abortion to be performed on demand, after
Cuba and
Uruguay. The
Catholic Church opposes the move. The bill has already been approved by the
lower house.
(Reuters)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
I have restored this to the 7th item for now. What would be nice is some automated tracking of how long each RD is up for to get an idea of what the new expected dwell time is; 24 hours might not be achievable.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
01:26, 2 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Death from Huntington's Disease of 1980s-1990s Indianapolis 500, IndyCar Series, 24 Hours of Le Mans and 24 Hours of Daytona driver with two IndyCar wins and two 24 Hours of Daytona wins, in addition to being notorious for his involvement in the 1980s drug trade.
The BushrangerOne ping only23:12, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Not checked in detail but the first paragraph of the Away from the track section may need better sourcing. The prose style is also very choppy with short paragraphs, a timeline feel and some informal writing.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
03:14, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose per TRM. Fair use pictures should not be used on so recent a death, when there's every prospect that someone has a free photo of him. —
Amakuru (
talk)
10:06, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Canadian photographer and contemporary history chronogropher. Death announced on this date. Article requires good amount of work. Will get to it this evening. Done and done! Happy with the way the article has shaped up. For someone who led all those photography initiatives, it is a bit of a sad note that we do not have a photo of hers. RIP Ms. Monk. I am calling it a day, but, do not foresee major edits on this article. Good to go imo. Article now has images added. Looks beautiful. Great partnership
AleatoryPonderings and
Masem. Thanks folks.
Ktin (
talk)
22:36, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment death is now mentioned, and I note from the guidelines on article quality for RD that "one or two "citation needed" tags may not hold up an article" therefore the missing refs shouldn't prevent this nomination from being posted.
MurielMary (
talk)
18:47, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support. There's one remaining {{cn}} which I can't quite verify, but it's by no means critical to the article and can just be cut if others can't verify. Otherwise ready IMO.
AleatoryPonderings (
???) (
!!!)
20:45, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
MurielMary, other than the filmography (set of bullets) this article is currently a stub. We have not promoted articles of a stubby nature to homepage / RD in the past.
Ktin (
talk)
11:39, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. It is under 1500 characters of prose per the DYK counter. I'd expect more on a selection of her notable film roles from reviews or similar. There isn't even a comment on her two award nominations, beyond the fact of the nominations, and those films are not listed in the filmography. Not an expert in fair-use custom here (it's a lot stricter than the UK norms), but we've often held off putting such images into articles until a few months after death, to allow a full search to be made for free images. @
The Rambling Man: for an expert opinion.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
02:58, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
For the reference, we posted the one in Zagreb in March. This one was stronger but away from Zagreb or other big cities, so the damage will likely be smaller overall. The town of Petrijna was hit hard, though. The article still needs some expansion. --Tone14:28, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support in principle. The strongest quake was reportedly even stronger than the one that hit Zagreb in 1880, which would probably make it the strongest in the country's history on record. There's a rising death toll and many buildings were damaged in the nearby cities, including Zagreb where power outages and other problems have occurred as a consequence.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
18:56, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support The death toll is definitely higher than the one in Zagreb, it's receiving a lot of coverage in various news outlets and the article seems referenced as well.
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
06:39, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Support blurb once the article is improved. He was definitely a transforming figure in his field and the 'bubble dress' that he introduced has become a standard garment worn by virtually every woman in the world.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
17:46, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Bagumba: We posted a blurb for
Karl Lagerfeld's death last year. I consider both Lagerfeld and Cardin to be on the top of their field. Lagerfeld owned and run influential brands, while Cardin was more influential in the style of everyday clothing. As for
Oscar de la Renta, I don't think he was of the same stature as Cardin considering that his name cannot be readily associated with something like the 'bubble dress' that changed the way of clothing. --
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
18:27, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support blurb He was a transforming figure in his field. Oscar de la Renta was not. I consider Pierre Cardin to be more important than Karl Lagerfeld.
Tradediatalk19:04, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak Support blurb, as someone who is self-admittedly NOT into fashion, this comes across as maybe one of the 5 designers I knew of... like Karl and Oscar de la Renta. Can we put this into RD and then debate blurb?
Albertaont (
talk)
23:03, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support RD only, strongly oppose blurb. He was a fashion designer, not an influential world leader or something like that. His influence may have been significant in fashion, but it's still just the niche of fashion.
1779Days (
talk)
01:08, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Unclear if there's enough sourcing for a full-fledged article on the bubble dress, sadly. All I could find was
[1],
[2], and
[3], and
[4], none of which are especially detailed. Irrelevant for RD/blurb, obviously; just in case anyone was thinking about creating it.
AleatoryPonderings (
???) (
!!!)
04:48, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb – The haute couture fame of the name notwithstanding, Cardin's passing at 98 lacks broad significance. Support RD when article deemed presentable. –
Sca (
talk)
13:40, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment I've filled all the outstanding citation tags or removed unreferenced claims if nothing found. There's a page needed tag, but has other online refs so can probably be removed.
yorkshiresky (
talk)
15:21, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Black Kite, Can you have a look at references starting from #17? i.e. 17 onwards. There is a mismatch and a mouseover does not bring in the reference, nor does clicking on those references do anything. For all practical purposes inaccessible.
Ktin (
talk)
20:37, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The Cn tag is more if you are questioning if it is verifiable. However, the concern here is not that the text isn't true, it's that the text is copied without permission.—
Bagumba (
talk)
05:54, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
Bagumba, Yeah, I posted that before I saw you had tagged with {{copyvio}}. I meant that, once the copyvio is resolved, we should find a source other than "Mid Century Magazine" to verify the claims the relevant text was making (if they are to be reintegrated in non-copyright-violating form).
AleatoryPonderings (
???) (
!!!)
06:02, 1 January 2021 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Two knife-wielding assailants kill a police officer and wound another in
Grozny,
Chechnya. The attackers are shot dead while trying to seize weapons. It is the second attack against police in the city in recent months; in October, two officers were killed by militants.
(Reuters)
Finland reports its first case of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2 from the
United Kingdom, after a person who travelled from
Western Europe tested positive for COVID-19.
(Yle)
A separate, second variant from
South Africa is also reported in Finland, after two people tested positive for COVID-19.
(News 24)
Switzerland reports its first two case of new variant of SARS-CoV-2 from
South Africa after two people tested positive for COVID-19 despite having no clear traveling history to South Africa.
(Business Insider South Africa)
The
United Kingdom reports a record 41,385 new cases in the past 24 hours. It is the first time that the country has reported more than 40,000 cases since the beginning of the pandemic.
(BBC News)
Saudi Arabia extends the suspension of all international
commercial flights, as well as all entry through land and sea ports for another week due to concerns about the new variant of
SARS-CoV-2.
(Gulf News)
South Korea reports its first cases of a more infectious variant of
SARS-CoV-2, after three South Korean nationals who arrived from the
United Kingdom tested positive for COVID-19, including an elderly man who has since died.
(Yonhap News Agency)
PresidentCyril Ramaphosa announces that the
country will move from level 1 to level 3 from midnight until January 15. This means that all alcohol sales are banned, wearing of masks in public places is compulsory, most gatherings other than funerals are banned, and the nationwide curfew will be extended from 9:00 p.m. to 6:00 a.m. local time.
(Bloomberg)
The European Union announces that it is close to reaching an investment deal with
China. The deal would immensely impact the global economy, especially with the
U.S.-China trade war.
(AFP via ABS-CBN News)
Officer Adam Coy, who fatally shot Andre Hill was fired. Coy had failed to follow the required protocol by not turning on his body camera and failed to aid the dying man. Hill's killing was the second police-involved shooting in
Columbus, Ohio in weeks, setting off renewed protests against the authorities for excessive use of force.
(NPR)
A court in
Saudi Arabia sentences
women's rights activist
Loujain al-Hathloul to five years and eight months in prison on grounds of "various activities prohibited by the anti-terrorism law". The verdict comes despite pressure from international organizations to release her.
(DW)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. Currently trying to expand, there's another reliable obituary in The Guardian just out. (There's more detail in Manchester Evening News, but I'm not sure how reliable that is after it split from the Guardian group.) Her other two series might well be notable despite the lack of articles.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
00:50, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Ktin: I was working from the bottom, per recent exhortations as well as past practice. This was marked ready before I commented; I don't track the order of marking as ready, there are better uses of time. I never post anything without reading it carefully and at least spot-checking the sources, which often results in substantive editing and a lot of nitpicking and back & forth. Black Kite posted several while I was working on this one; I don't know why they didn't post yours. Which is it?
Espresso Addict (
talk)
02:48, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: American murderer on death row. There's a couple of dead links that could do with replacing and perhaps some more detail would be beneficial -
Dumelow (
talk)
08:36, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I always find it interesting when looking over the RD page that the average article on a criminal tends to be so much better than that of artists, politicians, businesspeople. Articles on sports people tend to be either one-line sub-stubs or mammoth unsourced musings -
Dumelow (
talk)
11:44, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Influential German composer, trained in the East, but not ready to compromise, so earlier performed in the West, studies at IRCAM in Paris, teacher in the U.S., Israel, South Korea. - The article was there, but practically without inline citations. Created this year, better than only after he died.
Gerda Arendt (
talk)
23:07, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Hi
Ktin, the displaced RD
K. C. Jones had been up for 23 hours which I consider sufficient to not break the guideline. I appreciate people's opinions on this vary and am more than happy if another admin wants to re-add Jones -
Dumelow (
talk)
12:09, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Dumelow, fair enough. I guess I have been greedily hoping for 36 hours (or at least 24 hours). Anyways, onwards and upwards. Thanks for your note and for all that you do.
Ktin (
talk)
12:12, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Internationally renowned Chinese-born pianist; died of COVID-19 today in London. I did some work on the article, and it should be ready to go.
Zingaresetalk ·
contribs04:57, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I find sentences like Noted by The New York Times for his "sensitive ear for color", "elusive gift of melody", and his "impetuous spirit", Fou was one of the first Chinese-born pianists to achieve international fame and A performing and teaching career that took him throughout the world continued, and he was acclaimed not only for his interpretations of Chopin, but many other composers, including Haydn, Mozart concerning. The NYT bit in particular strikes me as undue, and reads rather like album liner notes. There is also the (currently error-flagged) quote, apparently from a primary source, describing him as one of the greatest pianists of our times. In my view, that would have to be backed up by a secondary source to be of appropriate weight. (It is also not especially informative; what makes one a "great" pianist, in context?) I would also like to know what persecuted means in the personal life section, but that's obviously not a promo issue.
AleatoryPonderings (
???) (
!!!)
06:03, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
couldnt disagree more with you.It wasn’t just some random people who said these things; they were music critics from the world’s biggest newspapers. Look at the GA
Radu Lupu for example. Also the quote from Argerich, Fleisher, and Lupu is just their opinion and their declaration. But since they are among the most important musicians of their generation, it’s a very notable thing to include. Also,if you look into it, Fou’s parents faced political persecution by the CCP during the Cultural Revolution , leading them to die by suicide.
Zingaresetalk ·
contribs06:33, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
AleatoryPonderings:@
Espresso Addict: I've attempted to alleviate your concerns; please let me know if this suffices. I still disagree with the view that this article's tone was promotional to begin with, but I will happily compromise, especially if it means not killing this article's chances of being featured in RD.
Zingaresetalk ·
contribs22:59, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article needs updating Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
(Stale) RD: Mahinder Watsa
No consensus for posting, 1 oppose and no support. It is stale by now.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
British Columbia reports their first case of the new variant of SARS-CoV-2 from a man in
Island Health who returned from the
United Kingdom on December 15 and tested positive on December 19.
(CBC)
Quebec reports 6,783 cases and 110 deaths between 24 and 26 December, bringing the total number of cases to 192,655 and deaths to 8,023.
(Toronto Star)
Oman officially begins a
vaccination campaign against COVID-19 using the
Pfizer-
BioNTech vaccine. The country is the last
Gulf Cooperation Council member state to begin vaccinations. Health Minister Ahmed Al-Saidi is one of the first citizens to receive a dose of the vaccine.
(Arab News)
The Supreme Committee decides to reopen Oman's land, sea, and air borders on December 29 after closing them on December 21 due to fears of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2. All travellers must show a negative
PCRtest within 72 hours before entering the
country and must have valid health insurance. In addition, all travellers must quarantine for seven days and take another test after completing their quarantine.
(Hindustan Times)
Austria begins administering the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine tozinameran to its citizens. An 84-year-old woman becomes the first Austrian to be vaccinated against COVID-19 at the
Medical University of Vienna.
(ORF)
Norway reports its first cases of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2, after two people who travelled from the
United Kingdom earlier in December test positive for COVID-19.
(Reuters)
Romania begins a vaccination campaign against COVID-19 using the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine
tozinameran. The first person vaccinated is a 26-year-old doctor from
Bucharest.
(Digi24)
Citizens in
Niger head to the polls to elect their President in their first democratic power transfer since the country's independence from
France. The election comes amidst a growing
Islamistinsurgency as
Mohamed Bazoum is the favourite to succeed incumbent
Mahamadou Issoufou, who is stepping down after serving two five-year terms.
(DW)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The
Israeli military (IDF) carries out several
airstrikes in the
Gaza Strip, in response to overnight rocket attacks in Israel. IDF says it targeted a rocket manufacturing site, underground infrastructure and a military post. Two minor injuries are reported. The attacks caused
power outages in the eastern part of the strip. Hamas claims the strikes damaged a children's hospital, a centre for disabled people, and damaged the windows of several residential buildings. IDF claims that the damage was due to detonations of ground munitions.
(Al Jazeera)(The Times of Israel)
India arrests 75 Kashmiri political leaders and activists for "preventive custody" due to recent violence following local elections.
(Al Jazeera)
Disasters and accidents
Twelve climbers die during avalanches and blizzards on mountains north of
Tehran,
Iran. Fourteen others went missing but are rescued alive.
(The Guardian)
Northern Ireland enters a six-week
lockdown in an effort to reduce the number of
COVID-19 infections. All "non-essential" shops and businesses will be closed, while "essential" shops must close each day by 20:00
GMT during the first week of the lockdown. No gatherings will be allowed between 20:00 and 6:00 each day, and anyone travelling to Northern Ireland must self-isolate for at least 10 days.
(BBC News)
Two men jailed for protesting against
PresidentAlexander Lukashenko say they tested positive for COVID-19, after developing symptoms in jail and not receiving treatment.
(AP)
The
German state of
Saxony-Anhalt begins a
vaccination campaign against
COVID-19, which also began nationwide. A 101-year-old woman in a nursing home become one of first people in the country to get vaccinated.
(DW)
Hungary begins a vaccination campaign against COVID-19 using the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine
tozinameran. The first vaccinations are being delivered at two
hospitals in
Budapest.
(Reuters)
Ontario reports its first two cases of a new SARS-COV-2 variant in a couple from
Durham Region with no known travel history, exposure, or high-risk contacts. Ontario is the first province in Canada to identify a case of this new variant.
(CBC)
Tokyo reports a record 949 new cases in the past 24 hours, bringing the total number of confirmed cases in the prefecture to 55,851.
(The Japan Times)
The
Japanese Foreign Ministry will ban non-resident foreign nationals from entering
Japan from December 28 until the end of January after several cases of
a more infectious variant of SARS-CoV-2 were reported in the country. Japanese citizens and foreign residents will be required to self-quarantine for 14 days when they enter the country.
(CNN)
Iran extends a nighttime traffic
curfew that runs from 9:00 p.m. to 4:00 a.m. local time to 330 lower-risk "yellow" cities in an effort to sustain a recent decrease in the numbers of new cases and deaths.
(Hindustan Times)
Federal investigators identify a person of interest in yesterday's bombing in downtown
Nashville, Tennessee, and join local police in raiding his home.
(AP)
Authorities announce that they suspect the incident was a suicide bombing, following the discovery of human remains at the blast site.
(CNN)
A statue of
Breonna Taylor, a black woman killed by police during a raid at her home in March 2020, has been smashed and destroyed during a racist assault. The statue was erected two weeks ago in
Oakland,
California.
(BBC News)
Four men are seriously injured in a
mass shooting in
Kreuzberg,
Berlin. The city's attorney said that rival gangs may have been responsible for the shooting.
(BBC News)
Three people are killed, and three others are injured, during a
mass shooting at a bowling alley in
Rockford, Illinois. Police believe the suspect, in custody, identified as a
soldier from
Florida, randomly selected his victims.
(Al Jazeera)
The
government sets June 5 as the date for the 2021 parliamentary elections. The elections were delayed to 2021 in response to the
COVID-19 pandemic with the delay being a cause of the ongoing
Tigray conflict.
(Reuters)
The
Cleveland Browns announce that they will close their facility and delay their flight to
New Jersey for an upcoming matchup with the
New York Jets after a player on the team tested positive for COVID-19.
(Reuters)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Indian-born English and South-African cricketer. Much loved for his commentary. Article was in a very good condition. Needs sourcing across the board, which I will work on in the next couple of hours. Sourcing is complete. Did not have to do any content edits. If someone wants any other edits incorporated, please let me know. RIP. Thanks for all the memories. Ktin
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Support sourcing looks good thanks to Muboshgu's efforts. The fourteen navboxes at the bottom are silly, but not a reason to oppose this.
power~enwiki (
π,
ν)
21:21, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
And it's gone already. Who cares if it's a very good article that won 8-0,
Karima Baloch, who wasn't even notable in life, needs her week for one Support vote. I knew the wrestling curse wasn't over, never getting fooled again.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
02:08, 28 December 2020 (UTC)reply
InedibleHulk, no need to speak ill about someone, particularly folks who are no longer here. That said, your larger point is valid. This new mode of posting will NOT work when inflow (new RDs) and outflow (posts onto homepage) are not roughly synchronized (rate of inflow is equal to the rate of outflow), unless Admins and Editors work the articles from the bottom of the stack.
I'm not speaking ill. As a human, I feel for her survivors. But as a historical figure, our editors only noticed her death, it is what it is. Anyway, I featured him on my Talk Page. Never getting stale there, rubes!
InedibleHulk (
talk)
03:22, 28 December 2020 (UTC)reply
And it is in extraordinarily poor taste to accuse other posters of 'dancing on someone's grave' when they have done nothing of the kind. Please do not assume bad faith.
Effy Midwinter (
talk)
18:37, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Thanks for noticing. To be clearer, I have no feelings for or against Baloch or her work, never heard of either before this. But the article objectively has less information, had way fewer editors working on it for a much briefer time and got less support here than Huber's life story, which is six days more recently in the news.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
02:56, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I just had the same thing happen with
Shamsur Rahman Faruqi and
Sugathakumari. Good on
User:Espresso Addict for restoring the former. Maybe given the huge backlog, Admins restore RDs until
Brodie Lee and spill over into the third line which imo is not a big deal particularly because we have a reduced set of news blurbs currently.
I doubt there's consensus for more than 7 items. Personally I'd nuke all the stale news (which is arguably all of it) and fill with RDs imitating the German "Kürzlich Verstorbene" system, but I know I won't get consensus for that. (Probably best to take this to the talk page?)
Espresso Addict (
talk)
03:22, 28 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, thanks. Just took it to the talkpage. My vote is to temporarily restore all RDs until
Brodie Lee and spill over into three lines. There is sufficient space and we have some space created by the news blurbs which are down to 3 currently. Thanks.
Ktin (
talk)
03:36, 28 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Indonesia reports a record 258 deaths and 6,324 recoveries in the past 24 hours, bringing the nationwide totals to 20,847 deaths and 570,304 recoveries.
(CNN Indonesia)
France reports their first case of the new variant of SARS-CoV-2 in a French citizen who travelled from
London to
Tours, France on December 19.
(Sky News)
Rospotrebnadzor orders a 14-day quarantine for anyone who travels from the United Kingdom, with the exception of aircraft crew members, beginning tomorrow due to the spread of a more contagious variant of SARS-CoV-2.
(The Moscow Times)
The explosion also results in
AT&T service outages across the U.S. due to infrastructure damage to a service facility located near the blast site. Cellular, wireline telephone, Internet, and
U-verse television service, as well as multiple local
9-1-1 and non-emergency phone networks, are among the services affected.
(WKRN-TV)(The Tennessean)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. Shaping up well, but not ready yet, imo. There needs to be more chronological detail; where was she between 1985 and her death, for example? ""ABC Art", her influential 1965 essay, outlined the main philosophical currents of minimalism." isn't really sourced; the article discusses what was in the essay, but not what/how/who it influenced (and what does "philosophical currents" even mean?) There are too many journal/other writing publications; this should be slimmed to the most influential. The filmography comes out of nowhere... her film making is mentioned in the lead but nowhere described. The lead needs filling out.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
00:09, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Such (am I allowed flowery?) language is only ever permissible in the mouth of a expert, as a direct quotation. Apologies for offending you, I'd assumed it was in the article before expansion. I can't readily trim the pubs as I am not an expert in American 20th-century art history criticism. Google Scholar citations suggest that three of her books, "ABC art" plus an essay on Orlan that isn't listed get significant citations. I doubt I'd be popular if I slimmed it to that...
Espresso Addict (
talk)
01:12, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I've slashed the non-books; let's see if it sticks. I usually include all (co-)authored books and all edited books that don't look ephemeral (conference proceedings), but I mainly work on scientists and I know non-science fields often publish more by book/monograph than journal.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
01:57, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. The tone is rather informal, is all the detail necessary? At minimum needs sources for a couple of paragraphs. Could do with a proper publications section. I do like the Vatican Radio programme :)
Espresso Addict (
talk)
02:42, 28 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The going requirement at ITN for citations for the mere existence of a book (not its awards) strikes me as overkill, especially when {{authority control}} exists. I'll try to find some, but really—the existence of a book, which can be quickly verified by the simplest of Google searches, is not something that requires {{cn}}.
AleatoryPonderings (
???) (
!!!)
17:04, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Posting-Admins, please consider expanding the carousel count to 7 when posting this article on
WP:ITNRD the article that will be popping off has been there for ~7 hours.
Ktin (
talk)
18:16, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Stephen, and, we could not handle the above request of leaving the carousel at 7 for a bit? Disappointing. This model will not work if we do not work the postings from the bottom of the stack, particularly when the postings as well as the inflow is 'bursty'.
Ktin (
talk)
02:51, 28 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Indian Urdu poet.
Padma Shri awardee. Article can do with a good amount of edits. I will work in it later tonight. Edits and article expansion done. Solid C-class biography. Meets hygiene requirements for homepage / RD.
Ktin (
talk)
02:37, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
There's an explanation of COD in the source you added. So you're admitting that you didn't bother to read it? See my comment below about formatting puffery, yet another example of the fraud committed around here in the name of "article quality".
RadioKAOS /
Talk to me, Billy /
Transmissions 06:42, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
RadioKAOS, The source I added specifically states "While the cause of death isn't known yet"! Yes I did read it or I wouldn't have asked for further explanations. Please don't accuse other editors of fraud!
