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Are there modern movements and systems of belief that style themselves (Neo-)Tengriism, along the lines of Neo-Paganism? Just curious. :J // Big Adamsky 10:23, 24 February 2006 (UTC)
Example of modern or Neo-Tengriism: Temple of Tengri. -- Samdilya ( talk) 21:46, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
Maybe you can call this Neo-Tengriism: Tengerism. Burkhanism was also a tengristic movement of Altay-Turks and Oirats in the time 1904-1930. Today some nationalist Yakuts are following a new Version of Tengriism too. There call it Ayy. Actually Tengriism is not really dead. The Belief of most mongol's today is a combination between Tengriism ( mongol's call it Tengerism ) and Lamaism. The sumerian God named TINGIR, was a Sun god. Tengri/Tenger is a Sky god ( or the mighty spirit of sky ). I don't belief that Tengri had something to do with the sumerian TINGIR or with the egyptian RA ( Tangra: completly wrong stuff ! ). I am working on it.. in the german Wikipedia. de:Benutzer:Erdal/Tengrismus -- -Erdal 04:30, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
I think there must be some link between the Sumerians and these guys because the name of a God in religion has too much importance and is chosen for a specific reason and cannot simply be a coincidence.
Both are Tenri, historians much find the link here, currently not enough studies go into this very important area.
The article gives two meanings or explanations of the origin of Tengri:
They cannot be both right. -- Lambiam Talk 23:03, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
If no one objects, I will remove Tan-gra explanation and replace it with the other one for the origin of the word. Tengri is used in almost all altaic languages, see discussion in tenrikyo, and linking it to indo-european languages just because of pronouciation similarities isn't scientific.-- 141.211.201.130 ( talk) 04:43, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
Nearly all statements in this article are unsupported by either facts or citations or arguments. The interpretative material is mostly fantasy. The etymological speculations are preposterous. No philological or historical evidence is submitted. Can someone write a proper article on this (very interesting) subject? ( 88.224.69.38 14:16, 25 December 2006 (UTC))
I agree, for instance: "Worship of Sky Father/Father Heaven and Mother Earth is almost universal among Turks and Mongols, and is found in North America as well." I am currently living in Turkey, and I have never met a Turk who worships Sky Father/Father Heaven...I am going to delete this sentence.
194.27.149.175 09:50, 25 February 2007 (UTC)Veryshuai
First of all, Tengri does not mean sky in old Turkic. Sky is "gök". The most probable meaning of Tengri comes from Talat Tekin. According to Talat Tekin, the root word of Täŋri (Tengri) was Täg- (Teg-) meaning "Turn around" or "Wrap around" or "to encircle" or "to surround". A Grammar of Orkhon Turkic Ancalimonungol ( talk) 14:29, 11 November 2012 (UTC)
If someone shows me ONE historical source-chronicle or anything which says the Bulgars believed in Tengri i will accept that i'm not right.
"The Bulgars named a large mountain in the Rila mountain range after Tangra, although it was renamed in the 15th century to Musala ("Mountain of Allah") by the Ottoman Turks."
Nevermind the divination of Tengri among the Bulgars, there is no written source, nor a legend, claiming that the earlier name of Musala peak in Rila was Tengri. In fact, it is a hypothesis with no evidence, raised by some contemporary Bulgarian nationalists. The name of Musala peak is given most probably bu the Yuruks - Turkish-speaking mountain nomads, that roamed and inhabited together with their cattle some mountains in the Balkans after the Ottoman conquest. At that time, Yuruks were Muslims as well as the Ottoman Turks. 83.143.144.239 ( talk) 07:31, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
That pdf file does not provide any actual evidence. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jotaro97 ( talk • contribs) 20:09, 17 July 2016 (UTC)
The "Mongol version" section states, " Geser is a great hero of Tengriism and he is a reincarnation of a sky spirit sent to earth to help serve people as a shaman." There used to be a separate article for Geser, but it has been merged with Epic of King Gesar. The latter article, while it states that this epic has currency throughout Central Asia, describes a text of Tibetan Buddhism, not Tengriism. The article contains no reference to Tengri, Tengriism, or even shamanism. Is Tengri actually mentioned in this epic? Or is there, perhaps, a Tengriist version of this epic? If either is true, it would be nice if the Epic of King Gesar article mentioned it. If not, then the reference to Geser in the Tengri article should probably be deleted. -- Takwish | Talk 20:17, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
The image in the infobox was now removed twice without valid arguments. According to the uploader, this is an artistic representation of the article subject. If you have information and sources indicating otherwise, please explain them here. Do NOT remove it again before there is a consensus to do so. Thanks for your cooperation. -- Latebird ( talk) 14:42, 24 October 2009 (UTC)
No image can be attributed to Tangri other than the blue sky. The box has Tangri's name on the top and the picture shows absolutely ugly creature that looks like Budda shaped creature with 3 eyes, and pig's nose. Only blue sky may serve as visual symbol of Tengri. I believe in Tengri and I find this picture as totally disrespectful, maybe intentional vandalism. What if one puts some devils picture on a page of some Abramic Prophet? It would be totally disrespectful. The same thing is happening here. Tangri's commonly accepted visual image is blue sky, it has nothing to do with that agly picture.
