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August 23

This is a list of redirects that have been proposed for deletion or other action on August 23, 2015.

Azala

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was disambiguate. I didn't find as much as I thought I would, so feel free to expand upon the dab if there's something I missed. ( non-admin closure) -- Tavix ( talk) 17:59, 30 August 2015 (UTC) reply

Initially a Basque-language redirect to the main page, this now refers to a ancient Babylonian who owned an early clay tablet map. We know nothing else about this person, so it's difficult for me to imagine a reader searching for this and coming out knowing more than they knew when they went in. Furthermore, a search for "Azala" shows a few other usages. I don't think it would be a good candidate for disambiguation, though. -- BDD ( talk) 21:50, 16 August 2015 (UTC) reply

  • Disambiguate. The discussion that led to the current target is at Talk:Main Page/Archive 131#Azala, but it's years out of date. Meanwhile, there seem to be a lot of random things named "Azala", and everything we now about the Babylonian can be summarized in one sentence. I'm willing to bet that the Chrono Trigger character gets the most interest, but it's better to have a dabpage than a confusing redirect or a nonexistent page. It definitely shouldn't be a redirect to the Main Page. 209.211.131.181 ( talk) 02:36, 17 August 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Disambiguate per IP. (I was about to say "retarget to Characters of Chrono Trigger#Ayla", but if there is more than one option, then definitely, especially since this character is so minor that it was put into a different character's section on a list.) Steel1943 ( talk) 22:35, 17 August 2015 (UTC) reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Godsy( TALK CONT) 21:40, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

Brick Tambalin

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was keep. -- BDD ( talk) 20:00, 29 August 2015 (UTC) reply

Delete per WP:RTYPO due to the implausible spelling. The character's name is actually Brick Tamland. -- Tavix ( talk) 21:42, 16 August 2015 (UTC) reply

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Godsy( TALK CONT) 21:40, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

Homs Governorate offensive (July–August 2015)

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was tentative keep, WP:NPASR. According to the discussion below, we can't find reliable sources for a usage of this name to refer to this topic, but it is a plausible descriptive title and no alternative topic has been suggested (so no confusion). On that basis I'm keeping the redirect, but without prejudice against renomination if anyone finds new evidence that this redirect could cause problems. Der yck C. 09:49, 2 September 2015 (UTC) reply

Delete, Homs governorate spans thousands of kilometers more than Palmyra, already discussed Talk:Palmyra offensive (July – August 2015)#Al-Qaryatayn — Preceding unsigned comment added by LimitationsAndRestrictions495656778774 ( talk • contribs) 18:18, 16 August 2015‎ (UTC) reply

  • Keep - The east part of the Homs Governorate is still part of the Homs Governorate. No doubt some people will use that title when searching for the offensive, so the redirect should be left behind for them. LightandDark2000 ( talk) 19:09, 16 August 2015 (UTC) reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Godsy( TALK CONT) 21:40, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Keep per LightandDark2000. For a redirect it doesn't matter whether a name is official or not, or whether it is common or not, all that is important is whether it is a plausible search term that someone will use to find this article and in this case it is. Thryduulf ( talk) 11:16, 24 August 2015 (UTC) reply
  • I'm not overly concerned if this phrase doesn't appear in reliable sources. It seems to be a descriptive title (i.e., Wikipedia generated), so I'm more concerned with whether it's accurate and unambiguous. The discussion the nominator links to seems to suggest there was another operation in the Homs Governorate that could be referred to by this name. Is that so? -- BDD ( talk) 19:59, 29 August 2015 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

Legislative process

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was delete as unopposed. Der yck C. 09:43, 2 September 2015 (UTC) reply

Delete per WP:REDLINK. This may be an WP:ENGVAR issue, but when I hear "legislative process", I definitely think of the process of making laws, not how legislative bodies may act when doing their work. See, for example, the US Congress page on the legislative process. There are a few other redirects to this page in the same vein, but I thought I'd see how discussion on this one goes before proceeding with them. BDD ( talk) 21:04, 16 August 2015 (UTC) reply

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Godsy( TALK CONT) 21:40, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

How many spaces after a period

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was no consensus. -- BDD ( talk) 19:56, 29 August 2015 (UTC) reply