JW 1961Talk17:59, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
RadioKAOS, I agree with JW's statement above. Perhaps not my place to be saying, but, please be polite to your fellow editors. I would also recommend that you apologize to JW on their talk page.
Ktin (
talk)
18:12, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose As usual, folks appear to be judging this solely on account of formatting puffery. As a biography, it's quite incomplete and chronologically all over the place. It reads like a semi-random collection of facts which just happen to be backed by sources.
RadioKAOS /
Talk to me, Billy /
Transmissions 06:42, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Just passing through. 1972-73 was his season coaching in the
American Basketball Association, so that’s a different league from the rest of the table. I guess it wouldn’t hurt to include that season, too. It depends on how that section is defined in the article. Sites like basketball-reference offer combined NBA/ABA stats as well as stats for each league.
Zagalejo^^^00:08, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: The Club Kid Killer.
UncomfortablySmug (talk) 6:40, 25 December 2020 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Support and reopened. There is an article and there is clearly at least one death so far. While it might not reach consensus, to
WP:SNOW is pre-mature. Also at this point the oppose is also based on assertions which have changed.
Albertaont (
talk)
23:54, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Strong oppose. The only reason this is in the news is because it happened in the US. Had this happened in say, Germany, everyone would have ignored it. Only 3 people were injured, and to the best of our knowledge, there are no confirmed fatalities so far. This is not important on an international scale, and should be put under
WP:SNOW.
The Image Editor (
talk)
00:38, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
We have had a lively debate on ITN when similar attacks happened in France and Austria a few months ago, I dont recall what the final outcome was, but to say "Had this happened in say, Germany, everyone would have ignored it." is not correct if we just look back at ITN.
Albertaont (
talk)
02:44, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Those discussions ended in no consensus, and were not posted. That gives even more reason for this to NOT post this onto ITN. I will admit, that the Germany comparison was in bad faith, but I still think that this doesn’t even approach the threshold of international news. If this somehow gets posted, I would argue that it would dramatically lower the standard of what is ITN worthy. But then again, who am I to judge.
The Image Editor (
talk)
02:51, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose This is still being considered as a domestic situation, and there is at most one possible death, typically far lower than what we would post. --
Masem (
t)
04:03, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose We don't have enough information currently to judge the significance of the attack and so far it seems like a small-scale incident. Plus, if we were to post this, then we would be setting the bar too low for these types of events
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
05:39, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Wait until we know if people were killed & if it was a bombing by a terrorist group. If it was a
lone-wolf attack in which there were no deaths or only one, it's not important enough for ITN.
Jim Michael (
talk)
13:07, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Wait – Puzzling & mysterious, thus interesting, but lacking in general significance – though that could change if the investigation uncovers evidence of terrorism. –
Sca (
talk)
14:03, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support: Is it in the news? Yes, globally (per links posted above). Are readers interested in it? Yes: nearly 80,000 page views on day 1 of the article
[8]. Is the article of sufficient quality? Yes. Therefore: post it. It doesn't matter what country it happened in. BTW, the significance is in the mysteriousness of the incident, the size of the bomb, and the widespread AT&T telecom outage, which is now in its second day. I would suggest maybe an alternate blurb like "A vehicle explosion in downtown Nashville, Tennessee results in three injuries and widespread damage and outages."
Levivichharass/hound04:06, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
It does matter where it happened. This is the US, and I apologize to the rest of the world but we're basically idiots here when it comes to gun ownership and stuff like this. This is stuff that happens far too frequently here that, unless we're taking major death and destruction, we skip over these topics because they are "routine" for the US. Now, sure , maybe there's something in the investigation thta proves out something far more sinister than what currently seems as a typical US whack job to prove worthwhile to post, but this isn't anything damaging like the Boston Marathon bombings. --
Masem (
t)
06:43, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
There is nothing routine about this RV full of explosives that detonated in downtown Nashville after blaring a siren and audio warning to evacuate the area. The US hasn't had a vehicle bomb attack like this in ... I don't remember the last one. There is nothing routine about grounded flights, 911 being down, mobile phones, and landlines being down, in a three-state area, for two days. The US hasn't had an outage like that in ... even the California wildfires didn't produce outages of that scale; I don't remember the last time all communications were down in such a large area. An attack doesn't have to be the Boston Marathon bombings--the second-worst terrorist attack in US history, probably--in order to be worthy of ITN. And honestly, editors' subjective personal opinions about the importance of the event should not matter at all; 80,000 readers are interested, but a dozen Wikipedia editors think it's routine, so we don't list it? How does that make sense? The only things that should matter are: (1) Do readers want the information? (2) Do we have the information?
Levivichharass/hound07:13, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
This is only of trivial interest because it happened in the US. It has no long-term impact, it is of extremely limited notability, and is only making news because besides Covid, there's nothing else for the US press to get on top of, since Trump has at last become a boring sideshow. This is almost unencyclopedic.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
08:24, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
To add, the latest story on this is that the person of interest, believed to be the person that died in the incident, had paranoia over 5G (not unlike what we've already seen previously in the UK with 5G towers being burned down) and may have specifically targetted the local AT&T building because of that paranoia, and not so much as a "act of terrorism".
[9] Making this even less of an appropriate story to post here. --
Masem (
t)
16:02, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose If my memory of unprecedented developing crimes serves me faithfully (and I've seen dozens), our editors can't handle the information! Not just kidding, either. Wikipedia is historically inaccurate (often prejudicially so) while investigations continue.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
08:11, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose there's lots of facets to this particular posting debate that have already been hashed out above, and in my view, the mysteriousness doesn't add to notability here. It's not an impactful mystery like missing people or backwards trials, it's "why did a bomb go off with nobody around", and the confusion over who and what and why in this case makes it less (not more) notable. We don't know what's happening, we don't know what the blurb really should be to be accurate. If the AT&T outages last any longer, because 911 is still down the last I heard, then we could consider posting that: "large parts of Tennessee and Kentucky are without cellular power or 911 access after bla bla bla" is an unusual and newsworthy blurb with widespread human impact.
Kingsif (
talk)
09:38, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Post-close comment: Half a million page views in the first six days of this article's existence, but ITNC !voters know better what's of interest to readers? This is another example of ITNC participants, en masse, putting their own personal, subjective views about what is or is not "important" above what is of interest to readers. This article is of more interest to our readers than everything else on ITN right now combined.
Levivichharass/hound19:01, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Metekel massacre
Article:Metekel massacre (
talk·history·tag) Blurb: The Ethiopian National Defense Force clashes with armed bandits involved in Metekel massacre, killing 42 of them and seizing weapons. (
Post) Alternative blurb: The Ethiopian National Defense Force responds to the Metekel massacre of 100 people by killing 42 suspects and arresting seven officials. Alternative blurb II: The Metekel massacre of 100 people continues a sporadic cycle of massacres in the
Metekel conflict in Ethiopia ongoing since 2019. News source(s):Al Arabiya English Credits:
Oppose on quality way too many red links,plus a cn tag. Weak oppose otherwise, the death toll is pretty high, but the Tigray conflict is already in the ongoing section and if the massacre is part of the conflict,then I don't think a separate blurb is needed Scaramouche33 (
talk)
12:02, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support, but the blurb needs to be changed. The massacre, with a death toll of around 100, is significantly more important than the army's response.
Jim Michael (
talk)
12:09, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Agree on changing the blurb. I've proposed an Alternative blurb above. The federal army's response is significant. We (sources on en.Wikipedia articles) have absolutely no information so far as to whether the 42 killings by the ENDF were necessary defence or
extrajudicial executions (revenge). There are
strongly opposing media narratives in the Ethiopian situation right now so including "both" sides is the most NPOV.
Boud (
talk)
00:45, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment The much bigger massacre earlier did not go through mostly on the grounds of poor article quality and the main topic already being in ongoing. Seeing similar issues in here as well especially with the article as a barebones stub.
Gotitbro (
talk)
12:44, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
That's part of the Tigray conflict & happened several weeks earlier in a different
region of Ethiopia. The Tigray conflict being in ongoing isn't relevant to this nomination, because the Metekel conflict has never been in ongoing.
Jim Michael (
talk)
15:34, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support It's a large-scale massacre and the current version of
Metekel massacre is sufficiently developed to encourage new editors to contribute. Warning: as attention to the article grows, it's very likely to be (temporarily) vandalised or POVed, based on the last few weeks' experience with
Tigray conflict and
Mai Kadra massacre. Several editors (mostly IPs, but not only), are absolutely sure that the perpetrators are X and the victims are Y (or vice versa) and anything that is nuanced and matches sources is false news written by naive editors. See
this Ethiopian media analysis for a likely explanation.
Boud (
talk)
00:45, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
That's an argument against the original blurb, not against the posting of the article. An alternative blurb is listed. There's an empty spot for altblurb2.
Boud (
talk)
01:38, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
There was already one alternative blurb, but since the reaction of the authorities is considered less important than the massacre itself, I've proposed ALT II above, which is The Metekel massacre of 100 people continues a sporadic cycle of massacres in the
Metekel conflict in Ethiopia ongoing since 2019. While I think that the authorities killing 42 suspects is significant, we have no info on whether this was a minimal use of force or extrajudicial executions, or a mix of the two, and the broader context - an ongoing armed conflict in this
zone - seems more relevant for the blurb.
Boud (
talk)
11:19, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
At least 20 African
migrants die when their boat sinks off the coast of
Tunisia as they tried to cross the
Mediterranean Sea to the
Italian island of
Lampedusa. The
coast guard confirmed they had rescued people and were searching for others who were on the boat, which was carrying a total of 45 people.
(Reuters)
Indonesia issues a ban on travellers from the United Kingdom and restricts entry to people from mainland
Europe and
Australia to prevent the spread of the new variant of SARS-CoV-2. COVID-19 Task Force Chief
Doni Monardo says that these measures will remain in place until January 8.
(Reuters)
Germany reports the first case of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2 from the United Kingdom after a woman who flew from
London to
Frankfurt this weekend tested positive for COVID-19.
(DW)
Russia reports a record 29,935 new cases and 635
deaths in the past 24 hours, thus bringing the nationwide totals to 2,963,688 confirmed cases and 53,096 deaths.
(Arab News)
Turkey announces that
CoronaVac is 91.25% effective in preventing COVID-19 based on data in interim studies. These initial results follow Phase III trials that involved 7,371 volunteers.
(Daily Sabah)
A 37-year-old man is
charged with
murder and
hate crimes in
Los Angeles,
California, U.S., after killing a 82-year-old man in a hospital room for praying. Both men were in the hospital after testing positive for COVID-19.
(BBC News)
The
President of Burundi,
Évariste Ndayishimiye, pardons four journalists jailed since 2019 for offences related to "undermining state security" following a petition by human rights groups and the journalists themselves.
(Reuters)
Article needs updating Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Statements have been made by all the major parties. There will be lots of relief at getting this done by Christmas. I've added a suitable picture of lorries at Dover but no doubt there are other possibilities.
Andrew🐉(
talk)
16:07, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Documents such as
this EU draft of 440 pages indicate that the details cover hundreds of pages, as one would expect. We can't expect to cover the fine print and the minutiae of ratification and implementation. The key point that is all over the news now is that the deal has been agreed at last.
Andrew🐉(
talk)
16:23, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Of course not, but we do reasonably expect some degree of high-level agreement points, stuff that I expect that the BBC and other good sources will have summarized in the next few hours. (this is similar to how we have summarizies of the key points of the massive spending bill in the US Congress in the press some hours after it was first published). We can wait for WP to be updated with that. --
Masem (
t)
16:58, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I don't recall asking for "fine print and minutiae", but when I looked at the article, it said (unreferenced) "a deal had been agreed", but gave no insight whatsoever as to the nature of the deal. Hardly encyclopedic, is it?
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
19:29, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I've been watching the news coverage and it seems clear that there will be over a thousand pages of dense legal text which will be gone through now by teams of lawyers, lobbyists and politicians. They will then give their various opinions and
Laura Kuenssberg just said that "a tally of the wins and losses may take years to settle". For example, while we've heard a lot about fish, it turns out that chips are big deal for some too. Or is that really just
small potatoes? Anyway, the part which I enjoyed most was
Larry'sferocious rush at a deal of his own!
Andrew🐉(
talk)
20:18, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose only that we should have details of what has been agreed to in the deal at this point in the article, as per the sources, this isn't the end stage and more negotiations are still to come on less critical matters, but this prevents pending severe issues that were to have occurred if no deal at all had been reached by 1 Jan. --
Masem (
t)
16:14, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
It's best to wait until the specifics about the trade deal are released to the public so that the article can be properly updated. However, I think creating a separate article would be better Scaramouche33 (
talk)
17:11, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Guys, if the last four years of news have taught us anything, it's that an agreement isn't final until it's final. No one has a damn clue what this deal means yet. Can we not wait until we at least get said clue? WaltCip-(
talk)22:40, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment I also find the proposed image highly unsuitable; the recent traffic jams are due to corona restrictions and have nothing to do with this article.
Yakikaki (
talk)
22:43, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
That's not true. There were massive queues before the borders were closed down as hauliers rushed to get jobs done before a potential no-deal Brexit scuppered things. But the image is not appropriate because it conflates two separate stories.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
22:45, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support in principle, this is a huge deal in terms of scope and absolute numbers. I don't feel it appropriate to wait for formal ratification in this instance since it it expected to be put into operation on a provisional basis ahead of that. OTOH the text of the deal has not yet been released, all we have now are some headline summaries of some key issues. In the absence of actual details just yet I can't see how a true substantive update can be made, there are bound to be controversies that emerge once to text is in the public domain.
3142 (
talk)
00:17, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Summary versions of the deal are online
here and
here and these seem to be the main primary sources for press analysis and comment so far. As we're locked down, I may spend some time today looking through them but, right now, I'm going out for some exercise. Brr...
Andrew🐉(
talk)
07:40, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support – in principle, pending expansion of article (by homebound Brits?). Coverage abundant, significance obvious. Alas, the fact that today is Christmas may retard editorial progress. Cheers! –
Sca (
talk)
14:01, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support I don't see why this isn't obviously ITN material. It's in the news, it was in the news before it happened and will be in the news for some time longer.
Banedon (
talk)
11:09, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Because the update comprises "On 24 December, the parties announced that a deal had been reached.[81]" and the article still says "This section summarises the sides' statements of their respective positions at the beginning of negotiations. It may be that these will change in a final agreement (if concluded)." so supporting an article that is clearly inadequately updated is the reason why this obviously isn't ITN material at this time.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
11:28, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
For example,
BBC has a quick summary points that would be an excellent way to start off a section to get it ready to be posted without having to read any of the actual trade deal itself or engage in OR of what's important. Took 2 minutes to find that when looking. --
Masem (
t)
14:22, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Brexitapathy. I don't think most of us really care, it's a deal which won't suit a single person, so no-one can be arsed to actually even bother to update the article. But there you go, it still gets support despite that. Perhaps ITN is even more borked than we all think.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
14:29, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Update Many news sources report that the full text has been published now but few of them provide a link. But I've chased that down and here's the
relevant page at the European Commission. I find that we have
a page specifically for the agreement and editors have been busy updating that today. I have accordingly updated the nomination, expanding the blurb to link to the agreement as the highlighted article.
Andrew🐉(
talk)
19:05, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
It needs ratifying by the EU nations and the U.K Parliament, the EU are meeting to agree a provisional application so that it can come into force on 1st January which will happen in the EU Parliament on 31st December and the U.K parliament are meeting to vote on implementing the agreement on the 30 December.
Support — It's in the news, the article is of sufficient quality, and while it doesn't get any pageviews, that's because it's new and barely linked. However, the spike in pageviews of
Brexit[10] demonstrates reader interest. So, it fulfills ITN's purposes. Post it.
Levivichharass/hound04:16, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
It doesn't fulfil ITN's purpose of providing information readers will be looking for, i.e. it just says a deal has been done. Even the more specific article just highlights which topics were covered in the agreement, but fundamentally not how each of those topics were resolved and agreed upon which is precisely the information readers want to read. That "a deal has been done" is all very well, but as an encyclopedia, we should be capable of summarising the key aspects of the deal (the EU managed to do that within a couple of hours of the agreement). In other words: no-one is looking to Wikipedia to see if a deal has been done, we all know that. We want to know what the deal means.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
08:57, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
(This is moot now as it's been posted, but I only noticed this reply today.) I think readers will hear about the Brexit deal in the news, and then go to Wikipedia not to learn about the deal, but to learn about Brexit. The latest information about the deal is provided by the media. The background information is where Wikipedia is extremely useful. The article about the deal provides background info on the deal (as does the Brexit article). And the uptick in Brexit pageviews supports this theory that readers hear about something in the news and then come to Wikipedia for the background information.
Levivichharass/hound04:07, 31 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment It's great that an actual article was made for the agreement, however, currently the article only mentions areas covered by the agreement. I'm assuming that our readers will mostly be interested in the specifics. So a basic overview for each area would be a nice edition. But the document itself is 1200 pages!! Doesn't any news outlet actually talk about the specifics of the agreement so that editors can use them instead?
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
07:02, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Be careful what you wish for. Once you get into the weeds of the detail, you find that there is indeed hundreds of pages of it. I took a look at the fisheries detail, for example. The press and politicians talk of a headline figure of 25% but that doesn't seem to appear in the document or its annexes. Instead, you have a huge table of quotas by species and year. So, for example, the quota for the
Blue Shark goes 99.9% to the EU. Why does the UK get only 0.1% and how was that figure arrived at? It's not clear. What about other sharks like the
Great White Shark? Are they included in the category "Deep-sea sharks" which goes 100% to the EU? It's not clear. What about whales? It doesn't say. What about
scallops, which actually caused a minor
war in 2012? It doesn't say. My impression is that it's mostly business as usual with a new fudge factor being added to the spreadsheet that is used by the bureaucrats that try to control the quotas. That's the main take-home message – that there won't be a massive no-deal shock to the system on January 1 – just lots of fiddly adjustments.
Andrew🐉(
talk)
10:36, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
No, the EU released a three-page summary of changes a few days ago, it was quite straight forward, however no-one can be bothered to update even the new article to reflect this. Frankly the article as it stands is not helpful at all as all we know is "a deal was done" and it covered "a lot of things" but we have absolutely no idea of the impact of the agreement on those "lots of things". All we have is "Brexit deal was done" and that's not helpful to any of our readers.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
11:06, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Yousuf Rasheed,
CEO of the Free and Fair Election Forum of
Afghanistan, is killed by unknown gunmen in
Kabul. His driver is also shot and later died of his wounds. It is the latest
targeted killing of a prominent Afghan figure.
(TOLO News)
Lufthansa ships 80 tonnes of fresh food to the
United Kingdom to prevent shortages amid fears that the lifting of the
Frenchblockade of the
France–UK border will not prevent shortages in some supermarkets. The airline says "additional special cargo flights" are planned to meet demand. Thousands of trucks remain outside of
Dover.
(The Guardian)
Karnataka imposes a night
curfew from 10:00 p.m. to 6:00 a.m.
IST until January 2 due to fears of a mutant version of
SARS-CoV-2 that was found in the United Kingdom. It becomes the second
Indian state to do so after
Maharashtra.
(NDTV)
The number of recovered patients in
Indonesia increases by a record 5,981 in the past 24 hours, bringing the nationwide total of recovered patients to 558,703.
(detikNews)
Japan bans the entry of non-Japanese citizens from the United Kingdom beginning tomorrow, following the emergence of a more infectious strain of SARS-CoV-2.
(The Straits Times)
Singapore reports the first case of a mutated variant of SARS-CoV-2 from the United Kingdom when 17-year-old girl who had studied in the United Kingdom tested positive for COVID-19.
(The Straits Times)
The
United Kingdom reports a record 39,237 new cases in the past 24 hours. In addition, the country also reports 744 deaths, the highest single-day total since April 29.
(ITV)
The
government announces that the
Czech Republic will be moving to the highest level of PES measures beginning on December 27. This means that all non-essential shops will be closed and a curfew between 9:00 p.m. to 5:00 a.m. local time on Sunday will be enforced. There will also be no exceptions on
New Year's Eve.
(Expats.cz)
Stranded lorry drivers clash with police in
Kent, England, amid frustrations over ongoing delays at the border with France. At least one person has been arrested for obstructing a highway, according to the
police.
(The Guardian)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: American lawyer. Death announced on this day. Article has shaped to a solid C-class biography. Appreciate eyes on the article before it goes stale.
Ktin (
talk)
18:12, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Folks, pardon the multiple notifications on this one. Can I request a pair of eyes on this one? The article has a very limited runway before it goes stale. Thanks.
Ktin (
talk)
22:12, 29 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Checking again to see if someone might be interested in giving this article a look. Getting late here, but, can be around for a bit in case any edits are needed. Else, this is good to go imo.
Ktin (
talk)
05:27, 30 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Support. Looks good to me; I just added a {{cn}} to one paragraph without citations, but none of it's controversial so I'm not too worried. Would be nice to have a bit more critical commentary on her performances, but that's not going to prevent me from supporting this.
AleatoryPonderings (
???) (
!!!)
21:16, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article:COVID-19 pandemic (
talk·history·tag) Blurb: South African
COVID strain causing severe illness in young people has spread to Britain (
Post) News source(s):BBC Credits:
Snow close on so many levels: (i) we already have COVID in the infobox, (ii) the evidence in anecdotal and (iii) its migration to the UK is not particularly important to the rest of the world. —Brigade Piron (
talk)
20:25, 23 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Strong support on notability, Strong oppose on quality. While this is a rare occurrence and normally would be ITN worthy, the article in question has 57 words and only two references. The article is a stub if I’ve ever seen one and honestly, I don’t see it getting up to scratch.
The Image Editor (
talk)
16:57, 23 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment struck, apparently not as rare as I thought. Have requested expert assistance at the relevant WP. Often a nomination leads to improvement in article quality.
Mjroots (
talk)
17:24, 23 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Minerals, unlike elements, are a dime a dozen (see
Category:Minerals by element for example). Small variations in chemical make up and crystalline structure are sufficient for a "new" mineral, where as elements are very limited to what allowable organization of protons, neutrals and electrons can be sustained/stable for at least a few seconds. --
Masem (
t)
17:31, 23 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose, per Masem. We did not report the equally publicized discovery of
Petrovite in Russia last month (
1) and do not even have an article for it. It's worth noting that the Commission on New Minerals and Mineral Names approved
121 new minerals in 2015 alone. Literally the only ITN claim here would be based on the fact that British geology is better studied than most. —Brigade Piron (
talk)
18:49, 23 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Support. I went in and filled the CN tags and removed the yellow boxes. If folks see any other missing ref / citation, let me know and I will have this covered later tonight. Trimmed the awards in the infobox. This is good to go to homepage / RD.