Also the box shows Bai-Ulgen and Erlik as children of Tenri. If you follow that the Bai-Ulgen link, Bay Ulgen page says "This article does not cite any references or sources." Ulgen is a word translating into Enlish simply as - Great. Erlik literally means Earth, and it can't be Tangri's son either. Tangri is not like human, it does not have children. Listing Tangri's illegal children is missleading and wrong. That has to be removed also.
Listing that Budda-Swine picture under Gok Tengri, and giving Tangri illegal children is nothing other than deliberate misrepresentation.
Thanks for the comment. Agreed, personal opinion should not matter on wp. The fact is the image box should show the most commonly accepted image representing Tengri. It is commonly known that such image is a blue sky. In fact "Mahakala" like picture of Tangri looks like someone's personal opinion. "Ulgen" means "Great" and this is not a personal opinion either. Please just look below under the Turkic Version title and you can see the term "Tengri Ulgen" used to reference the God itself, not God's child. It is also fact that the word "Erlik" in Turkic languages means Earth. In order to list Erlik (Earth) as a child of Tengri in the given area one has to have not only valid references, but one has to prove that it is commonly accepted doctrine within Tangriism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Forte3 ( talk • contribs) 22:06, 26 October 2009 (UTC)
It's value to mention Qilian 祁连 in Qilian Mountains also originated from the Xiangnu term.-- 刻意(Kèyì) 19:34, 8 July 2010 (UTC)
Dingir(in Sumerian) = "God" Böri ( talk) 12:09, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
Lists of "Sumerian-Turkic cognates" are pseudolinguistics. See WP:FRINGE. -- dab (𒁳) 15:20, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
You say so Böri ( talk) 09:53, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
You did not present a reference. However, I have looked around for you, and I find that the connection has indeed been drawn, in literature of the 19th and early 20th century, e.g. here, John G. R. Forlong, Encyclopedia of Religions, 1906. If you like we can mention the idea, provided of course we point out that this doesn't have any credibility in contemporary scholarship. -- dab (𒁳) 12:01, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
Osman Nedim Tuna created several laws regarding Turkic words entering Sumerian from Proto-Tigris language. These laws were peer-reviewed and accepted as impeccable and case proven by a committee of experts in Pennsylvania University in 9 April 1974. Tuna's work is definitely not pseudolinguistics like the works of people like Polat Kaya.
Among the 22 experts who accepted his work as proven and impeccable are the following people:
Åke W. Sjöberg, assyriologist. Professor emeritus of Sumerian at the University of Pennsylvania, first editor of The Sumerian dictionary... And the following people: Earl Leichty, George Cardona, Henry Hoenigswald
Dingir < Tengri is one of those word that doesn't even require a law. It's the same word.
Here's a link to his Turkish book: http://tr.scribd.com/doc/64297815/Osman-Nedim-Tuna-Sumer-ve-Turk-Dillerinin-Tarihi-%C4%B0lgisi Ancalimonungol ( talk) 14:56, 11 November 2012 (UTC)
Where are the information about Tengriist practice today gone? AFAIR, there are some Tengriist revival movements in Central Asia, and also, much of Tengriist religion became a part of the local Shamanism. As for the merger itself - may it be, however I think that it's better to keep two separate articles, even if one of them remains a stub. I know that the subject isn't very popular among Europeans or Americans, as the Tengriist culture is quite remote and unknown to the masses. It's so interesting, however, that it deserves its place in Wikipedia. Greetings, Critto ( talk) 15:55, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
It isn't a question of how popular a subject is, it is a question of how much referenced material we have. At the moment, we clearly do not have the necessary material for a "Tengriism" article separate from what is already covered in this article. If you can add a substantial amount of material, this situation may well change.