Wikipedia is not a QA site. GZWDer ( talk) 05:07, 7 August 2015 (UTC) reply

Thanks. I wouldn't have "invoked" it if I didn't read it. My comment about " Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not" referring to Wikipedia "as a whole" still stands. Anyone can debate the interpretation of that page in discussion (as apparently, we are doing here). If you want to invalidate any part of WP:WWIN to not apply to specific aspects of Wikipedia, feel free to start a discussion on its talk page. However, it looks like the discussion about specifically restricting WP:NOTFAQ from applying to redirects (on WP:WWIN's talk page) is approaching a WP:SNOW oppose close. Steel1943 ( talk) 17:33, 10 August 2015 (UTC) reply
If you had read NOTFAQ, you would have discovered that it's unambiguously inapplicable here, in a way that no one who had read it could miss. There's no need to apply a footnote to it say it doesn't apply to redirects, any more than there's a need to apply a footnote to WP:CSD#G12 saying it doesn't apply to redirects. The substance of what it says makes it entirely unambiguous that it cannot. So, again, I implore you to read NOTFAQ before invoking it. Wily D 09:06, 11 August 2015 (UTC) reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, BDD ( talk) 18:20, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Keep per Wily D and Siuenti. This is an unambiguous search term that directs readers to the content they are looking for. It harms nothing and deleting it will bring no benefits, meaning deletion would harm Wikipedia. It's redirects like this one that help search engines interpret natural language queries. WP:NOTFAQ starts "Wikipedia articles should not read like:", and thus clearly does not apply to redirects. Thryduulf ( talk) 18:26, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Keep, possible search term, does no harm. Essentially per Siuenti and Thryduulf. — Kusma ( t· c) 12:04, 24 August 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Delete per unambiguous consensus that redirect titles are encyclopedic content covered by What Wikipedia is not, and pages should not be titled as though Wikipedia is a question-and-answer site. Ivanvector 🍁 ( talk) 15:51, 24 August 2015 (UTC) striking per discussion Ivanvector 🍁 ( talk) 15:05, 28 August 2015 (UTC) reply
    • In what way does that justify harming Wikipedia making it harder for people to find our content? Redirects are not articles (otherwise we would be discussing this at AfD not RfD), that guideline does not mention titles at all, and even if it did it talks about encyclopaedic content not guidebooks - this is a pointer to encyclopaedic content and is not a guidebook, instruction manual or anything else the guideline covers. Thryduulf ( talk) 00:54, 25 August 2015 (UTC) reply
      • I'm sorry Thryduulf but I think you are in the minority; consensus does seem to be that WP:NOT covers all aspects of the (reader-facing) Wikipedia, including article titles and redirect titles. In a conversation with you not so long ago (within the last few months) I tried to say that to me this means that generally we should follow WP:TITLE "with obvious exceptions for typos, misspellings, {{ R from other language}} and so on" – I am sorry I cannot find that conversation – and rightly you said that there would be so many exceptions that such a guideline/policy would be useless. I've narrowed my opinion now to that at least they should usually be WP:NOUN, which should take in all of those "exceptions". (A misspelling of a noun is still a noun, and so on.)
I think to achieve consensus on these we should discuss it at WT:RFD so that we need not all endless repeat arguments. In general, I am with User:Steel1943's and User:Ivanvector's sentiments for these; obviously each must be argued on its merits but I think we have consensus – not unanimous but with a healthy majority – that we should not multiply redirects unnecessarily: doing so, in my opinion, hinders not helps a search. With no hard evidence, it seems to me that the search engine suppresses duplicate redirects, so having extra terms does not help someone realise the article is not what they want before clicking through it (except of course the brief excerpt from the lede of the target): in that sense, a "harmelss" redirect is actually harmful by suppressing possible less-results that may be what someone is searching for.
Suggesting targets at RfD is a bit of a guessing game, which is one reason I enjoy it. I have no knowledge of the search engine tactics though but wouldn't be surprised if it ignored question-clauses at the starts of search terms anyway: which would weaken or negate some of my arguments above. Si Trew ( talk) 14:32, 25 August 2015 (UTC) reply
I suppose my concerns would be assuaged by explicitly tagging these sorts of redirects with {{ R unprintworthy}}, or creating an rcat like {{ R from frequently asked question}} that would tag unprintworthy within the code. Beyond that, I just don't like them, but that's not a deletion rationale. Ivanvector 🍁 ( talk) 14:41, 25 August 2015 (UTC) reply
Yes, I think that would make sense, except it's not very WP:RNEUTRAL to decide what a frequently asked question is, unless WP has stats on what search terms people try that come up red (i.e. search engine results not an article or via a redirect to it). Were we to do so, I'd favour the {{ R from question}} form (specifically not "frequently asked"); in the first place we could redirect that through {{ R from unprintworthy}} until we established, by consensus, the use of a Category:Redirects from questions or some such. Si Trew ( talk) 14:49, 25 August 2015 (UTC) reply
We do have those stats, sort of: WP:TOPRED. Ivanvector 🍁 ( talk) 14:51, 25 August 2015 (UTC) reply
( edit conflict) *Comment. Searching for the WP:ENGVAR "How many spaces after a full stop" has as my first result Wikipedia:Manual of Style (redirect WP:DOUBLE SPACE) although oűnly by clicking through the redirect would one actually get to the section. Second result is to Template:Sfn, which I use sometimes. Either way this would be a WP:CNR were it to be a redirect. So this is kinda "suppressing" a CNR search (from reader to editor space, moreover), if that makes sense. But of course it depends which namespaces people search on, etc. I'd be interested to know what others get. Si Trew ( talk) 14:49, 25 August 2015 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