Ktin (
talk)
01:24, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Not checked the sourcing but on a quick glance the tone needs work in places (esp. her death, the Abhaya material) and it's not been updated for tense throughout. The details on her notable relatives could do with pruning a bit. The awards in the infobox need pruning to the most important. Need to go offline now but will try to work on this later.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
02:39, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I've hacked at some of this. The lead needs to discuss her writing (which I assume is her primary source of notability?) The awards still appear all over the place and need rationalising, with only the most notable in the lead and infobox. Dates for the works that don't have them would be useful. I've requested a source, but still not done any sources check.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
07:54, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Four prison doctors are killed after a magnetic bomb attached to their vehicle exploded in
Kabul. A civilian passerby also died in the attack. The bombing follows a series of recent
assassination attempts and
targeted killings of prominent Afghan figures.
(Channel NewsAsia)
PresidentDonald Trump says that he might not sign the
$900 billion relief bill, which was passed by both the
House and
Senate. He also calls for
Congress to amend the bill and increase stimulus checks to Americans earning under $75,000 per year from $600 to $2,000. House Speaker
Nancy Pelosi agrees to work with Congress to increase the payout amount.
(The Washington Post)(BBC News)(WFLA-TV)
Overall deaths in the U.S. for this year are projected to surpass three million mainly due to the COVID-19 pandemic, thus making 2020 the deadliest year in U.S. history. The numbers also represent an approximate 15 percent increase compared to the previous year, which is the largest single-year percentage increase since 1918.
(AP)
Singapore bans all long-term passport holders and short-term visitors who had travel history to the
United Kingdom within the last 14 days to enter the country beginning tomorrow at 11:59 p.m. local time due to the emergence of a new strain of SARS-CoV-2.
(The Straits Times)
Sri Lanka's
Civil Aviation Authority bans all flights to and from the United Kingdom beginning on December 23 to prevent a new strain of SARS-CoV-2 from spreading to the country.
(Ada Derana)
France agrees to reopen its border with the
United Kingdom after it was closed for 48 hours due to the spread of a new variant of the virus in
England. Planes, boats, and
Eurostar trains will resume services tomorrow but only British, French, and
EU citizens or residents who show a negative COVID-19 test result from the previous 72 hours will be allowed to travel until January 6.
(BBC News)
The
United Kingdom reports a record 36,804 new cases in the past 24 hours. In addition, the country also reports 691 new deaths, the highest daily total in nearly a month.
(Sky News)
Fiji announces it will close its borders from Thursday until next Monday to review border quarantine processes after a new variant of the virus was found in the
United Kingdom.
(RNZ)
The appeals court of the
Cayman Islands reduces the prison sentence of
Georgia teenager Skylar Mack from 4 months to 2 months. Mack was arrested on November 29 for breaching quarantine rules.
(CBS News)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Weak support. It's sort of unclear to me what her activism is about—and since that's what she was notable for, it seems not that helpful to post an RD about her without identifying the nature of her work? Was she only/primarily an advocate for the independence of
Balochistan? Or is there something else I'm missing? If that's clarified, I would move to a full-throated support.
AleatoryPonderings (
???) (
!!!)
17:31, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Pretty much a stub at the moment, limited biographical detail aside from the death. I note it was created from a redirect with news of her death, and has been changing rapidly.Espresso Addict (
talk)
06:18, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Looks much improved, though I am still not seeing a source for the birth year. We have a storm and my internet is going in and out so I haven't succeeded in checking the new sources; I have marked it as needing attention.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
21:58, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The problem with the birth date is that, as I recall, Guardian and other sources give her age at death as 37, which conflicts. I don't think this should hold the article up, though -- I'm more concerned about the, to my mind, unencyclopedic speculation over her cause of death.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
01:48, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, I have reduced the speculation and tried to increase the encyclopedic tone of the section in consideration. (More copyediting can be done if needed.) I have no issues with her birth date; if there is any confusion it can be left vacant.
DTM (
talk)
02:53, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Textile design artist. I will work on the article later tonight unless someone wants to get to it before me.
Ktin (
talk)
02:37, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Not checked in detail but one problem with this is the dependence on the LongHouse site (currently Ref 3), which appears to be Larsen's personal site, and is decidedly promotional. The lead needs expanding, and there's no personal life (spouse, children?).
Espresso Addict (
talk)
07:01, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, Sorry, are you working on these edits? Looking at the content, nothing egregious there that should prevent this article to go to homepage / RD. If you are working on the edits, we can continue to wait, but, if no one is working on edits, this is good to go to homepage / RD as it stands.
Ktin (
talk)
02:30, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
No, not working on this at the moment. Given the number of RD candidates, my long-term strategy here is to point out flaws and hope that others fix them. Beyond minor copy edits, I only work on articles where I have sources easily available (usually Brits), where I generally edit in the area (scientists, writers, classical musicians), or where the notability is high and posting would increase ITN's diversity (basically everything except white male Anglophones). Other admins should feel free to make their own assessments.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
02:42, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, sounds good. I did not mean to imply that you should work on all article improvements. I am happy to lend a hand as well. However, having this one wait to go to homepage / RD pending personal life (spouse, children) etc. is harsh. Imo, this is good to go as it stands.
Ktin (
talk)
02:57, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
No worries. I'll take another look at this when I've been through
Minoru Makihara. My primary concern on this one was the reliance on the biased LongHouse site source, and also the micro-lead, not the lack of personal life.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
03:11, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Folks, I request a second opinion on this article. I have made the necessary updates and there is no reason to hold this article back from homepage / RD.
Ktin (
talk)
17:14, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. There's a source needed for her place of birth, which seems disputed (I've seen Scotland and Chatsworth) and feeds into her nationality (British vs Scottish). It would be nice if someone could crop the image. Otherwise, looking surprisingly ok.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
05:54, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. Dates for education would be nice. The lead needs expanding. Information on his life after retirement and his personal life (spouse, children?) would be useful.
Dumelow, can you read Arabic enough to confirm at least the fact of the death?
Espresso Addict (
talk)
06:05, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Rahmatullah Nikzad, head of the journalists’ union in
Ghazni, dies after being shot three times in the chest by unknown assailants. Nikazd is the fifth journalist to have been killed in Afghanistan in the last two months, and the seventh this year.
(Voice of America)
The
Kīlaueavolcano on
Hawaii erupts, prompting the Hawaii County Civil Defense Agency to urge residents to stay indoors. The eruption followed a series of small
earthquakes. A previous eruption in
May 2018 destroyed hundreds of homes.
(CNN)
Illinois reports 4,699 cases in the last 24 hours, the first time that the state has reported less than 6,000 cases and the lowest daily total since October 27.
(WBBM-TV)
Russia announces the suspension of all flights to and from the United Kingdom for one week beginning at midnight due to the new variant of SARS-CoV-2.
(The Moscow Times)
The
Spanish government announce the suspension of all flights from
Spain to the United Kingdom beginning tomorrow, with the exception of flights for Spanish citizens residents of Spain. This comes a day after a similar suspension was announced by
Portugal.
(El Pais in English)
Belarus is expected to begin production of
Russia's
Sputnik V vaccine during the first quarter of
2021 after it became the first foreign country to register the vaccine.
(Meduza)
Maharashtra will impose a
curfew in
Mumbai and other major cities from 11:00 p.m. to 6:00 a.m.
IST beginning tomorrow until January 5 in order to prevent the spread of the new variant of SARS-CoV-2 that was discovered in the United Kingdom. The
state government also imposes a 14-day quarantine for anyone travelling from
Europe and the
Middle East.
(Livemint)
The
government will temporarily suspend all flights from
India to the
United Kingdom due to the emergence of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2. The suspension will begin tomorrow at 11:59 p.m.
IST and will last until December 31.
(Hindustan Times)
India reports 19,556 cases of
COVID-19, the lowest in the country since July 3.
(Reuters)
South Korea reports a record 24 new deaths in the past 24 hours, bringing the nationwide death toll to 698. In addition, the country surpasses 50,000 cases of COVID-19.
(Yonhap News Agency)
Oman will close all land, air, and sea borders beginning tomorrow at 1:00 a.m. local time for one week due to concerns over the new variant of SARS-CoV-2 in the United Kingdom.
(Times of Oman)
Egypt reports 664 new cases in the past 24 hours, the highest single-day total in a months, bringing the nationwide total to 125,555 cases.
(Egypt Independent)
Morocco's
government announces that they will impose a nationwide curfew from 9:00 p.m. to 6:00 a.m. local time and will require all cafes, shops, supermarkets, and restaurants to close at 8:00 p.m. beginning December 23. In
Casablanca,
Marrakech,
Agadir, and
Tangier, all restaurants will be closed for three weeks.
(Morocco World News)
Sudan will ban all travellers from the United Kingdom, the
Netherlands, and
South Africa beginning December 23 due to the discovery of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2.
(Reuters)
The
United States Congress formally reinstates
Sudan's
sovereign immunity. Sudan had paid the U.S. a $335 million settlement to victims of al-Qaeda attacks. The U.S. will partially pay off Sudanese bilateral debt, and its debt to the
International Monetary Fund (IMF), while making another
US$700 million available until September 2022 for assistance to the country.
(Reuters)
A report surfaces that a
Federal Security Service agent allegedly involved in the plot to poison the Russian opposition leader was "duped" by Navalny into admitting that the poison was planted in Navalny's underpants.
(CNN)
The planets
Jupiter and
Saturn appear at their closest in the sky since 1623, in an event known as a
great conjunction. The closest approach will occur at 18:22 UTC, when the two planets will be one-tenth of a degree apart; they will appear to be a binary object to the naked eye.
(Euronews)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Japanese business executive; former CEO of
Mitsubishi credited with the group's turnaround in the 1990s. Death was announced on this date i.e. December 21, 2020. Article updates done. Ready for a pair of eyes before going to homepage / RD.
Ktin (
talk)
23:58, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. On a quick glance, looking reasonably ok, but there's a lot of opinion sourced to an alumni site (current Ref. 4) that could do with higher-quality sourcing; also perhaps some rephrasing as the two are a little too similar in wording. I'd remove the Kennedy/Updike name checks, as they appear irrelevant. Was his wife the granddaughter or great-granddaughter of
Iwasaki Yatarō, as Ref. 4 states?
Espresso Addict (
talk)
04:13, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Espresso Addict:, Thanks for the catch. Updated to great-granddaughter. Again, will need you to be specific regarding any concerns with #4's sourcing. As it stands the article is good to go to homepage / RD in its current state. I am ambivalent to removing the Kennedy / Updike references. But, otherwise -- no reason to hold this article back.
Ktin (
talk)
04:24, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I don't generally edit in the area of business, but imo alumnus articles are usually essentially puff pieces. If the university is decent, one can usually rely on them for basic facts, but anything laudatory isn't 100% reliable.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
04:27, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, I am not disputing that. None of the
WP:PUFF text has been brought into the article. Please point a sentence that is
WP:PUFF and has been brought in from ref: 4 and I will be the first one to delete it, alternately, go ahead and delete it yourself. This very generic statement holding up articles from progressing does no good to anyone, nor to the backlog that is piling up.
Ktin (
talk)
04:35, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Thanks Martin. Folks, can I request one more pair of eyes on this one. I believe this is good to go to homepage / RD as it stands.
Ktin (
talk)
18:04, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Further note. This article has been in mainspace for less than 24 hours over a public holiday, and all content has been provided by a single editor (
Ktin). For clarity, I am in no way saying this precludes posting but it would, in my opinion, be wise to wait for potential input by others interested in this area.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
00:03, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Espresso Addict:, I frankly am not following the insinuation here. But, I will
WP:AGF. There is no reason to cast aspersions on the article just because I am the lone / major contributor to the article nor the fact that it is relatively new. If there are genuine article improvement notes that you have to provide, and please be specific with those, I am 100% available to have those incorporated. This lack of specificity is frankly very difficult to work with.
Ktin (
talk)
00:19, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Folks, please can I ask for one more pair of eyes on this one? I personally do not see a reason why this should wait to go to homepage.
Ktin (
talk)
07:21, 27 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. Seems brief but adequate, but there's no source I can see for his precise date of birth (The Scotsman just gives the year). I've expanded a source (possibly the one Joofjoof mentions?) and replaced a deadlink. Agree with Joofjoof that further expansion would be ideal but the online sources listed do not give further details.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
04:12, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. I removed the date of birth to year of birth. i.e. retained only 1946 (which is currently cited). The date of birth can be reintroduced if citation is found. No reason to hold this article back. Good to go to homepage / RD.
Joseywales1961, JW - any additional edits you are working on? Else, this is good to go.
Ktin (
talk)
05:06, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Right now, the big problem is the pro wrestling section. There were sources there earlier, but no more. I guess they weren't reliable? I don't know these wrestling-specific sources, and have requested aid from
WP:PW. –
Muboshgu (
talk)
18:42, 22 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Nominator's comments: (nominated early to ensure sufficient time if this barely wins) "great conjunction" is the technical astronomy term and astrologic mumbo for this rarest category of planetary alignment known before the discovery of Uranus. They occur on a c. 19.86 year cycle and this one's only 0.2 Moon diameters apart for most of the world. All longitudes and most latitudes can see, only early night or dusk. The 1563 event caused many astronomers to believe
Copernicus' Sun-centered predictions long before Galileo was imprisoned for this and the next ones this close are 2080 and 2417 AD. There is a c. 4 century closeness cycle thus after the morning sky one in 2080 it's all downhill from there. This is also the start of an air trigon mutation in astrology meaning the triangle is in air signs for awhile, two trigons ago the fire one starting in 1603 made people freak out about apocalypse causing a papal bull banning divination and mentions by Shakespeare, Bacon, Dante, Tycho and Kepler.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
05:05, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Extended content
Still about 2.5 times minimum separation here on Dec 19 (Saturn isn't this dim in a telescope to the eye though)This is the article's other photo, telephoto I think of it at 2.5 times how close it will be on Monday. From central Europe and after visible twilight which increases horizon air blurring compared to closer to 10°N and earlier.And here's what
The Planetary Society has called the best case scenario view through a telescope. Not everyone will see this much detail but high altitude places around 10 degrees North in Africa is the lucky location (weather-permitting). You can't get much less systemic bias than that. They released under Creative Commons 3 license. These should give a better idea of how impressive or not it'll be when magnified than peoples' opinions.
Support in principle There's a lot of hype around the event in every astronomical community that I'm familiar with. While I'm not sure how famous the event is to the average Joe,it's nevertheless being reported in major news outlets and given the rarity of the event, I think it deserves a blurb. However, the target article has a lot of problems so oppose until that's fixed.Scaramouche33 (
talk)
05:47, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support per Scaramouche33. But don't use the term win; we're not winning anything there. Several of my blurbs get rejected in the past and I don't consider it as a loss, just stale. Regards,
Jeromi Mikhael(
marhata)07:32, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose, despite being an astronomer myself. Although the event is underway, closest approach doesn't happen until 21 Dec. It's also pretty unimpressive to see and has zero scientific interest or value. Some
amateur astronomy organisations are promoting it, but there's little-to-no interest among professionals. For the general public it's less impressive to look at than the Geminid meteor shower that's also happening right now. Whilst I like to see astronomy stories in ITN, I think general readers would see that blurb, think it was something dramatic like an eclipse, then be hugely disappointed to realise what's actually visible. We certainly shouldn't be promoting the
pseudoscience of
astrology on the Main Page.
Modest Geniustalk11:56, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
To be honest I don't know at what point 2 points of light are close and similar enough to be visually impressive. If this was Venus (brightness about minus 4) and Jupiter (about minus 2) several arcminutes apart it would definitely be visually impressive, this is 6 arcminutes apart and only about magnitude 0 and minus 2. I won't guess if they will be or won't be close enough to impress the general public in a good telescope.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
14:19, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support. The claims made above are incorrect. The event will be impressive to see; both planets will be visible in the same field of view in a telescope (only the second time this has happened since the invention of the telescope). Another close conjunction won't happen again until 2080 so this is a very rare event, and it is important as it has been given significant prominence in many astronomical almanacs/year books/magazines. The event is also of some scientific value: I know of some astronomers who are are using this event to study Jupiter's magnetosphere as Saturn passes through it as seen from Earth. However, I do agree that the article should be improved (help would be appreciated), the mentions of astrology removed (as unimportant), and the blurb reworded a bit something like "The planets
Jupiter and
Saturn appeared at their closest together in the sky for almost 400 years on 21 December, in an event known as a
great conjunction (explaining what it is rather than just mentioning it).
Support I saw this covered on The Sky at Night yesterday and it looked quite special. I looked at the planets earlier in the year when out late observing the
comet, which we blurbed. The planets were a lot brighter than the comet then and this conjunction will make them even more prominent. Unlike Brexit and other human affairs, this is quite a sure thing and it is good to give people advance notice so they have a chance to see it themselves.
Note also that we have had
Nana Akufo-Addo as the picture blurb for an entire week now and it's embarassing to have such a low-impact story as our lead for so long. Like the comet, the conjunction will have plenty of good pictures for us to highlight and so we should make the most of them.
People on earth are learning about it because media are covering it, and they are likely to be interested in a quality Wikipedia article on the topic. --
Jayron3213:52, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment Is there a precedence of garden-variety total lunar eclipse nominations not being posted, that might help clarify minimum visual impressiveness for events that science has already learned all it could from as TLEs impress kids but are "eh I'll look but that's it" at best to astronomy PhDs and people who've had an astronomy hobby for long enough. I recommend collecting photographs of lunar eclipses with different skyscrapers or mountains or whatever to cure those repetitive doldrums.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
14:40, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Not quite, it's important in astrological mumbo jumbo but it's still the 2 most visually impressive planets in a telescope being unusually close (less than or about 10 Jupiter or Saturn diameters). They're only in the same telescope field of view once every few decades much less this close.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
17:00, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support pending improvements to quality and appropriate update. This is both in the news and of general interest to our readers. We should not be so pompous to reject this as not being scientifically important. — Martin (
MSGJ ·
talk)
09:44, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
There's hardly anything pompous about scientific importance, especially compared to other ITN/R topics such as award shows or horse-racing.--WaltCip-(
talk)13:39, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Science may have had its last significant discoveries about conjunctions with Tycho's measurement advances, Kepler's elliptical orbits and Galileo's work 4 centuries ago but it would still be new and interesting to some readers.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
16:08, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support per nominator and Andrew. Visible worldwide with significant media coverage. Opposers fail to convince that this is not an ITN-worthy blurb. Tagged section can be edited down or removed to the article Talk page for discussion as needed.
Jusdafax (
talk)
15:31, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose due to article quality; parts are unsourced, much that is sourced depends on a reference that is someone's private webpage, half of it is astrological nonsense.
Black Kite (talk)17:19, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Am I at least halfway done with bringing article to minimum quality? There is less pseudoscience and more
positional astronomy now. And anything of that pseudoscience that might generously be called history has been moved to new section called in history
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
19:18, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment There's a lot more astronomy bytes in the article now and a lot less astrology and more sourcing and no tags. I note that a
planetary science Ph.D. (
U. of Arizona) who's
been full professor at
Rice University since 2007 has cared enough to write these detailed articles on great conjunctions:
[12][13], making 3,000 and 20,000* year lists and writing about the cyclical mathematics and so on, one astronomy PhD not finding this interesting wouldn't mean they all don't. Those institutions aren't bad,
University of Arizona's astronomy program is rated
5th to 24th in America depending on metric and their planetary science is
6th to 33rd.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
20:05, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Sorry, it's still a no from me. That this might have been important in the history of science has no bearing on its current relevance to science; if we were to post anything related to astronomy or the history of science here, we wouldn't be posting anything else, and I don't think this clears the bar. –
John M Wolfson (
talk •
contribs)
22:19, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support – This Great Conjunction is more than notable enough in Astronomical circles to warrant an ITN mention. Additionally, the article quality, the main sticking point of many opposers above, has significantly improved in just the past few days alone. As such, I support this ITN candidate. LightandDark2000 🌀 (
talk)
15:48, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I strongly disagree with Masem's removal of the ready tag. The worldwide significance and substantial notability of this highly visible conjunction is well-established, the article is improved markedly in the past few days, and a potential posting admin should take those factors into account. In my view the opposers on significance are not making a decent case. At least one opposer on article quality has changed to a weak support, and other opposers on quality have done so many days ago and not weighed in since. The blurb should be now marked Ready, and an admin should post it. Jayron 32 says it well above: "People on earth are learning about it because media are covering it, and they are likely to be interested in a quality Wikipedia article on the topic." As I see it, remaining objections to posting this blurb simply boil down to "I don't like it," aka
WP:IDLI. We are now one day away from this historic planetary conjunction. Is there one admin present willing to post? Cheers,
Jusdafax (
talk)
21:01, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Strong support on notability. The conjunction itself is a once in 20 year event, which is quite rare and interesting in itself. But the proximity, a one in 400 year event, between the two largest planets in our solar system, makes this a no brainer for posting. I'm not particularly an astronomer, but I have been tracking the convergence of these things in the sky all year. Bottom line, if eclipses which are commonplace and almost annual, are deemed to be ITN/R, then this should highly unusual occurrence should be too. No comment on quality as I haven't looked at the article yet, will have a deco a bit later. —
Amakuru (
talk)
21:15, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I also oppose because the actuality of this coincidence (two dots in the sky are briefly closer from Earth's POV than they've seemed for a while) is a silly thing to get excited about.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
23:07, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The transit of Venus was also a dot closer to something from Earth's POV than it's been for a while (120 years) and that dot was posted without even having rings. Heck a total solar eclipse is something that's briefly closer to something else than it's been in awhile (average: 2 minutes every 360 years) (yes I know that one's much, much more impressive)
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
23:24, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support something unusual and interesting—Wikipedia's perfect niche. Moreover, we currently have material from more than two weeks ago (Hayabusa2) in ITN. We may not be a news ticker, but it's time to rotate it with something or else we're not serving our readers.
Ed[talk][majestic titan]00:19, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The fact that the news cycle is pretty slow right now (presumably due to a certain thing in a certain banner) is not an argument to post something that is otherwise not notable, and it would be an OR violation to do so. That said, the rest of your support is fine and I have no issue with it. –
John M Wolfson (
talk •
contribs)
00:39, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support. This is a one in a generation event that’s also perfectly suited to Wikipedia’s strengths: unusual anomalies. The news cycle has been pretty slow also, and overall this just seems like a pretty strong event for ITN.
The Image Editor (
talk)
02:25, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment Well,today's the day! Great work on the article, it's much better referenced than it was a few days ago and the new images are a nice edition as well. I agree with HiLo48 that it's best to remove the astrology section if we can't find any sources for it
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
05:18, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment With somehow mixed support here (the arguments agains due to poor article shape have been resolved), an alternative would be to run it on On this day box. Since ... you know ... it's on this day :) --Tone08:14, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support on notability. If there doesn't end up being a consensus to post to ITN, we certainly should post this somewhere else. We already post similar phenomenon (e.g. solar eclipses) but those occur quite frequently compared to this. To say that this is a once in a lifetime event is quite an understatement; this is a once in a millennium event. I can't think of anything else that we can say that about. Vanilla Wizard 💙09:28, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support The last nom might have been premature but the general significance and interest in this event is now widely being reported for this to be on ITN.