I would be interested in "Tengriism revival", but again, we need good sources for that. Also, much of what is called "Tengriism" in a wider sense appears to be really Turkic mythology generically. -- dab (𒁳) 16:41, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
It appears that the flak this article has been getting is due to "Tengriism" having been discovered by ethnic nationalists in Central Asia. As always when ethnic nationalism is involved, things are going to get bizarre, so this will be one to watch in the future. Obviously, the ethnic nationalist revival is going to be a topic in its own right, but one we cannot research ourselves, so we will need to wait for the ethnographical/politological literature to catch up with it. So far, the Tengriism page has got the (completely unreferenced) claim that:
so, everything exactly as you would expect it. They have similar goings-on in the Ukraine, I think, and of course the original template is the Germanic mysticism in Germany in the early 1900s.
Unreferenced as it is, the above paragraph may be a clue for further research by providing the name of Dastan Sarygulov who is apparently the epicenter of this phenomenon. -- dab (𒁳) 10:24, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
Link title== Merge with Tengri ==
I propose we merge the article Tngri with this one. The terms are synonymous, the modern word "Tenger" is written "Tngri" in Mongolian script. -- chinneeb- talk 07:39, 10 October 2012 (UTC)
Someone should edit the article so that it informs the reader that the word Tenger is also found in Hungarian meaning sea. Another thing worth noting is that the root "Ten" in Hungarian represents knowledge and learning. Ex. Tan-ito (teacher) Tan-ul (learns), tan-targy (lesson), etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tantargy ( talk • contribs) 09:50, 27 April 2013 (UTC)
There is no sign of Tengri on the wikipedia page. It should a simple plus sign inside a Circle. (actually it's not really a plus sign despite looking exactly like a plus sign, but two arrow heads pointing each other) Ancalimonungol ( talk) 14:37, 11 November 2012 (UTC)
Could Tengri be a name the Mongolian borrowed from the Chinese language? In modern Chinese it is Tian- Ri (sky-sun, or sky-day). 86.178.171.132 ( talk) 02:30, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
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"As Gök Tanrı, he was the father of the sun (Koyash)" should be "As Gök Tanrı, he is the father of the sun (Koyash)" because death has no effect if someone is your father or son. even when someone dies one is the father and the other is the son. the interaction may not be as before but one is the father and one is the son 66.74.176.59 ( talk) 04:52, 21 February 2015 (UTC)
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Remove the line "Tangaroa, a Maori god" from See also. The Tengri pantheon has no relation to the Maori pantheon. The line was added by a Turkish nationalist who is known for pushing kemelism. 142.105.159.60 ( talk) 19:17, 14 June 2016 (UTC)
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20:04, 14 June 2016 (UTC)Tangaroa is a god in the Maori pantheon. It has no relevance to Tengri whatsoever. Are there any objections to removing the mention of Tangaroa from See Also? 142.105.159.60 ( talk) 19:30, 15 June 2016 (UTC)
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Remove the line "Tangaroa, a Maori god" from See also. The Tengri pantheon has no relation to the Maori pantheon. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.105.159.60 ( talk) 19:11, 3 July 2016 (UTC)
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Remove from see also: "Dingir, a Sumerian word (meaning deity) that may have a similar etymology[20]" per OR and FRINGE.
Turkish nationalists are constantly making (debunked) additions to try to connect the Sumerian Language with Tuskish, see Talk:Sumerian_language for more examples. 74.70.146.1 ( talk) 20:28, 24 May 2017 (UTC)
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Remove from "See Also": "Dingir, a Sumerian word (meaning deity) that may have a similar etymology[21]"
Basis: WP:FRINGE The Sumerian language is in no way related to Turkic language. The source used to support this statement is from 1928 and is thus completely obsolete. 74.70.146.1 ( talk) 22:07, 25 October 2017 (UTC)
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Never have I heard or read of such a thing as the core beings in Tengrism being the Heavenly-Father and the Earth Mother. Tengrism centers on the sky god Tengri, the God of Heaven, aka Göktengri or Göktanrı. 786wave ( talk) 17:52, 2 September 2021 (UTC)
The article on Tengrism says so too. 786wave ( talk) 17:55, 2 September 2021 (UTC)
Then you need to read Turkic inscriptions more carefully because Yagiz Yer (or Etugen) is clearly a deity. From the Bilge Khagan Inscription, "With the blessing of Tengri above and the Earth below". From Uyghur El Etmish Bilge Khagan's inscription, "Tengri and the Earth punished my housemaids, servants and people." From the Bombogor inscription, "I worshipped (Tengri) above and earth below." Tengri is doubtlessly the supreme god, but that does not mean he's the only god. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 61.68.242.64 ( talk) 05:27, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
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Just want to add a reference to See Also section.