How elements are arranged in the Periodic Table

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was no consensus. -- BDD ( talk) 19:54, 29 August 2015 (UTC) reply

Wikipedia is not a QA site. GZWDer ( talk) 05:03, 7 August 2015 (UTC) reply

Thanks. I wouldn't have "invoked" it if I didn't read it. My comment about " Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not" referring to Wikipedia "as a whole" still stands. Anyone can debate the interpretation of that page in discussion (as apparently, we are doing here). If you want to invalidate any part of WP:WWIN to not apply to specific aspects of Wikipedia, feel free to start a discussion on its talk page. However, it looks like the discussion about specifically restricting WP:NOTFAQ from applying to redirects (on WP:WWIN's talk page) is approaching a WP:SNOW oppose close. Steel1943 ( talk) 17:33, 10 August 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Delete per WP:NOTFAQ and Steel1943. Not elaborating on each individually as so many have been listed of this type on this date.— Godsy( TALK CONT) 03:15, 10 August 2015 (UTC) reply
    • Given that NOTFAQ does not say anything relevant here, and Steel1943's answer is incoherent, can you explain why you want to delete this useful redirect ? Wily D 16:25, 10 August 2015 (UTC) reply
      • @ WilyD: WP:WWIN doesn't just apply to one particular namespace. Even if we, incorrectly in my opinion, view it that way based on "Wikipedia articles should not read like" (even though it is preceded by "Wikipedia is an encyclopedic reference, not an instruction manual, guidebook, or textbook."); Redirects are most simply alternative article titles, and no where in WP:RPURPOSE does it say they should be question format to navigate. That aside the combination explosion that would result from phrasing every title, section title, or piece of info from an article that people might be looking for in this manner in a "How", "What", "Where", etc. form would be insane.— Godsy( TALK CONT) 08:20, 11 August 2015 (UTC) reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, BDD ( talk) 18:19, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply
  • That is in fact entirely possible that I inserted the comment in the wrong discussion. I've noted before that I occasionally click "edit" corresponding to a discussion which has moved as more discussions are added to the page. I think I probably meant what I said here, though, prior to striking it. Ivanvector 🍁 ( talk) 15:13, 28 August 2015 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

What if extraterrestrials come to Earth

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was no consensus. -- BDD ( talk) 13:37, 1 September 2015 (UTC) reply

Wikipedia is not a QA site. GZWDer ( talk) 04:47, 7 August 2015 (UTC) reply

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, BDD ( talk) 18:18, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

French prince

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was delete as there the general sentiment is that neither plausible target would satisfy majority consensus. I'm closing this as delete, without prejudice against list creation. Der yck C. 13:31, 1 September 2015 (UTC) reply

Although the target article is associated mostly with France, I'm not sure this redirect works. Fils de France is also categorized in Category:Princes. A List of French princes might well be too unwieldy, but perhaps Category:French princes would provide a place to start. So maybe delete per WP:REDLINK, or just as a "novel or obscure synonym". -- BDD ( talk) 18:00, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply

List of French princes would be the preferred title—see WP:LISTNAME. That said, I doubt there would be a French prince who wasn't notable anyway. -- BDD ( talk) 13:26, 28 August 2015 (UTC) reply
  • Retarget to Fils de France - there appears to be only one French hereditary rank with "prince" in the title, and that is Prince du sang (not counting Prince étranger which doesn't seem to be a hereditary rank, per se, at least not one with significance to the royal family). However in English prince generally means any male member of the royal family other than the sovereign (sons and grandsons of the king), so assuming an English reader is searching this, we would also have to include Dauphin of France (the French heir apparent) and Fils de France (other sons of the king and the dauphin), who would all be princes in English heraldry. I think that retargeting this based on the English definition is right, but we should add something at Fils de France explaining what a Prince du sang is - not a hatnote but an explanation, I think. Ivanvector 🍁 ( talk) 14:57, 28 August 2015 (UTC) reply
Actually it is already explained there, under the heading "Styles". Ivanvector 🍁 ( talk) 14:58, 28 August 2015 (UTC) reply
I oppose this. Why should the term adopt an English-monarchy perspective? Better retain the word in the original sense; in France, the operation of the Salic law meant that the line of recognized princes stretched not only to the sons and grandsons of kings (fils de France), but also to more distant male-line descendants (princes du sang). Reigen ( talk) 11:32, 29 August 2015 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

The tap

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was retarget to Tap per WP:SNOW. ( non-admin closure) -- Tavix ( talk) 04:34, 28 August 2015 (UTC) reply

The redirect makes no sense. — Keφr 11:31, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

Practical skills

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was keep. Der yck C. 13:32, 1 September 2015 (UTC) reply

The subject of the redirect is not mentioned in the target article, and the connection between the redirect and the target is a bit vague. I'm thinking that this may be a candidate for retargetting to Skill, but I have a little reservation for that since the word "practical" in this redirect could stand out as a WP:NEUTRAL violation. Steel1943 ( talk) 05:16, 23 August 2015 (UTC) reply

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.
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