Gotitbro (
talk)
12:26, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose This feels like Joey's
identical hand scheme from Friends - there's no THERE there. It is a function of planetary motion that sometimes they'll be closer to each other than other times. There is nothing remotely noteworthy about the occasions on which it happens. GreatCaesarsGhost13:30, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
That is what an eclipse is, when they're closer than an average of a sixtieth of a Moon width somewhere on Earth and the Moon height is slightly under the average miles you get total solar eclipses. Nothing more special than that, the separations in miles are still completely unremarkable but they're still posted cause they look cool.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
13:43, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
How are eclipses unremarkable? People can't STOP remarking on them. You know how many remarks I heard about the last total solar eclipse? I want to say it was 1000x more than remarked on the great conjunction, but 1000x zero is still zero. Eclipses "looking cool" is still something, and something is more than nothing. GreatCaesarsGhost15:29, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The separation in miles is unremarkable and there's no closeness actually there (I haven't seen the episode). And you don't think the pic looks cool if you click on it? Nothing beats a total solar eclipse, if that's the minimum eye candyness standard then no one should ever post other astronomical events again but they have i.e. the longest annular eclipse of the millennium and a featureless circle of 0.03 Sun widths crossing the Sun (which I thought was cool too but I'm biased)
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
15:41, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I'm not any more excited today than usual. I don't feel any effects at all from this great event, but then at the moment it's cloudy where I live. Nevertheless, this conjunction seems suboptimally impactful. –
Sca (
talk)
14:05, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
"person of unusual confirmation bias", "person who swallowed the
in-universe stuff", "astrologer who happens to still be alive", "differently worldviewed". The differently worldviewed take offense at your dismissal of things like geocentrism, ghosts, flat earthism, terrorism and global cooling" and would prefer that you call them "
heterodox realitists"
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
15:31, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
There have been people so unexcited about the only local total solar eclipse in >150 years future and past that they didn't bother to step into the darkness for a moment to see.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
14:16, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
And that proves what exactly?
Are you aware of just how many Google Doodles there are? I'm not opposed to this nomination, but if "subject of a Google Doodle" were a criterion we'd also have blurbed "Zinaida Serebriakova's 136th birthday", "Remembering Sudan, the last male northern white rhino", "Bahrain National Day 2020", "Marie Popelin’s 174th birthday" and "the unification of Transylvania, Banat, Crișana, and Maramureș with the Romanian Kingdom on this date in 1918" this month alone. The existence of a Google Doodle isn't any kind of mark of significance, it's Google's equivalent of our Featured Articles section and just means that some Google employee took an interest in the topic. ‑
Iridescent15:30, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The Google Doodle is itself international news, being featured in multiple sources
[14];
[15]. Besides the great conjunction, these stories also highlight the fact that this is the winter solstice and make something of the
Christmas Star aspect too. These points are all timely and are clearly what's actually in the news. Meanwhile, our blurbs are stale astronomical items, being from 5 days and 16 days ago. ITN is failing while Google is succeeding.
Andrew🐉(
talk)
16:11, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak support on the basis that we have sources like the
BBC,
NASA, and
CBS News covering the event as a rare astronomical (not astrological) thing, last visible just under 400 years ago, and something that should be possible to see w/ naked eye under clear skies. As long as we're not treating it like as astrological event but the rarer astronomical one, that's fine. Article seems ready. --
Masem (
t)
15:56, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I'd have thought that was enough but I'm no longer in a position to judge, having !voted myself. Despite the claims above that it's an "uninteresting" event for professional astronomers, I find that opposition generally weak. It is certainly in the news, across the world, it's a very rare event and although the event has no impact on the bodies themselves, neither do the frequently occurring eclipses yet we post them without hesitation. —
Amakuru (
talk)
17:27, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Professionals only get paid to extend the boundary of current knowledge, and don't look through telescopes with eyes anymore and use
false color infrared/radio etc a lot, and things eyes can't see like extreme physics from outside the solar system and cosmology and
exoplanets are big right now so it's not surprising that some professionals don't have a looking with their eyes hobby anymore. Stuff eyes can see has been studied to death already.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
18:07, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support Interesting and unusual, as others have said. My reservation was the astrology nonsense, but now that section has been removed from the article I'll support.--
P-K3 (
talk)
17:35, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Jeeeeeeez admins have posted dead American dudes that have more opposition than this one. Where's a rogue admin when you need one? Or does someone have to tagged this as ready and we'd wait for another day?
Howard the Duck (
talk)
17:47, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Posted. I think there's a rough consensus to post this; some proportion (exact proportion impossible to guess) of opposes were to quality which seems to no longer be an issue, and to astrology nonsense that has now been removed. Also, oldest hook is over 2 weeks old, ITN needed some fresh air. No one expressed an opinion about which blurb to use, so I went with Alt 2, because Alt 3 was too long (someone else changed to Alt 3, which seems to me to be about 2% worse, so meh), and I don't think "easily visible" is quantifiable enough. Not sure if this is actually photogenic or not; if anyone finds a free image that isn't two dots of light, the image could stand to be updated too. --
Floquenbeam (
talk)
18:08, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Post-posting support - been in the news cycle for a week or two, easily visible to the naked eye (although it was more impressive IMO watching them get closer and closer over the past 6 months). I'm not sure why the scientific value is relevant seeing as we post eclipses that hold next to zero scientific value today. As for image, NASA imagery is public domain is it not?
Their webpage on the conjunction. - Floydianτ¢18:58, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Regarding the image above; it is basically illegible at all resolutions and on all screens unless you click on it to expand; we tend to not include such images in the ITN box, for similar reasons why maps are usually not included on main page posts. It looks like a black rectangle with some random smudges on it. If there's an image of the conjunction at better resolution that lets us see the planets and identify them at scale, that would be great. But dim smudges on a black rectangle isn't really helping our readers. --
Jayron3219:49, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Sure why not, it's just drawing lines between consecutive conjunctions with the "ruler" being the plane of Earth's orbit and even people who didn't believe in astrology measured in signs degrees minutes seconds back then, like a 12 30 60 60 version of British money. I might be remembering some other early to mid 1600s quote but I think it was Kepler who told the non-believing members of his profession to keep their mouth shut cause astrology is the teat of astronomy or something like that (meaning astrology paid the bills so they could afford to research and eat and making horoscopes for hire was something they were almost uniquely qualified for, no other job would need their skills).
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
01:10, 22 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Post-posting support Been all over the news for the past week, is unique and interesting, and the article is in good shape.
Mlb96 (
talk)
21:47, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Different people like different things, it's prominent in the news and not only just in tabloids like the NY Post and Daily News so why not? Also it removed another space item over half month old.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
22:45, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Stop dealing with Sca. This same guy dismissed the Times as a reference for newsworthiness here. Well, it is not the NY Post and Daily News (or perhaps the Sun) so... perhaps the 36k pageviews yesterday and 192k for December all came from boring people? I dunno. That's certainly a lot more than 50% of those found in
WP:ITNR.
Howard the Duck (
talk)
23:07, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
A
car bombing in
Kabul targeting Khan Mohammad Wardak, a lawmaker, kills nine people and wounds more than 20 others. Wardak is among the injured. Attacks also occur in
Logar,
Nangarhar,
Helmand, and
Badakhshan, with an unknown number of civilians and security forces killed. No group claims responsibility for these attacks.
(Reuters)
Amazon announces that they will close the
Robbinsville Township facility, also known as the PNE5, after several workers tested positive for COVID-19.
(CNBC)
The
federal government restricts travel to and from the
United Kingdom for 72 hours from tomorrow due to emergence to a new variant of SARS-CoV-2. The restrictions do not apply to
cargo flights or stops where passengers do not disembark.
(CTV News)
El Salvador bans travelers who have been in the United Kingdom or
South Africa in the last 30 days or whose flights included a layover in those countries.
(Reuters)
Iran suspends flights to and from the United Kingdom for two weeks due to the emergence of a new variant of
SARS-CoV-2 that was discovered in the UK.
(Reuters)
Israel bans entry of travelers from
Denmark, South Africa, and the United Kingdom due to the discovery of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2 in the latter country. Israeli citizens arriving from those countries will be required to quarantine at state-run quarantine hotels for up to 14 days.
(The Jerusalem Post)
Saudi Arabia suspends all international
passenger flights for one week as well as all entry through land and sea ports in response to a new variant of the SARS-COV-2 that was discovered in the United Kingdom.
(Arab News)
Belgium bans entry for incoming
rail and air passengers from the United Kingdom for at least 24 hours, beginning at midnight.
VirologistMarc Van Ranst said yesterday that a variant of SARS-COV-2 from the United Kingdom had been found in four cases from a sample of 2,000 analyses in his laboratory.
(VRT)
The
government announces the suspension of all flights between
Bulgaria and the United Kingdom from tomorrow until January 31. Anyone who already arrived from the UK is required to quarantine for 10 days.
(Sofia Globe)
Denmark will exhume four millions of
minks to prevention pollution contamination. This work will begin in May 2021, when the risk of coronavirus contamination from the dead animals has been eliminated.
(DW)
Greece introduces a seven-day
quarantine for people arriving from the United Kingdom beginning tomorrow at 6:00 a.m. local time due to the discovery of a new variant of SARS-COV-2 in the country.
(Greek Travel Pages)
Minister for Transport
Eamon Ryan announces that the
government will impose a 48-hour ban on flights to and from the United Kingdom from tomorrow following emergence of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2, while
ferries will be limited to freight travel.
(RTE)
The
government orders a ban on
passenger flights from the United Kingdom from 6:00 a.m. today until at least January 1 due to the spread of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2 in the UK, with a case of the variant already having been reported in the
Netherlands.
(The Independent)
Turkey temporarily suspend flights from the United Kingdom, the Netherlands, Denmark, and South Africa due to concerns over a new variant of SARS-CoV-2.
(Daily Sabah)
The United Kingdom reports a record 35,928 new cases in the past 24 hours. The
government data also shows that 90% of local authorities in
England have reported an increase in cases during the past week.
(The Daily Telegraph)
An off-duty
police officer kills two unarmed neighbors in
Paniqui,
Tarlac, Philippines after opening fire against them following a dispute. The filmed incident circulates on social media hours later and sparks nationwide protests against
police brutality and
impunity.
(BBC News)(Rappler)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. Not checked in detail but some sourcing is still required, and much of the existing sourcing on his research is to his works or an obituary written by his son. The book quotations need page numbers. The list of publications is much longer than recommended, is there some sort of rationale for all of the journal articles? A couple look like obituaries. The books could do with splitting into edited and authored.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
02:16, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I see, that's fair. The quotes should probably be shortened a bit. And I agree with Espresso Addict's comments about publication list.
Joofjoof (
talk)
22:08, 25 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Nominator's comments: New eruption at a major volcano. It has been dormant for 2 years and is ranked by the United States Geological Survey as the volcano in the United States most likely to threaten lives and infrastructure.
Found5dollar (
talk)
16:24, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Wait It is an active volcano and infrequently erupts like this. So it is not like people aren't aware of this. Wait until we have an idea if there are any actual significant deaths from it. --
Masem (
t)
16:33, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support – This is the first eruption of Kīlauea in two years. The last eruption was one that had lasted 35 years. The current eruption is still ongoing and does not look like it is going to be a brief event. LightandDark2000 🌀 (
talk)
09:13, 22 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Can't consider it to be a rare eruption (last happened 2 years ago) and neither has any significant destruction/damage been caused (as of now).
Gotitbro (
talk)
19:26, 22 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support — Quality looks good. Of significant-enough interest to readers (of more interest to readers than what's on ITN now; the bottom blurb is going on almost three weeks now). "Not rare enough" is not relevant to ITN's purpose. "Wait because something more important might happen" does not further ITN's purpose. If readers are interested now, and we have a good-enough article now, then list it on the main page now. If something more important happens later, we can blurb that, too. It's not like we have so many ITN blurbs that we need to make sure no article gets listed twice in a certain time period. I so wish ITN !voters would !vote based on furthering the global consensus of ITN's purpose and not on their personal views about what's important news and what's not important news.
Levivichharass/hound18:40, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Strictly speaking, news is that which is important to a significant number of people. Both those terms are matters of judgment. Each report must be evaluated by knowledgeable people. (But there's some room for human-interest material.) –
Sca (
talk)
15:11, 26 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Centenarian, co-founded and directed the Leeds Piano Competition that gave pianists a start into an international career, held the post of director until age 95. There's more detail in the sources if needed.
Gerda Arendt (
talk)
12:01, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak Oppose for now. As someone who grew up learning the piano through Fanny Waterman's books, this is sad news. Although I would have assumed she actually died many years ago! The article is mostly fine, but I think there should be a bit of coverage of those books, as they are an important part of her career. Particularly the "Me and My Piano" series, which is mentioned in
the Guardian obituary I'll add something myself later on if you aren't able to do so this morning, Gerda. Cheers —
Amakuru (
talk)
08:20, 22 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article needs updating The nominated event is listed on
WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet
WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Weak oppose. While the subject is MORE than notable to qualify for ITN, along with a pretty slow week in terms of news, the article in question is somewhat under-referenced and doesn’t quite meet the standards of ITN. If the article is improved, I’ll support putting it on ITN.
The Image Editor (
talk)
03:13, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. There's some uncited material, including the birth date. Something appears missing or scrambled at the start of the section "Deputy Prime Minister (1975–1983)". Otherwise looks in reasonable shape, although I have not done a sources check.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
07:23, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
British Prime MinisterBoris Johnson announces the introduction of "Tier 4" restrictions in
London and
South East England beginning at midnight. Households in those areas are to be banned from mixing over the festive season, while in the rest of the country, mixing of households will only be allowed on
Christmas Day.
(ITV)
First MinisterMark Drakeford announces that after urgent talks with ministers over the discovery of a new variant of SARS-CoV-2, the planned
lockdown will now begin at midnight instead of on December 28.
(BBC News)
Jakarta reports a record of 1,899 new confirmed cases in the past 24 hours.
(VOI)
Bali requires anyone entering and leaving the province to have a negative
PCR swab test for air travel, and a negative rapid antigen test for land and sea travel. However, children aged 12 years and under are exempted from these requirements.
(The Bali Times)
Due to the outbreak in a seafood market,
Samut Sakhon Province enters a
lockdown with a curfew from 10:00 p.m. to 5:00 a.m. local time which will remain in effect until January 3.
(The Bangkok Post)
The leaders of three of the main armed groups of the
Central African Republic announce a coalition for next week's general election, a move that could further increase tensions ahead of the election, where the opposition fears massive voter fraud. The armed groups named themselves the Coalition of Patriots for Change and invited other armed groups to join, while urging them to protect the integrity of civilians.
(Al Jazeera)
PresidentDonald Trump speaks for the first time about the breach, saying it is "well in control". He also suggests China is to blame, contradicting earlier U.S. government claims that put forward Russia as a suspect.
(NBC News)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Canadian political science professor, author, and socialist activist dies at age 75. Covid. The article is well-sourced (besides several page needed tags) though not many RS have covered his death so far.
Davey2116 (
talk)
18:43, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Oppose. Not adequately sourced; needs full lead; encyclopedic tone needs work in places; heading structure needs attention, eg there's a miscellaneous bit at the end that needs sorting out. The references use an odd "available at" formulation for the url, which makes them rather hard to read; I don't know whether this would fall under the allowed styles for references?
Espresso Addict (
talk)
02:35, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
"Not adequately sourced"?? It's got 83 references. If you're not happy with any of them, or if any particular sentences need verification, then please feel free to tag the article. But the sourcing seems more than adequate to me. — Martin (
MSGJ ·
talk)
09:18, 21 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose per Espresso Addict. Whether an article is adequately referenced is not determined by counting the number of cites. It's by assessing whether all major assertions are covered. In this case I don't see that they are. And the lead definitely needs expanding, it's only one line at the moment, for what is a fairly lengthy article. It also contains unencyclopedic formulations apparently in Wikipedia's voice (i.e. not part of a quote), such as "There should be as little opportunity as possible for sticky fingers in the government pie". Quite a bit of work needed here unfortunately. CHeers —
Amakuru (
talk)
12:42, 22 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Tentative support Having now read
WP:ITNCRIT, it's clear the article meets the second criterion. (Check the article's reflist if you think press coverage has been narrow or shallow, and I'm sure you'll see it has not been; the topic is very much "in the news" and seems likely to be significant for a while, both politically and technologically.) As the article creator, though, I feel I should abstain on whether the quality of the article is sufficient, so I'll just comment that I hope other editors feel I have done a good job with it. (And if not, then I'll try to engage on the article's talk page to address specific criticisms.) Comment As the article creator, I think I should abstain from voting on this. I'll let other people decide. Thanks for pinging me, though, Thanks,
Zazpot (
talk) 09:39, 19 December 2020 (UTC); edited
Zazpot (
talk)
18:42, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment I think this would have been better suited as a blurb if it was nominated a few days ago. But I'm not sure if it will work for ongoing. I mean, how long would we keep it,till the investigations are concluded?
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
12:23, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Not really "in the news" or "ongoing" (the breach has already happened). If the article was about an investigation into this which was receiving significant continuous media coverage that would be different. This is better suited for a blurb, but even then the exact extent is not known to gauge its aptness for that.
Gotitbro (
talk)
12:44, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support blurb The article is really good, which is the most important thing. This would be hard to find normally because of the title, so we could do some good by featuring it. I'm confused by the "not in the news" comments; I can't get away from this story. I don't think that we should go straight to ongoing just because it was expanded over a few days. GreatCaesarsGhost13:18, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose This may be in the news but definitely not on the front page and it doesn't portend anything with a long-lasting impact. And if the article looks good, then it could get nominated for an FP and appear on the main page as such but I'm not going to buy that argument to make concessions on this nomination.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
14:10, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose – There was some coverage, but the 'breach' doesn't seem highly impactful in a world dominated by more threatening issues. –
Sca (
talk)
14:13, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose It's definitely in the news, but its a slow-motion train wreck that's being attributed to yet more antics from the Trump administration that did actions to allow it to happen, and hence getting a bit of over-coverage here in the US. --
Masem (
t)
14:52, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support, either a blurb or ongoing. "Not in the news"? Please, give me a break! As of today, it is front page news at BBC
[19], France24
[20], DeutcheWelle
[21], LeMonde
[22], just for starters. Guardin reports
[23] that, with Trump still being silent, Biden has indicated there will be significant retaliation once he takes office. This story definitely has legs and it will have major impact.
Nsk92 (
talk)
15:02, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Not necessarily. We blurbed the Indian farmers protests from what was originally an Ongoing nomination. Personally I think it should be very rare for a story to go straight to Ongoing, with no blurb first. If it's newsworthy enough to merit an Ongoing entry then we should first tell our readers about the opening and latest developments, as a full blurb. Then move to Ongoing once it falls off the bottom. —
Amakuru (
talk)
20:43, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment Listing me as an "updater" is kind, but may be misleading. I primarily worked on making the references look consistent. I didn't make any significant updates to the content.
GoingBatty (
talk)
16:24, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Fun Fact An incident this major calls for "Federal Responders" to "safeguard" the details of it, to "the extent permitted" by law, per section III(c) of
Presidential Policy Directive 41. What happened will be speculative, hard to find and/or partially factual. That much is near certain.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
22:53, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Espionage and signal intelligence has been an ongoing activity of great powers for over 100 years. Nowadays "the
NSA intercepts and stores the communications of over a billion people worldwide" and that probably includes everything that we're typing here too.
Andrew🐉(
talk)
00:20, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak Support Blurb I don't remember seeing such sustained coverage of what should otherwise be usual espionage. Trump's silence is also more interesting. Maybe re-nom as blurb?
104.243.98.96 (
talk)
08:22, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose both on impact and quality. Data breaches are frequent, caused moreso by organizational buffoonery and buck-passing subcontracting than by genuine technological innovation. Article is far too granular to convey anything to a naïve reader; it would be more suited to a subject publication. The tone is breathless and veers into proseline. It whiffs of the Russia hacking! narrative of years past which turned out to be rank untruth.
130.233.213.199 (
talk)
07:21, 22 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support – This is the biggest, and possibly the most damaging cyberattack the U.S. has ever experienced, in terms of national security. That in itself is already more than notable enough for an ITN mention. Thousands of companies and U.S. Federal Government branches were compromised, for months, mind you. And the article appears to have decent quality as well. LightandDark2000 🌀 (
talk)
00:56, 23 December 2020 (UTC)reply
An explosion at a religious gathering during a
Quran recitation ceremony in
Ghazni,
Afghanistan, has killed at least 15 civilians and wounded 20 others.
(Al Jazeera)
An explosion kills 15 children and injures another 20 people in
Ghazni,
Afghanistan, after a piece of
unexploded ordnance blows up when the children try to sell it to a vendor.
(BBC News)
Mexico City and the
State of Mexico move back to the "red traffic light". All non-essential activity will be suspended until January 10 due to an "alarming" increase in both infections and hospital occupancies.
(Milenio)
ChancellorSebastian Kurz announces that the
country will impose a third nationwide
lockdown beginning on December 26. However, people who take part in mass testing programmes between January 15 and 17 and test negative will be allowed to enter shops and restaurants beginning on January 18.
(Barron's)
Prime MinisterGiuseppe Conte announces a second nationwide "red zone"
lockdown from December 24–27, December 31–January 3, and January 5–6. On those days, people will only be allowed to travel for work, health or emergency reasons. An "orange zone", where shops are allowed to open, will be in effect from December 28–30 and on January 4. However, all bars and restaurants will remain closed during the holiday season.
(Reuters)
Germany reports a record 33,777 new cases in the past 24 hours, according to data from the
Robert Koch Institute, bringing the nationwide total of confirmed cases to 1,439,938.
(Bild)
Prime MinisterStefan Löfven announces new measures to reduce the second wave of the pandemic. All non-essential public services will close until January 24, alcohol sales will be banned after 8:00 p.m. local time, and the number of people at restaurants will be limited to four per table. It also recommended to use
face masks on public transport at certain times.
(The Local Sweden)
The
Swiss government announces that restaurants, bars and sports and leisure centres, as well as libraries, museums and other cultural institutions will close on December 22 to help reduce the spread of COVID-19 as the total numbers of cases and deaths surpass 400,000 and 6,000 respectively.
(Swiss Info)
The
Lagos State Government orders all public and private schools in the
state to close until further notice. The government also recommends that all
public servants from Grade Level 14 and below, except emergency workers and first responders, work from home for 14 days beginning December 21.