Tengri Khagan (天可汗) was a title addressed to the Emperor Taizong of Tang. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khan_of_Heaven Alawaus ( talk) 02:17, 11 June 2022 (UTC)
Kăwak Тĕnçeri Tură - Blue Sky Creator=(GOD) - Kök Teŋiri . Тĕnçeri - IPA [tʲɘnʲd͡ʑɛrʲi] - Heavenly, Ecumenical. Tĕne = 天 tiān - sky.
Chuvash: Tĕne, Tĕnche English: world, sky, universe Mari: тÿня Udmurt: дунне Uzbek: дунё Azerbaijani: dünya Turkish: dünya Tatar: дөнья Bashkir: донъяла
«匈奴谓天为撑犁» - Xiōngnú wèi tiān wèi tēnglí - The Huns called the tiān (sky) a tenjri. Tĕncheri - 𐱅𐰭𐰼𐰃 *teŋri. - heavenly. Tĕncheri Tură - heavenly creator (god). Tură - God - in translation means Creator.
AMA (dial. Kukamai / Kăwak Amai) - goddess Ama - she is Umai among the Turks , sometimes Kök Umai - Is the goddess of fertile land, the patroness of mothers and children. Ama translated from the Chuvash Mother's Womb.
We call our faith "Chăn Chăvash Tĕni" - The World Order of the Real Chuvashs (in translation). Our main god is Tĕncheri Tură - the God of Heaven (the Universe) which consists of several layers.
Çĕlhe - [t͡ɕɪɫɣe] - language Tatar - tel (e) Bashkir - tel (e) Chuvash - chĕl (he) Mongolian: hal Turkish: dil (dil) Azerbaijani: dil Uzbek: til (til) Kazakh: Тілі Kyrgyz: Tili Uyghur: tili Yakut: rear Altaic: til Shor: Tili Afrikaans: taal Dutch: taal Estonian: (keel) keel Finnish: kieli Mari - jyl (me) Udmurt - kyl moksha - kyal Erzya - kel Lithuanian: kal/ba (kalba)
Say thanks to UXM. I know all the ancient Chuvash mythology Chăn Chăvash Tĕni (Tengrianism) 176.52.97.226 ( talk) 12:25, 5 January 2023 (UTC)
Describing his journey to the Volga in 921-922, Ibn Fadlan wrote about the nomadic Turks (Oghuz - ): And if one of them suffers injustice or something unpleasant happens to him, he will raise his head to the sky and say: “Bir tengri”, and this is in Turkic “[I swear] by God alone”, since “bir” in Turkic "one", and "tengri" in the Turkic language - "creator".
Pĕr Tĕnçeri = “Bir tengri” = United in heaven (in the universe, in the world)
Oghuz = Oghur - rhotacism is Öküz (Turkish) and Ökör (Hungarian), earlier, the ancient tribes of the Turks roamed on yurts with wheels drawn by oxen (castrated bulls), you can find this on various images and sources. The Hungarian Ogor is borrowed from the Chuvash (Bulgarian) language as wăgăr - rhotacism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.52.97.226 ( talk) 12:41, 5 January 2023 (UTC)
all the clues in the Turkic-Manchu languages, and their Finno-Ugric neighbors
English: water (Sea) chine: 水 Shuǐ - chuvash: Shyw (dial.Shui) - uzbek: Suv - kirgiz: Suu - azerb: Su - kazah: Su - tatar: Su - turck: Su
Сhuvash: Şin - Japan: 人 jin - English: human — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.52.97.226 ( talk) 13:26, 5 January 2023 (UTC)
Say thanks to UXM. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.52.97.226 ( talk) 12:30, 5 January 2023 (UTC)
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“Göktürk khans based their power on a mandate from Tengri. These rulers were generally accepted as the sons of Tengri who represented him on Earth. ” This sentence is clearly wrong. If the editors believe it is correct, they should add a very strong citation. Tanrikut does not mean Khan descended from God. It is a heavenly mandate. It means they were chosen by God to rule over mankind. It was believed to be inherlted by all members of the dynasty. However, it does not mean Khan descnded from God (as in China or Japan).
There are several different Gokturk origin myths in Chinese chronicle Zhou Shu Section 50. None of them claim descent from God. The most mythical of these claims Gokturk dynasty descended from a boy and a she wolf. 2A02:1811:C02:9400:BC87:7F45:EFF5:237D ( talk) 20:52, 28 February 2023 (UTC)
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Please, add a reference to "Sea Also": Tangra, a Bulgarian rock band named after Tengri.