(Nairametrics)
Starting from December 21,
Panama will reimpose nationwide restrictions by require men and women to carry out holiday shopping on different days. On
Christmas and
New Year's Day there will be total lockdown for all genders.
(The Straits Times)
The
Supreme Court of the United States, in an unsigned 6–3 decision, dismisses Trump v. New York, ruling that the challenge to the Trump administration's memo requiring the
Census Bureau to report the results of the
2020 United States census with the exclusion of
undocumented immigrants for apportionment is premature, and that no judicial review can be taken until after the data has been collected. The Bureau faces a December 31 deadline to report the results, which they have previously indicated that they may miss.
(The New York Times)
A review of some recent medical studies shows that
memory T cells may play a role in a phenomenon known as
cross-reactivity, which researchers found may perhaps give certain people, in some cases, some level of immunity to the virus that causes
COVID-19 even without them having been exposed to or infected with the virus, or having received a vaccine. There are certain structural and clinical similarities between the virus that causes COVID-19 and the other coronaviruses that are related to it, which cause
SARS and
MERS.
(MSN)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. Needs a source for the birth date (only year in source given) and middle initial. There is very little detail between 1974 (legal graduation) and 2016 (election), though his notability derives solely from his short political career. Otherwise seems an acceptable start-class article. ETA: I note, however, there's been some conflict over the text on his votes in office; a part of this section has now been removed but looking at the history all of it appears to be disputed.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
05:25, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I'm not seeing too much dispute there outside of the insulin claim, which shouldn't be that hard to verify, but probably not worth it if it's contentious. What's left in the article now appears to be fairly cut and dry. There's no wiki article on the publication for the DOB source I just added, but the article's from a former Star Tribune/New Yorker political writer, so it looks like RS to me
Nohomersryan (
talk)
06:24, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Thanks for working on this,
Brigade Piron. I can't access all of the critical Le Monde ref 2, but I am somewhat doubtful that it covers everything that is attributed to it, in particular the material after its publication in April 2001; perhaps someone with access can double-check? There are additionally still a few bits of information without any citation. There's also nothing in the body about his personal life as an adult (marriage, children).
Espresso Addict (
talk)
12:36, 23 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
@
Alsoriano97: It's somewhat improved, thanks, but still nowhere near main-page quality. There needs to be a coherent account of his notable career in detail, which is completely sourced to reliable sources. For example, just under "Beginnings" (which I'll edit to something better in a moment), when did he join the National Liberal Party; which exact party is referred to (wikilink); was he elected to the General Council or appointed in some fashion; if elected in what election, representing whom; what did he do as a council member; what happened between 1979 and 1981... And so on.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
20:53, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The article is significantly better now, thanks. I'm still puzzled by what happened between 1979 and 1981 -- was the General Council dissolved, or was he just not elected in 1979? Also there's nothing on the basic personal life -- marriage(s), children -- apart from unsourced material in the infobox. There's also a requested source in the awards. I have not checked the non-English sources.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
05:04, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
It is significantly improved, though I've noticed one one uncited sentence and a preexisting cn tag. Get those fixed and I'll change my !vote to a Support.
Gex4pls (
talk)
20:56, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Venezuelan senior ranking politician, including former Vice President, presdential candidate and journalist. Prominent figure in the left wing political history of the country.
NoonIcarus (
talk)
20:50, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment 1 section unreferenced (tagged) and a couple of citations elsewhere (tagged), could also use ISBN's for the books if available. Will support when fixed.
JW 1961Talk21:27, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
A knifeman kills two elderly people after storming their home and then tries to attack police officers on a highway in
Brisbane,
Australia. The attacker, who is shot dead by police, has been identified as a 22-year-old man inspired by the
Islamic State. He was arrested in early 2019 when he tried to join the group in
Somalia.
(CNA)
The
Finnish sauna culture is inscribed on the UNESCO list. As authorized by
the state, the
Finnish Heritage Agency commits, together with Finnish sauna communities and promoters of the sauna culture, to safeguard the vitality of the sauna tradition and to highlight its importance as part of customs and wellbeing.
(YLE)
The
Northern Ireland Executive agrees to impose a new lockdown beginning on
Boxing Day, which means that non-essential shops will be closed from the end of trading on
Christmas Eve. During the first week of lockdown, essential shops will have to close each day at 8:00 p.m.
GMT.
(BBC)
Prime Minister António Costa says that an overnight
curfew beginning at 11:00 p.m. will be in effect in the
country on
New Year's Eve. He also added that people would not be allowed to leave their homes between 1:00 p.m. and 5:00 a.m. from January 1 to 3.
(CNA)
Mayor
Hennadiy Kernes of
Kharkiv, Ukraine's second largest city, dies in Germany due to complications caused by
COVID-19 after contracting the virus in September.
(Kyiv Post)
JakartaGovernorAnies Baswedan issues a gubernatorial instruction and decree that requires anyone leaving and entering the city from tomorrow until January 8 to have a negative rapid antigen test result. The order also limits the capacity of offices to 50% and requires cafés, restaurants and tourist attractions to close at 7:00 p.m. local time from December 24 to 27 and December 31 to January 2.
(The Jakarta Post)(Jakarta Globe)
The
Tokyo Metropolitan Government raises its healthcare alert level to the top level for the first time as the number of infections continues to increase. This comes as
Tokyo reports a record of 822 new cases in the past 24 hours.
(The Straits Times)
The
Palestinian Authority impose a two-week lockdown in the entire
West Bank that orders schools, universities, restaurants, barbershops, gyms and leisure venues to close. As part of the lockdown, the curfew has also been extended for two weeks.
(The Times of Israel)
California reports 52,281 new cases and 379 deaths in the past 24 hours, both a new single-day record for the state and nationwide since the beginning of the pandemic.
(KABC-TV)
The
New South Wales Northern Beaches outbreak reaches 17 cases, leading to fears of a second wave in the state.
Western Australia and
Queensland have reimposed border restrictions on people travelling from New South Wales.
(News.com.au)
An ombudsman report finds that the
Victorian state
government's decision to briefly impose a "hard lockdown" on public housing towers in July in response to the
COVID-19 pandemic, not allowing anyone in or out, was a violation of
human rights. The state government refuses to apologise to the tower residents despite the report's recommendations.
(The Guardian)
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Former leader of Welsh nationalist group
Mudiad Amddiffyn Cymru. Imprisoned for a bombing campaign in Wales and surrounding areas. 15:22, 18 December 2020 (UTC)
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Support. Pretty well sourced, in the process of replacing some references to his website. Per below, filmography needs work. Most parts of the filmography are now cited.
Yeeno (
talk) 🍁22:37, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Folks, sorry about this, but, the filmography section is almost fully unsourced. Will have to be sourced prior to going to homepage / RD.
Ktin (
talk)
22:42, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I've got it down to seven, but getting nothing on those. Is it okay to remove them if I've made a good faith effort to cite? Many single episode appearances, and I just don't see anyone documenting that for posterity. GreatCaesarsGhost14:15, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Amazing work citing everything. If you still want to keep them for possible future work, you can comment it out. But if you're sure you can't find it, then it should probably be removed.
Yeeno (
talk) 🍁19:06, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Indian businessman. I have not read the article in detail. Surely some amount of rewrites will be required. Will get to it this evening. Posting this here in case someone wants to get started prior to me getting to it. Update: Been a long day, have not able to get to this, will have it picked tomorrow. Edits done. Rewrote most of the article to avoid reading like a corporate press release. Meets hygiene requirements for homepage / RD.
Ktin (
talk)
19:14, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Needs much better sourcing. The entire career section is sourced to a single article of 2010, now offline, so out of date and quality unjudgeable. Despite some editing to tone it down, it still reads like a corporate press release. Also no personal life beyond childhood, a >30-year period between birth and setting up R N Shetty & Company which is largely undocumented.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
04:50, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Edits done per request above. Rewrote most of the content to avoid reading like a press release. Meets hygiene conditions for homepage / RD.
Ktin (
talk)
05:53, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Since I'm currently the lone support on this, I'd prefer another admin to cast eyes on it, or at least one more support, before it's posted. Cheers —
Amakuru (
talk)
17:08, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oh, and I've just noticed that I was not in the "please post" ping, but in the "thanks Amakuru" ping so I should definitely read messages fully next time! —
Amakuru (
talk)
17:09, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Nominator's comments: We posted the original WADA ruling last December
[24] where Russia was outright banned from the Olympics for four years. This appeal ruling drastically cuts that to still allow Russia to compete but as a "Neutral Athlete/Team" for a period of two years. Among other factors.
Masem (
t)
19:03, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment The news reports that they can appeal against this decision made on an accepted appeal (
AP). Are we going to post it every time the penalties are reduced upon accepted appeals until the ban is lifted?--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
20:10, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
If the appeal results in a significantly different outcome, yes. I would consider that the change from "Can't participate at all for 4 years" to "Can participate, but limited to 'Neutral' for 2 years" is a significantly different outcome here. When I first read this AP story and comprehended what it meant, I thought it was only a reduction from 4 to 2 years but otherwise under the same terms, and thus would have considered that not significant enough to post. But as I reviewed what we had already on the target article, it made sense this is a big change. --
Masem (
t)
20:24, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak support Target article is well referenced. Update is present and referenced. It's not very extensive, but it's enough I guess. --
Jayron3220:30, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support. Post now and post again, if and when Russia pays off enough officials to have the ban lifted completely. This shame bears beaing reposted. I am also adding a shorter alt blurb.
Nsk92 (
talk)
02:02, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. Much better than when I last looked, but still lacks important details eg education, civil service career 1975–95, date of first election to parliament, dates for early ministries, what he did as PM (there's a lot of detail on how he was ousted, but little else). I haven't checked the sources but do they really contain his actual thoughts on all the wheeling and dealing? Better to rephrase out of Wikipedia's voice.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
01:56, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Comment. I've hidden some material that needs sourcing, and requested other sources. Has anyone been able to check the non-English sources, particularly for the negative material?
Espresso Addict (
talk)
03:50, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
All non-English sources are legit (I put most of them in the article), I can asure you. Although none of my Kharkiv friends told me that his nickname "Gepa" (see "Personal life"-section) stood for "Butt".... And they really did not like him and this nickname was widely used for him in Kharkiv. It might be better to delete this translation, although this translation is sourced the source does not say that Mr. Kernes was called "
Butt-Head". — Yulia Romero •
Talk to me!16:45, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I was able to find a reference for some of the awards. Although I fail to see why a certificate given by a town of 15.000 people (which is
Bohodukhiv) should even be mentioned in the article anyway.... The Ukrainian and Russian Wikipedia's (both languages are used by Kharkivites) only mention 2 awards given to Mr. Kernes and those 2 are both referenced in Mr. Kernes English Wikipedia article. I suggest to simply delete the unreferenced awards. Wikipedia is not an almanac of mayors of Kharkiv,
Manchester,
Tokyo nor
Nagoya etc. — Yulia Romero •
Talk to me!16:22, 20 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Hanif Al Husaini: His date of death is given as 17 December in the header and infobox but is not in the main text and I couldn't see any citation supporting a 17 December death date (only that it was announced on 17 December) -
Dumelow (
talk)
08:19, 24 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose. a) There are already seven football events per year on
WP:ITNR; I don't think the sport needs even more coverage. b) I don't remember us ever posting blurbs about individual awards in other team sports. c) The article
The Best FIFA Women's Player is little more than a stub, indicating how little interest there is in this award. d) It's strange not to include the men's award that was announced at the same time. e) The
Ballon d'Or is a more prestigious award.
Modest Geniustalk18:02, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I was surprised to find that the Ballon d'Or doesn't appear to be ITN/R, but it wasn't awarded this year, so that seems to be moot. If we post this, we definitely should have both men's and women's together.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
00:10, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support - definitely worthy and the article quality looks good. Could more be written about the award and the circumstances? Why was she awarded, any reaction, etc.? — Martin (
MSGJ ·
talk)
22:33, 18 December 2020 (UTC)reply
First MinisterMark Drakeford announces that all non-essential retail, leisure and fitness centres, as well as all hospitality premises will be closed as of December 25. The country will also move to the highest "Level 4" restrictions beginning December 28, which means that people will be ordered to limit their Christmas gatherings to only two households.
(Sky News)
Prime MinisterMette Frederiksen announces that the
country will impose a full nationwide
lockdown from December 25 to January 3 that will close malls, shops, and other non-essential activities during the holiday season. This comes after a record of nearly 3,700 new cases were reported in the past 24 hours.
(France 24)
Germany reports a record 952 new deaths in the past 24 hours, bringing the nationwide death toll to 23,427, according to data from the
Robert Koch Institute.
(DW)
The number of confirmed cases in
South Korea reaches a record 1,078 cases in the past 24 hours, bringing the nationwide total to 45,442 cases.
(Al Jazeera)
California reports a record 53,711 new cases and 293 deaths in the past 24 hours, bringing the total of confirmed cases to 1,671,081 cases and death toll to 21,481.
(KABC-TV)
New South Wales reports the first locally-transmitted case in two weeks, after a 45-year-old
Sydney man who drives international flight crews to and from the
Sydney Airport tested positive for COVID-19.
(ABC Australia)
A man arrested in the
Philippines in July 2019 is indicted by federal prosecutors in
New York for plotting to carry out a
9/11-style attack in the U.S. The suspect was allegedly directed by the terrorist organization
al-Shabaab to attend a flight school in the Philippines and research how to hijack a commercial airliner.
(NBC News)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Nominator's comments: A major disruption to the country's national expressway network that is not able to be remedied in a routine manner. Military is involved. The image included is of the expressway from two years ago. ❯❯❯ Mccunicano☕️06:45, 19 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Physics Nobel prize winner. Death announced today 12/16 in English Media, and yesterday, 12/15 in German media. Article requires some amount of work in referencing. Added citation needed tags in case someone wants to give it a go in the next couple of hours. Completed the referencing. If someone finds any other edits that are required, let me know. I will be up for the next three hours.
Ktin (
talk)
20:10, 16 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. The lead could do with expansion to include his major positions held and a summary in layperson's terms of the impact of his research. I also noticed that several claims in the text are only supported by primary sources or later reviews authored by Steinberger -- all of this needs to be sourced independently.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
06:42, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, while the lede can be expanded, can you be specific about the latter comment? The nature of research papers is that the papers themselves are the sources. I will not claim to be an expert on this topic, but, reading the article, it didn't jump out as something that I would rush to change.
Ktin (
talk)
06:48, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Not a physicist, but my understanding is that one can state "scientist researched x topic" with a primary source, but one can't state "scientist discovered x, proved y, or demonstrated z", or the like, without a secondary source.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
06:56, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
It's also a bit lacking in dates; I tried to construct a list of where he was when but there isn't precise enough info in most cases. In particular, the retirement date from CERN is missing.Espresso Addict (
talk)
07:06, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Espresso Addict, don't get me wrong, but, you've got to be more specific than this. The statement It's also a bit lacking in dates doesn't give me anything to work with, particularly when the article is littered with dates.
Ktin (
talk)
07:45, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Alright folks, I am calling it a night. I think the article as it stands is good to go to homepage / RD. Above feedback is good, but, to the extent that specific feedback has been provided, those have been incorporated. With this, I believe we should be good to go.
Ktin (
talk)
08:00, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Article needs updating The nominated event is listed on
WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet
WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.
Nominator's comments: Please note this has not happened yet but the return vessel is in the final approach stages to land in Inner Mongolia real soon now (next few hours of writing this). As confirmed by the Space News link, the return capsule has been successfully recovered. Since I've been one heavily cautioning about posting this until this point, I figure I will be one to get this going since this is the point I've said we should make ITN.
Masem (
t)
18:18, 16 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Replaced image with one which shows the lunar lander, lunar ascender, and return to earth modules.
Support. I have healthy scepticism of anything reported in Chinese state media, and the BBC and Guardian both caveat the news with 'Xinhua said' or similar, but there's no particular reason to doubt that the capsule has arrived in some form. We should probably avoid explicitly saying it was a success until there's independent confirmation. This is the right point to post this story and the article seems in good enough shape. I've added an altblurb.
Modest Geniustalk20:03, 16 December 2020 (UTC)reply
PS. There seems to be some back-and-forth reverting of the article regarding whether the capsule recovery has a reliable source. Maybe wait a few hours for that to settle down before posting.
Modest Geniustalk20:05, 16 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Good news organizations, if they can't have eyes on the actual event, nearly always use "According to (source), this happened..." and this is well beyond anything China related. I know we need to be cautious around China + state-sponsored media, but let's not go overboard here. --
Masem (
t)
00:31, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. In the UK, the BBC now seems to be stating in its own voice, while The Guardian is still quoting Xinhua. It would be nice to get two independent non-Chinese sources stating success directly. An alternative would be to post the main blurb, deleting the word "successfully".
Espresso Addict (
talk)
00:27, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
There are times where we should be cautious of the China-state sponsored media for what they report, but their space program is not one of those things they seem to "make up" compared to other factors related to governance. The fact that the Guardian and AP take Xinhua at their word should be sufficient for us here. --
Masem (
t)
00:30, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
This. The only time (I recall) I posted my own nom was a clear SNOW support for the death of Stephen Hawking. This nom wasn't a clear SNOW due to source questioning. --
Masem (
t)
19:51, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Article updated Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see
this RFC and
further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets
WP:ITNRD.
Nominator's comments: Known for anti-gay, pro-police activism in Hong Kong and as an opponent of the city's pro-democracy movement. feminist
(talk)12:50, 16 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. The lead now needs expanding again. I haven't looked in detail at the sourcing, but is it possible to find a different source for Ref. 24, about her son? The title of the current one appears unduly negative about a living person.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
07:10, 17 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Seeing uncited sentences here and there; the credits section needs a lot more sources and the awards are completely unsourced.Gotitbro (
talk)
00:58, 15 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support I'm not sure how standard some of the table formatting is, but everything is cited. Looks like we can confirm Playbill archives for Broadway credits.
Kingsif (
talk)
17:27, 15 December 2020 (UTC)reply
In addition to needing the copied material on his career and awards rewritten and replaced, little of it seems to be cited to proper independent sources; usually all awards need a proper source, not just the academic bio. The material on his research that I removed as a copyvio was cut and pasted from the bio, and so was not an independent appraisal of its significance.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
05:07, 16 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support Seems cited fine enough, though there's a bit of odd grammar in "Enembe remarked that 'Papuans should be reach the rank of general, either in the police or in the armed forces'". I'm not sure if that's translation error or just a mistake on his behalf, so I'm not willing to remove it.
Gex4pls (
talk)
18:57, 15 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment from a duplicated nomination: Austrian physicist. Unfortunately, I couldn't find the news in English media. Article is a tad small in size, but is start-class. Article seems to pass hygiene requirements for homepage / RD. I did not have to make any edits. But, if there are any edits required, I can give it a go, albeit with Google Translate as my aide.
Ktin (
talk)
03:43, 16 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment Wasn't this linked to relations with Israel of Sudan? Also this is stale now, was already known/"in the news" a few weeks back; this is just procedural.
Gotitbro (
talk)
00:55, 15 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Well, I think this one warrants an article, but it's abundantly clear the SST label is political BS. Witness Iraq being removed only for the length of their war with Iran. GreatCaesarsGhost14:14, 15 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose We need to be wary of any policy decision that is being made during the
lame duck period of Trump's presidency, as all are subject to change subsequent to Biden taking office in January.--WaltCip-(
talk)14:08, 15 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose on quality. Article is really bare bones at the moment. The lead needs expanding to actually cover the details of this eclipse (it is mostly about eclipses in general right now). And the "Visibility" section has no refs at all. —
Amakuru (
talk)
20:42, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment: the article is poorly referenced and has minimal prose. Given that most observing events were cancelled due to COVID, there might not be much to say about this particular eclipse, which is a shame. I'd be surprised if there aren't at least a dozen popular news stories though.
Modest Geniustalk12:01, 15 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose on quality little more than a stub, and poorly referenced. Particularly the sections on Argentina and Chile- though that may be due to the pandemic.
Joseph2302 (
talk)12:18, 15 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. I haven't looked at sourcing but the tone veers out of encyclopedic in several places, there's no section on his personal life (marriage, children?), and his activities after retiring in 2011 only seem to be mentioned in the lead.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
10:50, 15 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:ITN candidateSupport RD once article is expanded beyond stub tier, and willing to support blurb on the significance of an incumbent head of government dying, especially being the first incumbent to die of COVID-19, despite the fact that Eswatini is officially a monarchy. Vanilla Wizard 💙01:49, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
support The article is well sourced and has enough information. Not only being the first incumbent world leader to die in office because of Covid, but Eswatini is notable for its traditions and status in the world as an absouloute monarchy. I would be willing to support a blurb as well
Cavejohnson13 (
talk)
02:05, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
He died in a South African hospital while being treated for COVID-19, so the consensus among sources is that COVID is the assumed cause of death, but it's fair to say that this is still just an assumption unless or until Eswatini officials announce it. Nearly every result for the term "eswatini" in DuckDuckGo's
news tab reads something along the lines of "dies after testing positive for COVID-19", but it's also true that his cause of death still remains unspecified for the time being. If he's notable enough for a blurb regardless of the cause of death, then we can post it without mentioning the cause of death and update the blurb once we get some sort of confirmation from Eswatini. Otherwise, if the cause of death being COVID is what makes the story notable, then we can post it to RD first and then move it to a blurb if it gets announced that he died of COVID. Vanilla Wizard 💙02:45, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Precedent His more successful predecessor was nommed in nearly identical circumstances two years ago and went stale after weak RD support, worth a link, I can't paste.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
03:26, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support RD I don't mind changing this to blurb if a few more sources on his life and premiership can be added, right now I would say it is a "high-quality" stub.
Albertaont (
talk)
06:10, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weakly support blurb in principle, as a deceased sitting head of government. If it turns out he died from Covid, we can (but by no means must) break the "no Covid blurbs until it's over" guideline and mention it in the blurb. –
John M Wolfson (
talk •
contribs) 06:25, 14 December 2020 (UTC)Oppose blurb per absolute monarchy. –
John M Wolfson (
talk •
contribs)
07:49, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Neither does the prime minister hold real power in Eswatini (the king does), nor is the article up to par for an RD let alone a blurb.
Gotitbro (
talk)
07:10, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support RD contingent on article's expansion and outright oppose for a blurb. I fail to see any significance of a prime minister, albeit sitting, in an absolute monarchy and the fact that the article is merely a stub at the time of his death tells a lot.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
07:38, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
oppose blurb I think we should blurb prime ministers from constitutional monarchies and parliamentary republics only ( and maybe semi-presidential republics as well),but since Eswatini is an absolute monarchy, I don't think he's blurb-worthy
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
07:42, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
There were several unaddressed opposes with this one even before posting, and it needs improvement before it would be ready for the main page. No detail on his premiership at all. Please can someone remove it. Cheers —
Amakuru (
talk)
23:04, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Footy is well covered by ITN/R, and some special reasoning would be needed to post another tournament that isn't on the list. MLS is widely considered an inferior league to the leagues that we do blurb. Iridescent is also correct that, while the article is substantive, the update is not. –
Muboshgu (
talk)
20:30, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Even if we pretended if there was a Big Five (and NASCAR would probably be the 5th, so Big Six I guess), the other leagues are also the consensus top leagues in their respective sports while the MLS is not.
Teemu08 (
talk)
14:36, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose. A minor competition in world football terms. We can't publish every country's champion, and sticking with those listed on ITNR is plenty of coverage.
Modest Geniustalk14:40, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment He seems like a popular figure. His death due to Covid is notable, as is the trend of his songs. I'm not quite supporting it because something is going on with the reference tag down at the bottom. –
Cavejohnson13 (
talk)
22:23, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment.Support. I went in and added sources / citations for the awards section. The main article still has some
Template:Cn tags if someone has a few cycles to source them. Cheers. . Nice stuff
Template:U in seeing this one through!
Ktin (
talk)
04:34, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support. This is a no brainer, there have been multiple recent RD's that were far worse but because they had 5 sentences with 5 references that somehow qualified them for RD since they were "well-referenced".
Albertaont (
talk)
04:35, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. It's mostly there, I guess, but it is very stubby at present. Can't we have more information on the nature and stance of "Amadnews", for example? —Brigade Piron (
talk)
20:27, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support blurb Just heard about it. Shame our media is silent about it, I guess Biden really is banking on renewing the nuclear deal. Anyhow, I think his death is highly unusual. Being executed for your journalist integrity under the charge of "corruption on Earth" after being lured into your country by an islamic extremist analogue of CIA/KGB? Now that doesn't happen every day.
CoronaOneLove (
talk)
00:02, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose This has gotten no coverage compared to the execution of the Iranian scientist, nor is this particularly noteworthy. Also more general concerns with article quality and the fact that it is a stub.
Albertaont (
talk)
01:00, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb Capital punishment is not uncommon in Iran with several hundreds executions every year, so this is not a ruling with an extraordinary rare outcome. Also, the media report that the journalist was found guilty on corruption charges and, according to the
Iranian law, such crimes usually end up with execution. As for the reactions, it's normal to see
Reporters Without Borders and the media worldwide condemning the execution of their colleague but, frankly speaking, so much ado is done only in cases when the victims are journalists (they are not sacrosancts and cannot be pardoned for whatever they do).--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
10:15, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb Don't see the coverage here. Meanwhile, the article claims his death was on both the 11th and the 12th December, and the blurb doesn't fit with "(The Islamic Guard) announced they had lured Zam back to Iran and arrested him, although according to other sources he had been arrested in Iraq".
Black Kite (talk)10:44, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support RD only – Per TRM, Kiril. The execution was fairly widely covered, but was what one would expect from the Iranian theocracy. –
Sca (
talk)
13:22, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
That's obviously a know-it-when-I-see-it proposition, but the "Arrest and execution" section is only a paragraph long, and the "Reactions" section has only three reactions that are mostly straight quotes. –
John M Wolfson (
talk •
contribs)
08:59, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
He doesn't readily meet blurb material. "spy novel authors" is rather a niche area of writing overall, so while he may have been a big name in that small part of that field, as an overall writer, he's not rather groundbreaking. --
Masem (
t)
03:50, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I don't think it's fair to pigeonhole it by genre. There is limited information on his sales figures, but one source notes he sold
3.55 million books between 1998 and 2018 - already thirty years after his main period of prominence. —Brigade Piron (
talk)
08:43, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support RD only I am revealing my ignorance here, but based on the comments I assumed this was the author of James Bond works. On reading through I was surprised to see that it's an author that only wrote two works that I can recall. I can't see how this should go up as a blurb.
130.233.213.199 (
talk)
08:46, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Yes, certainly that's misguided thinking. Le Carré was a fine author, far superior to Fleming in every sense. And just because you can only recall two of his books, I'm not clear why that should influence whether this is a blurb or not.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
08:51, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support RD definitely good enough right now, ambivalent on blurb, certainly a English-language literary giant, but as people are declaring "popular fiction" to be niche and the individual isn't American, I guess this is a non-starter.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
08:51, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support RD only – While justly famous within his genre, Le Carre's historical fiction seems less than 'transformative' for English lit. –
Sca (
talk)
14:04, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
weak support I think almost everything in the article is cited,but since this is a biography, shouldn't there be a section that talks about his personal life?
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
11:14, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment I found it hard to find mention of the solving in the article (it's in a text box in small print) perhaps it should be more prominently mentioned in the article, if that is where we are pointing readers to with the blurb.
JW 1961Talk23:37, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose While quite interesting, I don't really see how people figuring out what a killer tried to say in one of many statements is news.
Gex4pls (
talk)
23:45, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose, propose SNOW close. Interesting tidbit and good faith nom, but hardly making headlines or having lasting significance. Pretty much impossible to pass, anyway.
Juxlos (
talk)
01:29, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:Re As mentioned in the template above notability is not a criteria for
WP:ITN/R (recurring items) or
WP:ITN/RD (recent deaths) only the articles need to be of competent quality, i.e., meet basic sourcing/size. Only blurbs should be debated be bated on their notability.
Gotitbro (
talk)
03:53, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Ok; let me be more clear; sorry if I wasn't clearer before; but if you went to a printed encyclopedia, would you ever find it on the main page? Generally, that's my criteria. --
HurricaneTracker49518:05, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. Pulling the above has potentially left a last-minute slot for this, but I'm uncomfortable posting an article where more than half of the text is controversy.
Espresso Addict (
talk)
23:47, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose a editor copy and pasted a move and now the page history is split. the article is too much of a mess. so oppose for now.
GuzzyG (
talk)
10:51, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I'd not consider that page a reliable source even though its likely true (the home page is "best online casinos".... --
Masem (
t)
16:00, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
ITN articles, as part of being the main page are supposed to highlight some of WP's best work. Lack of sourcing is not our best work. A highly questional RS to source films is not our best work. The problem is that these are BLPs before they died and are supposed to be in far better shape per BLP policy but people don't edit them appropriate when they add information. That's not ITN's fault that editors didn't do their jobs in the years before. --
Masem (
t)
18:31, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
That ITN looks at article quality is not my opinion, that's the purpose of ITN. While what is "quality" is subjective for sourcing, the lack of quality sourcing for any of the filmography is clearly and objectively not appropriate. --
Masem (
t)
18:56, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I appreciate your work, if that counts (and added the Grantland feature in 2017). But wrestling's curse is strong here, and this actor got too close. That's my conclusion, if it counts.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
01:03, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
As for
Template:U, the idea that advertising a legal casino makes a source "highly questional" is where your opinion perverts appreciation of facts you admit are "likely true". In my opinion, you should stop distrusting casinos, they've gone mainstream. As a matter of fact, commercial media is questionable, not illegal.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
04:27, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I am just saying that a site that purports to describe the best online casinos and no other signs of reliability is a far cry for reliability for a BLP (of which Lister is still under). Just because the website name shares the same as Lister doesn't mean it has any association with him at all. --
Masem (
t)
05:06, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I will never understand how a hypothetically miscredited bit role (or even a few) is potentially harmful to a dead person's survivors. But it's just one source, among a now-ridiculous number. Relax the restrictiveness, I say.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
05:14, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The reason his page is getting page views is for being a character actor in a fair number of films. That would be inappropriate to remove that section. --
Masem (
t)
18:02, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I agree. But if that's what it takes to sway the naysayers... 200+ acting credits per CNN, and the list is incomplete. Sourcing every appearance is a
Sisyphusian effort that I will not choose to do. Article is in my opinion otherwise well sourced. But butting my head against this wall is
futile. 7&6=thirteen (
☎)18:55, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
It's not ITN's fault that editors failed to follow BLP's policy when they added his credits without sources in building up the article. --
Masem (
t)
19:09, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:U, I am pinging
Template:Ping for their guidance since the carousel might move past this date anytime now. I think part of the problem is also because
WP:IMDB is not allowed as a source for filmography, if that is allowed, it will solve a significant problem. I see IMDB has over 200+ entries for this subject. I also agree with
Template:U that some of these are beyond this group. Good luck.
Ktin (
talk)
20:13, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Stale - unfortunately it's now too late for this one. The oldest RD is currently from the 12 December. There do seem to have been a glut of them today, and more possibly on the way. —
Amakuru (
talk)
20:18, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment Ref 2 is used only to support the relation to an uncle, which can be inferred by other references. What's the standard here? Is it enough to put two references that can infer the relationship logically ([1]Garry is the son of Leslie and [2] Leslie is the brother of Steven) or does there need to be an explicit statement from an RS ([1]Garry is Steven's nephew)?
130.233.213.199 (
talk)
09:17, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment A lot of paras in the bio & awards sections are unreferenced. A long list of sources is given at the end but need inline cites. Could also do well with a biblio (if original works exist).
Gotitbro (
talk)
09:24, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Thanks for the heads-up. I just looked at the article now and the "failed verification" is gone and everything seems to have been referenced.
Tradediatalk17:50, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Too many unsourced paras with the filmography being completely unsourced, also please find a more apt image for the infobox (at the peak of her career etc.) now that she is deceased.
Gotitbro (
talk)
04:44, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Surely the current image—from 2010, when she was the main character on the country's most-watched TV programme—
Template:Em the peak of her career? Carry On was a vehicle for Sid James and Kenneth Williams; people tend to remember Windsor as more associated with them than she actually was, she didn't even appear in most of them. ‑
Iridescent07:21, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment It does appear important but I am conflicted as to how significant or headline grabbing this is when compared to the Israel recognitions.
Gotitbro (
talk)
23:03, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Looks like the Morocco recognition of Israel is linked to this which definitely makes it more significant. If the (now closed) blurb from below can be combined onto here that would be better reflection of the situation.
Gotitbro (
talk)
23:17, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Doesn't that mean that (X-40) UN member states implicitly recognize Moroccan sovereignty over W.S.? And besides,
American policy on Western Sahara conflict section in the Morocco–US relations article seems to indicate that Trump's statement is simply an explicit restatement of existing policy that W.S. is sovereign Moroccan territory.
Juxlos (
talk)
22:51, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support on principle, oppose on quality. As noted earlier, I thought this was the more notable outcome of the Morocco/United States/Israel agreement. However, the target article currently lacks a number of citations, which must be fixed before it can be blurbed.
NorthernFalcon (
talk)
05:11, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose but would support if merged with Morocco's normalised relations with Israel. I don't see how recognising Morocco's claim over a territory that is also claimed by a state effectively recognised by only around 50 countries in the world is important. A vast najority of the UN member states (including all permanent member states of the Security Council) don't recognise
SADR, which goes in favour of Morocco's claim over that territory. Additionally, the United States has never recognised SADR, so their support of Morocco's claim is not really big news.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
09:02, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
support alt blurb First country recognizing anything is generally significant to global politics as opposed to 163rd country doing so,however,I believe it's important to mention the full extent of the agreement
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
12:42, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I honestly don't know: does the fact that this is being done by a lame duck president matter? Biden could revoke recognition in 40 days right? And normally state recognition is a domino game; that won't happen here. GreatCaesarsGhost13:02, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Would Biden do that though? I don't see why the US would have any interest in supporting the SADR. Considering the US provided arms support to Morocco during the Western Sahara war, I think the recognition is here to stay. Has Biden ever made a statement about the dispute?
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
14:29, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose A country recognizing another country, and another country recognizing the former's disputed land as belonging to the former. Doesn't really seem important.
Gex4pls (
talk)
13:07, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose same as below; the article update is insufficient. In the case of both of the bolded articles, there is a single, short sentence in the lead that is the total amount of information about the subject; even more important neither article currently discusses the deal itself. If you want this posted, you should include a lot more prose in the target article, so that we have something worthwhile for people to read. --
Jayron3214:14, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose. I suspect that Biden will most likely ignore this recognition and hope people forget about it(doubtful he actually reverses this).
331dot (
talk)
14:17, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose. The "big wow" arguments aren't entirely fair, as by doing this the US is essentially sending a massive "fuck you" to the African Union (in African terms, this is roughly as inflammatory as formal US recognition of the Turkish occupation of northern Cyprus would be in terms of relationship with European institutions or that a US recognition of Pakistani claims to Kashmir would have on relations with India), but if you need a lengthy explanation before most readers can understand the significance, it's generally not suitable for a short-format ITN blurb. ‑
Iridescent16:49, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support. The first international recognition of the annexation of Western Sahara is a big deal in its own right. Coupled with Morocco's recognition, I think it is easily ITN-worthy in a way which the recognition of a Gulf states is not. Morocco is a serious regional power in its own right. —Brigade Piron (
talk)
22:00, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose currently, 40 countries, never including the United States, recognize W.S.' independence. Implicitly this means that 150-160 countries recognize that the region is Moroccan sovereign territory, and as the US has never recognized WS the only other option is recognizing that the region is Moroccan. The United States seem to have a past stance which also sides with Morocco, too, and this announcement is just reiterating existing policy.
Juxlos (
talk)
22:54, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Sidenote: the AP source mentions nowhere the claim that the US was the first country to recognize Moroccan sovereignty over the region (the "first" is Morocco recognizing the US back in 1777) and I'm reasonably sure putting that blurb on ITN would count as a hoax.
Juxlos (
talk)
22:57, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
This Al Jazeera source mentions that "William Lawrence, a professor of political science and international affairs at the American University, said the move “makes the US … the first country in the entire world to recognise the Moroccan claim”."
Hanif Al Husaini (
talk)
04:48, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
This is interesting as Morocco was the first country to ally with USA, very soon after it declared independence and it has been an ally of America ever since. And though it makes far, far, far less human rights violations than Palestinians Western Sahara doesn't want to recognize Israel so it's hard to imagine why anyone would expect the US might recognize them. Unfortunate if you're Sahrawi when some less deserving governments are full UN members but they've got some bad luck.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
15:26, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Maybe there's an asterisk somewhere like the US considered the Axis government they fought an illegitimate coup of the real Moroccan government? Like how the Polish government in exile was the real government and Hitler the fake one. Of course the Axis Moroccans would instead consider it the Moroccan patriots saving the country from things like the bad Moroccans with these German chaps conveniently here to bleed with us.
Sagittarian Milky Way (
talk)
17:44, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I was always under the impression that Morocco viewed both the Third Republic and Vichy France to be oppressive,but being a French protectorate didn't give them much choice during the war.I do know that when Roosevelt met Sultan Mohammed V, he said that he was confident that Morocco would have an independent future,which further fuelled the liberation movement in the country. But I think we're going off topic here
Scaramouche33 (
talk)
18:14, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose only because this is like "gay marriage" recognition - ITN can't support a nom from every country that acknowledges Israel here. --
Masem (
t)
17:42, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support only because it's a country from the Arab world. In fact, any normalisation of the diplomatic relations between Arab countries and Israel is big news.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
18:13, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Article update is shorter than the blurb. If THIS is all of the information that the highlighted article has on the topic, maybe we don't need to post it in ITN? --
Jayron3218:16, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment I believe it is more notable that the United States has become the first nation to formally recognize Moroccan sovereignty over Western Sahara, which it has done as part of this deal. Morocco becoming the fourth Arab state to recognize Israel is not as notable.
NorthernFalcon (
talk)
19:00, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:Ping, pardon the intrusion. This is ready for posting onto homepage / RD. I was waiting for a bit to see if a couple of December 7 articles would move in, but, seems like they are not ready. Let's go ahead.
Ktin (
talk)
19:02, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:Ping, pardon the intrusion. This is ready for posting onto homepage / RD. I was waiting for a bit to see if a couple of December 7 articles would move in, but, seems like they are not ready. Let's go ahead.
Ktin (
talk)
19:02, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:U, Please consider posting
WP:ITNRD from the bottom of the stack given that the carousel moves pretty fast. There are articles below including
Dick Allen which were potentially ready, but, now run the risk of having the carousel move past. This one could have waited until those were posted.
Ktin (
talk)
08:35, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:Re I was working through the page (while I had some time) and I have now added some of the others. Dick Allen seems to still need some discussion though, so I left it for now. Regards
SoWhy10:42, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Please read about
systemic bias. We do have African readers. And it doesn't matter if we did or not. Ghana is a sovereign state and its elections are ITNR. I'm sure one or two Ghanians might find their way to this page; if I were you I'd consider retracting your statement.
331dot (
talk)
23:26, 9 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment I've added an alternative blurb to emphasise his re-election. The phrase 'second term' has broader meaning and may be misunderstood as second assumption of the office.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
09:03, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I do and had to check if he was re-elected just to make sure that it has the same meaning. Also, I can't remember if we've ever used this wording for a re-elected president before.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
17:11, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose I agree with previous comments, after looking at the article, I believe there is not enough information that has been properly sourced to warrant inclusion for "In the News".
Jurisdicta (
talk)
05:25, 9 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Interesting and perhaps DYK, but not really a news-breaking type thing compared to everything else going on. --
Masem (
t)
14:51, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Doesn't really seem like "encyclopedic news" and more like a fun fact for the main page of nat geo (though this would make a good dyk, per above)
Gex4pls (
talk)
15:04, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose – Per previous posts. Reminds me in a way of an old TV ad for a cigarette that was "a silly millimeter longer." ;-) —
Sca (
talk)
15:21, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support Well referenced but there is 1 dead link (Ref 13 that IABot couldn't fix) if someone with Rugby knowledge could get a new reference for that
JW 1961Talk18:43, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose first proposed blurb as written. I did see this where I am this morning, but the breakthrough would have been the approval of the vaccine, not the first person to receive it outside of a trial. Perhaps a more general blurb that the UK is the first to approve and administer a vaccine, but I don't think we need to use this person's name.
331dot (
talk)
13:58, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurbs as written. Focus should be on the beginning of non-clinical trial rollout, rather than who is the first to receive a vaccine.--WaltCip-(
talk)14:03, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment I don't think I have ever editing this article before, let alone significantly updated it. Did you forget to change it when copying the template?
MSG17 (
talk)
14:11, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose – Hype. Other Brits already have been vaccinated. And would we run a blurb every time someone in some 'notable' country is the first to be vaccinated? No. –
Sca (
talk)
14:27, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
As I understand it this is the first one worldwide, right? I guess we've always said that only highly significant Covid blurbs would be posted outside of the ubiquitous box-at-the-top. Perhaps this one is it, because it could signify the beginning of the end of the pandemic, but I'm slightly undecided on that point. —
Amakuru (
talk)
15:17, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Another consideration is that thousands were vaccinated in pre-release tests. And the recipient of the first official UK shot,
Margaret Keenan, bless her 90-year-old heart, is not herself independently notable. –
Sca (
talk)
15:51, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose. If we had wanted to carry a vaccine story, I think the point of approval would have been more logical. There is no obvious importance in the physical act of injecting it, especially since the Russian vaccine has already blurred the border between trial and roll-out stages. I suspect the hype comes from
British internal politics and the desire for the government to look better amid the Brexit talks... —Brigade Piron (
talk)
15:27, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose. Covid vaccines are already in the banner and consensus was against posting the UK approval of this vaccine. There's nothing particularly notable about the first dose after approval compared to the last one during the trials phase.
Modest Geniustalk16:07, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose The proposed blurb, altblurb and altblurb2 are incorrect. People have been vaccinated with
Sputnik V well before the Pfizer vaccination commenced in the UK. The only accurate blurb is altblurb3. However, the wording of altblurb3 revelas that this news isn't such a big deal after all, but PR coming from Pfizer.
Chrisclear (
talk)
19:11, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose and suggest closure per
WP:SNOW. Firstly, this is already covered with the COVID-19 banner on the top. Secondly, vaccination of people with
Sputnik V has already been reported, which automatically makes most of the blurbs incorrect. Thirdly, it's not our business to make celebrities of those who have taken the vaccine first. Fourthly, the only correct blurb would be the one including
Pfizer but we can't accept it per
WP:PROMOTION.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
20:24, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose at this time. When up against COVID, one death/400 infections is a ripple. It might grow to something larger, but at this point, we can't tell if this is a significant event relative to everything else going on. --
Masem (
t)
05:28, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Dead guy died an "unrelated" death, the sick are mostly better now (hundredish "left hospitalized" are stable), the disease has no name, no known cause and no apparent reason to fear it.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
06:57, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose As the creator and nommed updater, I agree with everyone else. Preliminary results indicate that the disease is not contagious and instead arises from contaminated water and/or milk, so although more people could also fall ill and this is a quite tragic turn of events. I don't think it will be enough to be major. Additionally, considering that there is both a more important Indian event and a global pandemic on ITN currently, I don't think it fits. Although cases have risen to 500, over 75% of them have now been discharged.
MSG17 (
talk)
14:11, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Wait It looks like a pollution incident, possible organophosphates contaminating drinking water. At most there has been one death. If deaths regrettably increase or if some surprising mechanism is discovered, might be worth posting.
JehochmanTalk16:00, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support RD. The nominator has considerably improved the article, in particular by adding references (helped by the multitude of obituaries!).
Thincat (
talk)
10:34, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Looking at the article, unfortunately I have to oppose at the moment due to uncited paragraphs and no prose update for his death. This would be a damn shame to miss, however. (And yes, there is probably some level of dispute to whether he "really was" the first to break the sound barrier, but he is the canonical first supersonic.) –
John M Wolfson (
talk •
contribs)
04:20, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Why is this a blurb no-brainer exactly? Not to downplay his significance, but he was exceptionally old, and I'm not sure if he's still much of a household name. Considering
John Glenn and
John Lewis didn't meet blurb criteria, I'd like to see some rationale. As for the article, it's in better shape than I expected, though does need some work before it's main page ready.
Nohomersryan (
talk)
04:29, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:Yo All of the space firsts, from Armstrong to Shephard to Gagarin to Glenn, follow from his achievement of breaking the sound barrier. If anything, the fact that he lived for so long after his achievement makes this even more incredible and interesting; even if, for the sake of argument, no one knew who Chuck Yeager was anymore (doubtful, since I'm just shy of 24 and knew of him in high school), readers would be astounded to know that the person who broke the sound barrier was still alive for so long. Indeed, if this is a blurb the story it would bump off is the Indian strikes, which is a good target for Ongoing, so that argument against a blurb is moot here as well. –
John M Wolfson (
talk •
contribs)
04:40, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I'd argue that John Glenn was the third man to orbit the earth; John Lewis, while an important member of the Big Six, was secondary to Martin Luther King Jr. in the civil rights movement; but Chuck Yeager was the first man to break the sound barrier. That said, while I would agree with a Yeager blurb, I don't think Yeager is a "no-brainer."
NorthernFalcon (
talk)
05:12, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Very minor point, but we no longer consider Newsweek a reliable source at all. Not that others have reported (eg
NYtimes) but just as a reminder for the future. --
Masem (
t)
04:43, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose on quality for now. When the article has been fixed, I would offer a weak support for blurb. We have had a number of blurb deaths recently, but the deaths of major world figures seem to come in bunches, and Yeager certainly meets the definition of "transformational figure in their field", as Yeager is arguably the most famous post-World War II aircraft pilot in the world, as well as the holder of a major aviation first. However, I think Yeager does suffer from having lived so long that his memory has been partially forgotten, particularly by the younger generations who perhaps are less aware of the significance of the sound barrier achievement. I would caution against quickly posting this as a blurb until we've had more weigh-in from the rest of the world.
NorthernFalcon (
talk)
04:58, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose on Blurb, support for RD A stretch to call him transformational, he was right person selected for the right flight. He doesn't clears the bar for blurb (which has been set very high), and this shows US bias.
Albertaont (
talk)
05:34, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I knew what he did, but my generally less-informed brother who remembers what Neil Armstrong is known for did not. He said he didn't care after I explained. Canadians who care remember the name, but he's not the Babe Ruth of aeronautics like Armstrong became (nor as obscure as
the recently deceased Neil Armstrong). He's like Pat Patterson or Bruce Prichard to people who only remember Vincent Kennedy McMahon, dammit. Not biased to credit an American, that barrier was a problem for pilots and missiles across the planet. Early intercontinental champion, you could say.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
09:03, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support blurb Transformative figure, while I acknowledge there is US bias when nominated RD blurbs, I can see here that he is notable enough to merit a blurb and it so happens to be he's American. I'll fix up the article. --
TDKR Chicago 101 (
talk)
05:50, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb per VoC. If anything, it's an achievement attributable to the engineers who designed the plane. Yeager wasn't transformative in his own right. —
Amakuru (
talk)
09:11, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Reliable sources do not typically give engineers the glory, but those who take the risk and operate a new technology. Wikipedia follows the sources.
331dot (
talk)
10:25, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Not true. Unless there's something spectacular about the pilot's efforts, they tend to herald the feat, rather than the individual. This was how the Aberdeen Press and Journal recorded it when the news broke:
Which seems to focus primarily on the achievement, with the name of the pilot as a mention. In any case, while Wikipedia does follow the sources, it's up to us on this page to determine which individuals get blurbed, and the bar is rightly very high. I just don't see Yeager as transformative or the "Nelson Mandela" of his field. —
Amakuru (
talk)
12:59, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support blurb. Regardless of his own participation, Yeager was certainly the public face of a project which, in itself, was transformative. The analogy to an astronaut is a reasonable one. —Brigade Piron (
talk)
10:19, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose On quality, a lot of uncited paras here and other. Conflicted about a blurb if the issues are fixed, he is clearly notable in the US with a 'first' to his name but the notability doesn't go beyond that.
Gotitbro (
talk)
11:29, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb I'm baffled as to how this could be considered a no-brainer or how breaking the sound barrier is in any way comparable to being the first person to step foot on the Moon. He is nowhere near as well known as Armstrong.
P-K3 (
talk)
13:30, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb - In a field of highly competent test pilots - a category that includes other greats such as
Jim McDivitt,
Wally Schirra,
Alan Shepard, and of course
Neil Armstrong himself - he happened to be the one that broke the sound barrier. But that doesn't have the same impact to humanity as Neil being the first man on the Moon did. Great guy, but not a sui generis blurbable figure.--WaltCip-(
talk)13:42, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Strongly Support blurb - He's not notable for only one event. He was a fighter ace, which he achieved in one day. He is most remembered for breaking the sound barrier, which is a landmark achievement in human history, and certainly more impressive than
a career actor. --
Veggies (talk)
14:16, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Marked Ready The article has 66 citations, at least three were added in the last 24 hours. The number of uncited paragraphs is a small fraction of the total. There are no maintenance tags on the article. It is rated B-class prior to the numerous updates of the last 24 hours. As for "transformativeness", the fact that the death is front page news across the United States, and even on the BBC and ABC (Australia) websites at the moment (load them and ctrl-F for "Yeager"), indicates that the subject's legacy is very strong and that a blurb is appropriate.
JehochmanTalk14:25, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I opened to check and saw a wall of CN tags. it is definitely not ready, so I have removed that tag. Even one unsourced paragraph (outside the lede) is not appropriate for a bio , especially if editors are arguing for a blurb. --
Masem (
t)
14:40, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:U heavily tag bombed the article
[28] after I reviewed it. This is not
WP:FAC, but it seems like some editors want to treat it that way because they like to set higher standards for topics related to the United States. Sigh. The article quality is reasonably good and comparable to other articles we post here, and while it could be improved with more citations, none of the material lacking citations appears to be dubious.
JehochmanTalk14:50, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
It's a bio, still under BLP (per the recent death aspect), and thus still subject to the same sourcing standards. And bios at ITN we expect quality sourcing (this is why many actors and the like tend to not get posted because their bios are not fully sourced). --
Masem (
t)
14:55, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I think you're being too rigid. I agree that any potentially controversial fact in a bio must be cited. Looking at the article, the missing cites are a bunch of nit picking. The uncited statements could be removed and the article would remain intact and sufficient. All Wikipedia articles are works in progress. We should not let perfect be the enemy of good. Our readers are looking for information about this person now. We should deliver it on the home page.
JehochmanTalk15:00, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
That they have to type "chuck yeager" in the search bar vs a click in the ITN box should not be a reason to rush through an article that is currently at poor quality just to have it on the front page. Too many times in the page that's been rushed (importance over quality) only to have to pull back. Readers can still find the article, its not like we're hiding the article from total exposure at all. --
Masem (
t)
15:06, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:Ec I question your conceptual understanding of transformativeness if all that is required in your view is for the death to be front page news in that individual's country.--WaltCip-(
talk)14:52, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Yeager, 1947
Comment – Is that 1969 Air Force photo the best pic to illustrate this? He's still generally remembered for breaking the sound barrier 22 years earlier in the
Bell X-1 he named "Glamorous Glennis." –
Sca (
talk)
14:41, 8 December 2020 (UTC) →reply
Weak oppose blurb The name is "household" probably for a narrow demographic - after the test flight he was a hero figure for numerous kids and got attached to a lot of toys and video games. But unlike, say, John Glenn, who expanded on his achievement even more by entering politics, Yeager didn't really do much else. He wasn't a transformational figure for that purpose, as others have suggested, the right man at the right time for that flight. --
Masem (
t)
14:58, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Sean Connery was transformational because??? Chuck Yeager is such a cultural icon that he was featured in the movie
The Right Stuff (film) in the first scenes of the film. "The name is household for a narrow demographic"? Thanks for your ill-informed personal opinion. If that's true, why is Chuck Yeager featured on the front page of every American newspaper at the moment. Go ahead and point out any major United States newspaper website right now that doesn't contain the word "Yeager" on its home page. I'll wait.
JehochmanTalk15:04, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I would consider myself part of that narrow demographic - an American youth with a bent in science/engineering/thrill seeking in that time period. I fully respect his name and the milestone, but I also recognize that unlike someone like John Glenn or Neil Armstrong, Yeager did not get much further recognition for most things outside this. Go a generation or so after me and its hard to find name recognition there at all. (Not that his fame was "fly by night", simply that history does not have the same recall as it had for Glenn or Armstrong). He further didn't "transform" the field of test flights, only became the name most associated with that. --
Masem (
t)
16:23, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Ready We currently have
Sébastien Ogier as the featured ITN picture. His article is rated C-class. Yeager is rated B-class. This anti-American bias has to stop. Let's please post this. If you want to really be a help, please add references where needed. I support article quality improvement. I don't support using different standards for different articles.
JehochmanTalk15:33, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
We don't consider the assessment scales since those are done by Wikiprojects and have different standards. And its nothing against American here, just that we have a person that has been well documented for being an American "hero" but editors that have put this article together in the past failed to include references so there's a rush to add them now to fix that. That's not a bias against American bios, just sloppy sloppy editing from the past on American bios, which is not ITN's fault. --
Masem (
t)
15:47, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak oppose blurb as he's just one of many people in the same field, as mentioned by many editors above. The fact he broke a record when many people were doing similar things doesn't make him "top of his field".
Sébastien Ogier is not a relevant comparison, as that ITN is not for a death, but an ITNR event. Also don't believe this should have been marked as ready when there isn't a clear
consensus to post.
Joseph2302 (
talk)15:39, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Unmarked as Ready There is clearly no consensus to post a blurb (at the moment) and it isn't ready to post anyway due to a significant number of CN tags in it. If it's important it should be easy to cite, and if it's obscure or trivial it doesn't need to be there.
Black Kite (talk)15:43, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support – (When issues fixed.) Breaking the sound barrier was a significant, and at least thematically transformative, event. –
Sca (
talk)
15:59, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support blurb, but oppose both for quality per Jehochman. Granted that my childhood was perhaps more focussed on aviation and aerospace programs than others, but he is and was was definitely a household name to me. There are, though, far too many CNs for the front page right now.
-- a ladinsane(channel two)16:14, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Strong oppose blurb - there is absolutely no way this guy meets the threshold when we wouldn't post Eddie Van Halen or Alex Trebek. I'd never heard of this man until today, and aside from being the first person to fly faster than sound (a rather arbitrary milestone IMO), his death was not unexpected, notable, nor has it resulted in an international outpouring of grief. He is not at the top of his field (unless "Test pilots" represents a substantial enough field). John Lennon's death is receiving more coverage today, and it happened 40 years ago! If this is posted as a blurb then it will show not only a horrific American bias, but a pile-on for hardly-game-changing military veterans. - Floydianτ¢16:48, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment just to clarify, the speed of sound was not some arbitrary milestone, as if we picked a number because it sounded cool. Flying at exactly the speed of sound means that you're perpetually flying on top of your own pressure wave, which increases its strength and instability and puts it directly on top of your own plane, which is death to aircraft, especially back then. This effect increased the closer you were to the speed of sound, which is why it was a major barrier to early pilots and aircraft designers.
NorthernFalcon (
talk)
17:20, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I suppose I should have clarified that comment better. I agree breaking the speed of sound is a milestone for aircraft. I don't agree that it is for the pilot that happened to be in that aircraft when the test was scheduled. - Floydianτ¢17:34, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
What are you saying, that because you know him by name that he's a household name like every other non-head-of-state death blurb that we post? - Floydianτ¢20:09, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Update: About 70% of the citations needed have been supplied. The article now has 80 citations. There are 5-6 cn tags remaining. Please help fix them.
JehochmanTalk17:13, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb, support RD: I usually groan when people reject things due to being American-centric as I usually think those people go a bit too far, but I just don't think Yeager is as transformative a figure in American aviation, let alone the world.
Bait30 Talk 2 me pls?17:15, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Well, at the time, it had never been done, and people weren't entirely sure what would happen if it was. Some WWII piston-engine fighters, in high-speed dives, had encountered a violent shaking problem near the speed of sound. (There was some speculation the a German
Me 262 jet
might have exceeded the speed of sound in diving, but this was never substantiated.) –
Sca (
talk)
17:49, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb. I think I have to come down on the oppose blurb side, but I think it is a close call. I'm persuaded by what I see here. I would note that "we didn't post X, so we shouldn't post Y" is a poor argument against posting.
331dot (
talk)
17:52, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Attention needed Could an uninvolved admin please decide whether to post this to RD or a blurb? At least the article update and quality issues have been resolved.
JehochmanTalk18:50, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment - This is a cluster. We have roughly equal numbers of people, on one side claiming that Yeager is transformative, and on another side claiming that he isn't. This is why the sui generis discussion took place in terms of what is considered suitable for posting a recent death as a blurb. There needs to be a clear dividing line wherein the discussion is not swayed about by subjectivity and the numbers of people gathering on one side of an argument versus another. As long as we don't have that line, we'll always be mired in this mess. --WaltCip-(
talk)19:54, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I think the issue is that people are divided on what "transformative figure in their field" means, or how it applies to this specific case, which is why we have this division. I'm not sure we can or should define it more stringently than that--those five words speak for themselves--and while for some emotions run high, I think this discussion process leading to a consensus or non-consensus has to be the way to go. Some people truly believe that Chuck Yeager was transformative for his field, other people believe he was not, and that difference of opinion is okay.
NorthernFalcon (
talk)
20:37, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb Notable yes, transformative no. I don't see how his feat transformed aviation or, at the very least, exerted major changes in the production of new aircraft. And frankly speaking, the record is mere trivia with the sound barrier being an arbitrary threshold. An example of first-time event event with transformative impact is
Alexei Leonov's spacewalk, which literally changed the history of astronautics (of course, we posted it).--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
20:12, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
No opinion on blurb, but I suggest whoever does ultimately try to evaluate this for consensus ignore comments from people who say breaking the sound barrier is an "arbitrary threshold", as they do not know what they are talking about. Or at least don't know what the word "arbitrary" means. --
Floquenbeam (
talk)
20:16, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Please brief by reading
Sound barrier.
Template:Tquote Yeager was the first pilot to break the sound barrier in level, controlled flight, something that many had considered "very difficult" or "impossible" until then. If that's not transformative, I don't know what is.
JehochmanTalk21:08, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:Edit conflictTemplate:Reply I think people don't get the point of my comment but that's their own problem. The sound barrier was known to be breakable through whipping long before he did it while operating an aircraft. So, he didn't prove that something physically impossible was, in fact, possible but provided another instance of how it can be done. Furthermore, similar problems occur at any speed higher than the speed of sound and that makes any improvement in the maximum achievable speed a new threshold on its own. Putting this aside, those claiming that this is transformative have provided absolutely nothing to support how his feat transformed aviation. Finally,
Andy Green has become the first person to break the sound barrier while navigating a land vehicle. Does this make him blurbworthy when he dies? It's the same here.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
22:08, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The stats table comes from Baseball Reference (which is cited elsewhere in the article) and I wasn't sure on where to place the citation in relation to the overall table. Dralwik|Have a Chat05:01, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I've stuck cites on the table itself, and cited more spots in the career. Too late now for the main page, but at least the article is much improved in honor of Allen. Dralwik|Have a Chat21:36, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:U: It's still not older than the last RD currently on the Main Page, so technically it still qualifies be posted. I added a few more refs. However, I tagged a ref needed at the start of the "Chicago White Sox" section regarding the statement about his attitude and changing positions.—
Bagumba (
talk)
07:34, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose per The Rambling Man. I tried to help by adding citations to the "Filmography" section, but I may have done more harm than good. Either way, it is a stub and would need to be expanded.
Aoba47 (
talk)
22:54, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment The remaining items in the filmography that are not cited are films that don't have Wikipedia articles, for which reliable sources that contain the role are difficult to find. What can we do? Remove the entries?
Hanif Al Husaini (
talk)
17:03, 10 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support blurb or Altblurb As with any other election in a major country, article appears well sourced. There are controversies with this election which are addressed but still kept factual in the altblurb.
Albertaont (
talk)
17:20, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support for main blurb, as it is customary for this type of election. I'd suggest more information from the introduction is reflected, such as the rejection of the results by other countries, but this is probably one of the most neutral and non-controversial blurbs, so it should do. --
NoonIcarus (
talk)
18:03, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support Support on quality but shouldn't we like include in the blurb a mention that the election was illegitimate? I genuinely don't know post elections from for example North Korea, but we don't post them as is, right?
CoronaOneLove (
talk)
21:12, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
We don't post judgements about the legitimacy of the election. The current President of the United States and his supporters say the 2020 election he lost is illegitimate. We post rigged Russian elections.
331dot (
talk)
21:15, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
But that it was boycotted is not a judg(e)ment, it's a fact, from the RS stories I've read. So it should somehow be included in the blurb, IMO. –
Sca (
talk)
23:20, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The international reactions of the election should be added as well, as there are divided reactions across the world, including Latin America. Add in a different section of the article. --
cyrfaw (
talk)
14:49, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Yet another rd nom in need of some better sourcing (I'm too lazy and too terrible at this to do it myself, so kudos to whoever can clean it up)
Gex4pls (
talk)
20:42, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Definitely, I'm no golf aficionado so it was just because it popped up on my news feed and I have know Alliss commentating on golf for almost my entire adult life. Shame golf editors (especially UK ones) can't help out.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
21:22, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose – Country (Indonesia) not ID'd in blurbs. Juliari "could face life imprisonment or the death penalty if convicted." Posting might be appropriate if convicted & sentenced. –
Sca (
talk)
14:43, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose on principle - he has only been arrested, no trial has yet been held. It would be different if we were talking the sitting PM of India or the like. --
Masem (
t)
14:48, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment two things, we don't need "in rallying" because the sport is in the title of the award, and second we don't put year in the title of the award, so something like ""
Template:Xt" But since we already have about three hundred blurb options, I thought I'd just toss in one that was properly formed. Cheers.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
22:57, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:UTemplate:U: Comment, I would not oppose that he wouldn't be posted as blurb, even though he was a transformative Uruguayan president. The article is a mess but until the middle of next week I will not have the time that I would like to dedicate to improve it, so I would be grateful if someone could give me a helping hand, to me and some who are doing some specific editions.
Alsoriano97 (
talk)
22:04, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb because I'm not seeing the regional or international significance necessary. Oppose RD as well, because the article is missing a ton of citations, and furthermore says virtually nothing about his second term in office.
NorthernFalcon (
talk)
00:45, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support Seems like the perfect science achievement to put ITN, though from a cursory glance appears to have some referencing problems.
Gex4pls (
talk)
22:56, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment Hayabusa2 has not returned to earth and its mission has been extended. The sample return capsule has returned. The blurb needs changes. Support in principle but few paragraphs needs references. -
Nizil (
talk)
06:53, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I've added altblurb to indicate that the original parameters (returning samples to earth) is complete. If they do extend the mission, we're not talking about destinations until 2026 or 2031, so well beyond the current issue. --
Masem (
t)
07:01, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Nizil makes an excellent point. Hayabusa2 still has about half its fuel left and it appears that it will continue to explore the solar system, visiting other bodies such as Venus, until the fuel runs out. As the nomination seems confused about this, we should not rush at this until the details and outcome are clear.
Andrew🐉(
talk)
07:55, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
There was one original mission for this craft: go to the asteroid, get samples, go back to earth, and deliver sample. That they found they have more fuel left over to possibly do it again is great (a similar story of the Mars rovers) but the original mission has been completed, and if these extended missions are taken, it would be years before any "success" is determine. --
Masem (
t)
14:46, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose While notability is not necessarily a criteria, this person's page was created for the purposes of RD and is less than a day old.
Albertaont (
talk)
03:47, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:U, there is a subtle difference. It is not true that notability is NOT a criteria for
WP:ITNRD. It is assumed that anyone by virtue of having a Wikipedia article (obviously non PRODed or non AFDed) is inherently notable. Now, with this being stated, imo, it does not matter if the article was recently created as long as it meets the notability guidelines to exist as an article within WP. Hope this helps.
Ktin (
talk)
06:01, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support The article covers enough basic info about a person and his works (300+ words). It is a start-class article in my opinion. I will try to add additional info. -
Nizil (
talk)
06:21, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose for now. There's no issue with an article being created posthumously, RD rules still apply. But that said, it is currently effectively a stub. The "Works" section is really just a list, formatted to look like prose. More info on his life and work is needed in the bio section. —
Amakuru (
talk)
07:52, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Mostly fine. The artist section is not fully supported by the single reference provided. As near as I can tell, he was not a serious artist, so I wonder if that should be stricken from the lede. We could certainly call him an art patron. GreatCaesarsGhost03:45, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose for now, the personal article needs more references, the PM of of Montenegro article has only 1 reference (to an article on the PM of Kosovo)
JW 1961Talk16:55, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I think that this news is important enough for publication, also i think that the main article is more informative, as well more referenced than the recently published article on the
new Lithuanian PM, for example. -
WalterII (
talk)
13:35, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Yes of course it is important enough. It was the article sourcing quality I had reservations about. The article on Zdravko Krivokapić is now improved enough for the main page, but, I would still have concerns that the PM article has only a single source
JW 1961Talk15:33, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment Since this is not a normal electoral change, it should be explained in the blurb how he came to power; also an uncommon acronym (DPS) shouldn't be in there.
Gotitbro (
talk)
16:58, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak oppose I support the idea of a blurb, once the issues Joseywales1961 raised have been resolved. I also agree with Gotitbro's comment on the potential blurb. --
TDKR Chicago 101 (
talk)
17:01, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Changes of
heads of state/
government (whoever holds actual power) are (such as this one)
WP:ITN/R , i.e., their significance is already known only the article quality needs to be fine. Also, this particular change was not through an election but internal parliament shuffling.
Gotitbro (
talk)
04:48, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support This information is of merit considering that the former ruling party firmly ruled for 30 years, that is, from the very start of multi-party system in Montenegro. Additionally, the article has been updated and it looks better now. Sadkσ(talk is cheap)02:33, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support - The article has been significantly improved, and the news is important due to the overthrow of the authoritarian regime after 30 years.--
WEBDuB (
talk)
09:39, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Posted. I removed Prime Minister from the latter portion of the blurb as posted as it seemed redundant, and I left off the last portion of the proposed blurb as it seemed unnecessary if we are stating that he's the first independent.
331dot (
talk)
18:43, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Agree with comment above, sources needed for 3 sections, as well as numerous statements throughout article. Not to mention an orange tag.
Gex4pls (
talk)
01:58, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment: I have added citations to the "Awards" section and changed the "Selected novels" section to a "Bibliography" one with further citations. Apologies if these edits are not constructive as I usually do not edit these types of articles.
Aoba47 (
talk)
17:12, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Thank you. I would do more, but I am not familiar with how this kind of article should be structured. I agree with you that it is not comprehensive with her literary impact (or writing career in general).
Aoba47 (
talk)
19:16, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I think there's enough in there now about her life and work for a full-throated support. (Not to toot my own horn re: the additions, of course :) ) Important, Pulitzer-winning novelist with obits in all major English-language papers, and would be a nice corrective the pretty egregious male dominance of RD these days.
AleatoryPonderings (
???) (
!!!)
20:23, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment. The career section, particularly the bottom half, suffers from
WP:PROSELINE. In 1972...., In 1974 ...., In 1987 ...... A round of copy-edits would be good. Also, the 'Spencer' test -- currently, the article has a lot of positions, and some notable firsts, which is good. But, the article should add some of Ms Wade's works as well. E.g. what notable news topics did she cover? Some elaboration of her Pultizer winning work? I think the article is almost there, but, needs some work to get it to homepage / RD. Good luck.
Ktin (
talk)
16:25, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:U, If some other knowledgeable editors want to chime in and / or even go directly make the move, I will not object. None of the articles that I have read so far seem to indicate this, and I do not want to be guilty of
WP:ORKtin (
talk)
04:07, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:U, I will admit, I am not knowledgeable about this topic. I do not want to use a collins dictionary link to make a translation myself as you have done above, to say that it is a honorific. I am not saying you are wrong. All I am saying is if there is a more knowledgeable editor (including yourself) and they want to move the article, I will not object. My sources have been
The Hindu,
Indian Express,
ThePrint. Good luck.
Ktin (
talk)
04:20, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:Re I've gone ahead and made a
WP:BOLD move as I am pretty sure about this. Yeah, Padma Awards add their own numerous honorifics (for e.g.
Shri) to names so not surprising. Anyway
WP:LEGALNAME is also a precedent here which is fulfilled by the company records.
Gotitbro (
talk)
04:45, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:U, Shri is equivalent to Mr. in this context, and should not be misconstrued. E.g. Shri John Chambers. I am always weary about statements like "I am pretty sure about this" as a leading statements here, since that is the definition of
WP:OR while
WP:RS sources say otherwise. But anyways, I do not have too strong an opinion on this one, unless a different editor wants to chime in one way or the other.
Ktin (
talk)
05:14, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support The article is light on the scale of the protests (no mention of number of protesters), but its definitely in non-indian news as well over the past week. There are sympathy protests with the farmers outside of India, to a lesser extent.
Albertaont (
talk)
04:19, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Could use some more cleaning. "Awards return", "announced to return his award" and "Chief minister of Punjab" not being properly capitalised are 3 grammar/MOS issues in just the last 2 lines of the article and a subsection's title. The article may need some editors who focus on grammar and MOS.
45.251.33.78 (
talk)
04:24, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support Article quality seems to have improved; it's not perfect and I encourage continued work, but it looks passable. It is very well referenced, and seems to cover well all of the main issues. Seems like a good target for an Ongoing link. --
Jayron3215:24, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support I was going to oppose this yesterday as "tens of thousands" is not a high percentage in India and the quality of the article wasn't there, but after separately reading that these were in the 100k's of ppl now and seeing that incorporated into this article as well as the further expansion, this is clearly significant with the events from last weekend (road blockages, etc.) --
Masem (
t)
15:30, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose on quality grounds. The article may be well-referenced, but it is poorly written. One of the purposes of ITN is "To showcase quality Wikipedia content on current events," and I do not believe the article meets that standard.
-- Calidum15:32, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment: don't we usually blurb first and then consider ongoing later? Could a blurb be proposed for this item? — Martin (
MSGJ ·
talk)
11:25, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The protests have been going on since August so a blurb would be "stale" but they have ramped up over last weekend. There is no requirement for a ongoing to start with a blurb. --
Masem (
t)
14:08, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
This was my thought as well. Usually if something is newsworthy enough for Ongoing, it starts with a blurb. Readers won't necessarily know what this is about, but if we give them a headline story first, then bump it down to Ongoing once that's rolled off, it's much better. —
Amakuru (
talk)
10:12, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support - the protests follow the 26 November 24-hour strike by 250 million people (= 25
crore) according to trade unions' estimates (
Deccan Herald;
Tribune (Chandigarh)). Without a police (or BJP) counterclaim, the estimate so far appears to be unchallenged. This does sound like a world record. The Delhi ongoing blockade is gradually attracting more and more worldwide media attention. I did a bit of tidying in the article.
Boud (
talk)
02:10, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comments - since the BBC says "hundreds of thousands", we could put 200,000, following the minimal literal interpretation policy that seems to be the preferred en.Wikipedia standard. But this is not the place to dispute numbers, so 100,000 would seem safer to me. A tricky thing for the blurb is the historical ambiguity in the word "Indians" - people of India versus Native Americans, which is why I avoided the word.
Boud (
talk) 20:41, 5 December 2020 (UTC) I fixed the typo (seige/siege) and posted the blurb above, and removed 'add' from the 'ongoing' parameter since otherwise the blurb would not display.
Boud (
talk)
21:49, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Journalism rule: Never assume anything. We definitely should not guess at the number of protesting farmers. (And the blurb is sensationalized in this respect.) Topic getting stale. –
Sca (
talk)
14:50, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment Is there a reason this hasnt been posted? We have gone straight to on-going in the past, and a blurb just belabors the point since it would just be an attempt to capture what is going on today. Added altblurb 2 if blurb seems sensational.
Albertaont (
talk)
15:33, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Whether with a blurb or directly to Ongoing, this should be posted. There seems to be a last-minute objection from Sca, but the objection lacks explanation and is difficult to understand in comparison to
the article.
Boud (
talk)
16:22, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Let's quote the source(s) on "hundreds of thousands," then. Let's not pull a number out of the air, however reasonable it might seem. –
Sca (
talk)
17:02, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment This is an ongoing siege of the government of the biggest democracy in the world, it's well-covered in en.Wikipedia by the usual criteria, and we have a strong (not perfect) consensus to post.
Boud (
talk)
16:42, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose blurb – It seems very appropriate for Ongoing, but not for a blurb. Factors include lack of reported casualties and its essentially parochial character, regardless of whatever numbers may be guessed at – and the lack of general
RS confirmation. –
Sca (
talk)
17:06, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Whether this is posted with a blurb or immediately as Ongoing is a minor issue. Regarding deaths or injuries ("casualties"): Wikipedia ITN is not intended to be a tabloid where blood is required for coverage. Regarding "parochial" - India is the world's biggest democracy. There are plenty of sources: claiming otherwise won't make them disappear. This is not the USopedia or UKopedia.
Boud (
talk)
21:17, 6 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment: Are we missing something right here? There doesn't seem to be opposition (the only oppose was for quality issues that had long been fixed). Do we have conflicts of interest which prevent this from being posted?
Albertaont (
talk)
04:25, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Pull The article seems to be quite poor quality. I just read it to understand the issue, as it had not appeared in any news report that I'd read or seen, unlike Brexit say, which is all over the news. The article kept talking about the "mandi" system as a key demand of the farmers but doesn't explain it and we don't have an article. After some research, I find a
source which explains that these mandis are local markets for produce – the sort of topic that we might cover under a English title like
marketplace or
agricultural marketing. The word seems to be Hindi but this is the English-language Wikipedia. The article uses other foreign words like Gherao, Dharna and Raasta roko which will likewise be incomprehensible to our English-language readership.
Now, this may not just be a matter of language. While searching the BBC for this topic, the main article I found was India farmers: Misleading content shared about the protests from the BBC Reality Check unit. This explains that misinformation about this matter is being spread deliberately online. As we therefore need to be extra vigilant, we should not be promoting the topic on our main page without more scrutiny. Getting it all written in English would be a start.
Keep There is no requirement for an en.Wikipedia article to be necessarily written in US or UK English, it can perfect well be written in
Indian English, especially for a topic about the world's most populous democracy, in which English is an official language, but diverges in ways that are unsurprising when a huge number of people use the language regularly. The boundary of when a word counts purely in one language or not is fluid.
Misinformation occurs on almost any topic that is newsworthy. Should we remove the COVID-19 related links from the main page because there are anti-vaxxers and conspiracy theorists who think COVID-19 is a hoax? Obviously not. You are welcome to edit the article to improve the understandability for English speakers whose knowledge of English is restricted to only the UK and US versions and who are upset that a part of the world that Britain massively pillaged from to build its wealth has dared to develop its own, rich variety of English.
There seems to be a hint here that the argument is that brown-skinned
Oriental people who speak another variety of English than UK or US English seem to be organising mass
civil disobedience because they're incapable of understanding that they've been politically manipulated and misinformed. That would not be a valid reason for removing the link.
Mahatma Gandhi responded to that over 70 years ago.
Boud (
talk)
01:51, 8 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Pull – Per previous and my posts above, this one time I support pulling the blurb. This smacks of an overblown cause celebre. The AP photo
series of three days ago was very good at illustrating the event(s) but not really informative at all. –
Sca (
talk)
23:30, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Don't pull. I see little wrong with the article myself, and this is clearly a very major deal and ongoing headline news in India. —
Amakuru (
talk)
23:45, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Joofjoof yeah, it kind of looks OK now, but unfortunately I think the boat has probably sailed on this one. His death was on December 2, but the oldest RD entry currently on the main page is dated December 4. Cheers —
Amakuru (
talk)
23:39, 7 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The article needs some more references. I added CN tags at honors but I see there are more unsourced paragraphs throughout the article. A blurb is possible, indeed, once the article is fixed. --Tone23:11, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Blurb, not enough coverage/impact of death and funeral. Contrast with Diego Maradona's death which now has doctors' offices being raided by the police. Abductive (
reasoning)01:26, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Would support blurb on significance (not every death has to be of Maradona standard) but the article and its referencing is just too poor, whole paras and sections are missing any cites at all.
Gotitbro (
talk)
02:24, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
RD is for deaths that aren't important enough for blurbs, such as this one. Importance means; a stand-alone article on the person's death and/or funeral could be supported. Note the distinguishing between the person and their death. Abductive (
reasoning)07:35, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Sorry, but that makes no sense; by that logic Gordon Brown or François Hollande would warrant a blurb when their time comes. Holding a notable job doesn't confer automatic notability on the holder, it just puts the holder into a position in which they're potentially able to do notable things. ‑
Iridescent13:30, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
After posting blurbs for the deaths of some office-holders in the United States just because it's a large and powerful country, I don't see a reason why the death of a former leader of another large and powerful country should be omitted. I was one of the fiercest opposers to lowering the bar for death blurbs when we introduced RD and I still have relatively high criteria but it's simply not equitable to apply double standards given the mistakes made in the past.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
13:50, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Per Kiril and it is also important to mention Giscard d'Estaing's works for the European Union and his presidency during France's modernizing shift as the NYT remembered him. Also worth mentioning Chirac's RD blurb was only largely opposed based on article quality and when India's PM
Atal Bihari Vajpayee died in 2018, he also had a blurb posted. --
TDKR Chicago 101 (
talk)
13:58, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Agree, ITNC has a bias towards American officeholders. He is more notable than many American non-President officeholders that have been given a blurb.
Joseph2302 (
talk)14:00, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Gotcha I just wanted to know the ropes here when it comes to closing discussions because I've seen some discussions close the moment something's posted. Good to know! --
TDKR Chicago 101 (
talk)
14:27, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
That's actually never happened. Discussions have only been closed once people stop being useful and start to focus on defeating people they don't like. --
Jayron3215:33, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Post-posting comment – A familiar name, but Giscard seems not widely remembered for his policies. At 2,800 words, his article is modest – and since he died at 94, albeit of Covid, the death isn't surprising. If our main reason for the blurb was to counter a perceived U.S. bias, that's not valid. But I'm NOT for pulling it; we've taken the plunge. –
Sca (
talk)
15:09, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Not correct, the first mention of bias was me at 13:00 UTC today. But I think the right outcome has emerged- an important head of state should have a blurb.
Joseph2302 (
talk)15:38, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Indeed: "ITNC has a bias towards American officeholders." Anyway, some users have alleged such here in the past. –
Sca (
talk)
15:47, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Strong post-posting blurb support Household name in Europe. We posted some literalwho American judge who was like a 100-years old when she died, and people are opposing the blurb about the last president of France under whom the country actually meant something on the world stage? Cringe. Also, proposing an alt-blurb that mentions Covid-19.
CoronaOneLove (
talk)
17:06, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support blurb regardless of being a household name or not, I think blurb posting for any former leader of the G7/8/20 countries is a no-brainer (as long as the rest of the ITN requirements are met). --
Masem (
t)
17:09, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support blurb - marked it ready as the article is now fully referenced. At least a photo must be posted along with the RD, if not a blurb. Otherwise it will cement the perception of biasness here with the French guy getting a blurb.
Depressed Desi (
talk)
13:54, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Posted to RD - looks like referencing issues were sorted. There isn't a consensus for blurbing right now, but people can continue discussing that if they wish. Not sure he's really comparable to Giscard, as he was only in office for 1.5 years. Also we wouldn't put a pic if he remains only at RD. Cheers —
Amakuru (
talk)
15:21, 5 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose for article quality, but want to remind people that being a gay wrestler is like maybe 10% of his transformative effect on the WWF (and thereby the whole damn industry). If it was a good article, I'd blurb it for sure. If I booked this promotion, I mean.
InedibleHulk (
talk)
01:30, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak oppose it's still marked as a stub and excluding the lead we've got fewer than 1500 characters. Not convinced this is all there is to say about a player who admittedly died young but still managed more than 200 professional appearances.
The Rambling Man (
Hands! Face! Space!!!!)
21:09, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support: Its an important step towards beating Covid-19, regardless if its the first western country to approve of a vaccine. Any move forward is a good move forward.
Fusioncore21 (
talk)
12:29, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Update BannerTemplate:S Is this not already covered by the banner? Is there some reason that we should focus on this vaccine over ones from Russia (widely available, released earlier), China (available in large numbers, released earlier), or even more niche vaccines that have been used previously?
130.233.213.199 (
talk)
13:03, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Strong oppose for two reasons. Firstly, this should already be covered with the banner and, if not, the update should be done there. Secondly, we didn't post the approval of
Gam-COVID-Vac in Russia, so this is not the first country in the world to approve a COVID-19 vaccine (And before coming to contest this view, please provide scientific evidence that this vaccine is better and more efficient). I also don't think that the clarifications 'first Western country' and 'after large-scale testing' in the proposed blurbs make a lot of sense (yet the fact it's the first
mRNA vaccine is noteworthy). Let's wait until the World Health Organisation approves its production and distribution, and then discuss posting it as the first widely approved vaccine. Nonetheless, this nomination is a timely warning that the banner should be updated with a link to
COVID-19 vaccine.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
14:24, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
A "strong oppose" carries no more weight than an "oppose." –
Sca (
talk)
Template:Reply I know. But when you see that people continue to nominate COVID-related items for a blurb while the banner is still on the top and, more importantly, it can benefit from the nomination, you need to react somehow and that's a good sign to use an intensifier.--
Kiril Simeonovski (
talk)
15:33, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
We should rely on the sagacity of our comments to persuade our colleagues. "Strong" seems to imply an emotional commitment more than a reasoned argument, IMO. –
Sca (
talk)
15:51, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment: the comment about it being the first in the West is a bit of a red herring, the point is it's the first that has completed clinical trials and been demonstrated to be effective.
Modest Geniustalk15:20, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
It has not "completed trials", because otherwise it wouldn't have been given emergency authorization. Volunteers continue to be monitored, and its not like those in the placebo group are now authorized to take the full vaccine as the study has closed.
Albertaont (
talk)
15:49, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment – In widespread RS coverage, the vaccine is generally referred to as "the vaccine from American drugmaker Pfizer and Germany’s BioNTech (
AP) or simply "the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine (
Guardian). For Wikipedia's audience, there's no point in calling it "the BNT162b2COVID-19 vaccine." Why force readers to follow a linked jargony acronym only to read in the first sentence that it's a vaccine "developed by BioNTech and Pfizer" – ?? This is pure techie obfuscation – and it doesn't read well either. –
Sca (
talk)
15:31, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support and/or Update banner As Kiril Simeonovski notes, there is no reason why we shouldn't have a link to
COVID-19 vaccine in the banner since that is the main focus of news coverage at this stage. I'm not opposed to posting this story in lieu of that, however.
Teemu08 (
talk)
16:00, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support - Big news no matter how you look at it. It's a vaccine for one of the worst pandemics in human history, released in an extremely protracted time period.--WaltCip-(
talk)17:58, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose I want to oppose based on the fact that no matter how we phrase the blurb it is necessarily going to sound like it's the UK making an important step, rather than being the quickest to rush emergency authorization of an international vaccine. Even without that fact, we can't have a blurb that sounds celebratory of a certain country/it's government. If we could update banner to highlight the vaccine, that would be suitable. I might bring it up at the portal whether to create a new box on the emergency use, too. Great news for a small part of the British population, though!
Kingsif (
talk)
20:58, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose We have a banner for a reason. And if we are going top be blurbing about COVID (which has been avoided like the disease itself on here) make it generic (about vaccines, other advancements etc.) not about news specific to a country.
Gotitbro (
talk)
03:55, 3 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support. Clean and well referenced article, somewhere between a Start-class and a C-class biography, though Rater.js suggests B. Good to go to the homepage.
Ktin (
talk)
00:03, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Good point, there was no criteria for selection. I've removed the section and added those not mentioned in the text to "see also" -
Dumelow (
talk)
23:07, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose it was closed because of the same issues that caused the collapse, and there was no reason to believe it would be saved. Ergo, the collapse is not sufficiently distinct from the closure decision to be posted as a separate item. GreatCaesarsGhost17:29, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose (Yes we posted the decommissioning already). They knew that if this wasn't decommissioned in a controlled manner soon, it was going to collapse, the question of how disasterous the collapse. While this has destroys the dish and receiver, ending the telescope's "life", the damage from it was not as bad as they had feared (no injuries, some structural damage to remaining buildings), so while a sad event, I think most were already prepared back on Nov 19 when the decommissioning was announced. --
Masem (
t)
17:52, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose: we posted that it was being decommissioned already. It was being decommissioned because it was old and on the verge of collapse. Now it collapsed. Not really unexpected or newsworthy.
Bait30 Talk 2 me pls?19:01, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose I think we want to affirm it returns to Earth, which should be in two weeks, IIRC. That would mark the successful mission. (It hasn't made the return so its not really a full sample-return mission yet). --
Masem (
t)
17:53, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
That's quite frankly ridiculous. If you go on holiday to X. Your holiday distination is X, not your home despite knowing you would be returning with souvenirs. --
KTC (
talk)
18:02, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Yes, it matches the ITNR, but the fact that its return would also be an ITNR means we'd probably want to wait for the latter since it will be very very soon. If this was a return-sample mission to Mars where the return would take several months, that would be different as we'd not have to worry about piggybacking stories on the same thing. --
Masem (
t)
18:08, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Hey, I tried to reduce the number of space exploration (wouldn't have affected this one) on ITNR, those that supported on here didn't comment, a number of those that commented objected to it there. They suggested that if people bothered to update the articles, it should be posted. So here we are, an article that has sufficient details, meets ITNR, so post it. --
KTC (
talk)
18:20, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Don't be so obtuse. A destination is the end of a journey. I go on a journey to my holiday destination, at which point the journey is over. The trip home is a separate journey. Has Chang'e reached the end of its journey? No. GreatCaesarsGhost19:45, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Template:U I can equally argue that Chang'e has reached the end of it's "first" journey but that's not what's important. What's important is whether this meets the ITNR criteria, and it does, when applying the criteria as it was intended. Also: the point of the mission is to go to the moon AND come back, NOT only coming back. Had Chang' e not landed on the moon, this mission would have been useless.
74.101.118.65 (
talk)
21:31, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Correct - you could argue either way; my position is not "ridiculous" as another editor
rudely opined. You say the distinction is unimportant because this is ITNR, but the distinction defines if it is ITNR. Given that the key objective of the mission is to return specimens, the return to Earth would seem to be plainly more significant than the craft reaching the moon. GreatCaesarsGhost14:13, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Support - it's a spacecraft, it has arrived at a destination in lunar orbit and beyond, don't quickly see a problem with the article itself. --
KTC (
talk)
18:02, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose - This is an unmanned space probe. Success is defined by whether or not it is able to return samples to Earth. If it doesn't make it back to Earth, it's a failed mission and would get posted on ITN either way under ITN/R rules.--WaltCip-(
talk)19:24, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment Success or failure of the mission is not part of the criteria of
WP:ITN/R for spacecraft, if there was an intent to use it as a criteria, then it would be there already. The only mention of failure in the criteria is "launch failure" which this is clearly not. The criteria of arrival of spacecraft (to lunar orbit and beyond) is very clearly stated.
WP:ITN/R does not say a return to earth would qualify, only that it reaches lunar orbit or beyond.
Albertaont (
talk)
19:54, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I would actually go so far as to say that none of the existing ITN/R criteria cleanly cover this particular mission, particularly the "lunar orbit and beyond" criteria, mostly because a mission of this particular kind hasn't been done since the 1970s (predating Wikipedia, let alone ITN/R). The mission's goal is sample return and that should be when a posting is made.--WaltCip-(
talk)20:19, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose Same as the last nom for this. Are we going to post when it reaches (or fails to reach) Earth, yes?, then we needn't post the same thing multiple times. It might be ITNR but we can better use our own judgement here. On a side note is mentioning Luna in the blurb necessary/relevant?
Gotitbro (
talk)
02:07, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Weak Oppose While I'm all for posting science milestones, this specific mission is not complete yet, and I say we wait until the sample returns to earth.
Gex4pls (
talk)
04:33, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Wait. It returns in two weeks. When we post multiple blurbs about a single space mission, they are typically months or even years apart. --Tone08:49, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Because the events are months/years apart. The only issue here is that if we post now, then by the usual ITN posting timing, a few days after this falls out from other stories being posted, the rocket will have returned to Earth and mark the successful end of mission and we'd want to post again. We can wait the couple weeks. If the return was a month out, I won't be as worried about the double post. --
Masem (
t)
14:38, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
But what if it does roll off? Then people would want to readd it, and then we get to a situation like the Arecibo Observatory (where a second event that was known to be coming in a few weeks wasn't posted because it was expected). It is simply better to wait for the return to Earth at this point to minimize problems. --
Masem (
t)
15:08, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Wait for sample return to Earth, which is only a fortnight away. That's the final destination of the mission - getting to the Moon is a major step along the way, but not the actual goal. I agree with Masem that we could have posted those stages separately if they were months or years apart, but it makes little sense when they're only a few days. See also the discussion a few days ago on the launch, where we agreed to wait for sample return.
Modest Geniustalk15:17, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Wait - it seems preferable to report on it completing its successful mission. Obviously if something goes wrong before it returns to Earth, we would report that as well. —
Amakuru (
talk)
00:26, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
To add, it has appeared to lifted off safely from the moon, so very extraordinary chance of not being able to complete the main mission by the 15th-16th. --
Masem (
t)
14:26, 4 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment I have done a full article CE. Coverage is global and the article is well composed and referenced. The lede is too long, and the parts dealing with the riot should be broken off into their own section. It is odd to find an article with only sections named Background and Aftermath. Perhaps Riot and fire is needed in between. A few details don't make sense to me; was the "fire from the Mahara fire" a secondary fire, and is "succumbed" used to mean "died" (the 8 prisoners) or "subdued" (in the whole prison population)? Will support once these are done.
130.233.213.199 (
talk)
07:50, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Oppose For now, too short ATM. Also this seems to be connected with COVID, which is being avoided for blurbs unless especially notable (the blurb should also reflect the COVID relation which is the reason for its coverage in news).
Gotitbro (
talk)
10:56, 1 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment While I agree that the article quality needs to improve, what's the objection to coverage? CNN (sourced from Reuters), Guardian (apparently independently sourced), and Al Jazeera (sourced from AFP). That's at least 5 sources representing 3 languages and 3 continents, just taking the links in the nom.
130.233.213.199 (
talk)
06:14, 2 December 2020 (UTC)reply