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This film fails
WP:GNG,
WP:NFILM, and
WP:NFO. A google search of the film doesn't show the film being discussed in reliable sources. The single reference cited in the article is a press release. Moreover, all of the sources online are press releases.
Versace1608Wanna Talk?23:38, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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I'd say so. Executive orders are a key part of a President's duties. At minimum, redirects for each executive order going to a page on a specific topic relating to executive orders in a particular administration.
South Nashua (
talk)
03:48, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Comment Why not just move it to Wikisource like we did with just about every other Executive Order (seeList of United States federal executive orders 13489—13764)? Plus it's sill not notable. I fail to see the impact, unlike his order to withdraw from the TPP. All the article says is that the order is: "Designed to repeal the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, also known as 'Obamacare'". An executive order cannot repeal the Affordable Care Act. If you actually read it, all it says it "please slow down implementation of Obamacare, despite the fact it has already been implemented". The rest appears to be just rhetoric designed to show the new president's resolve. --
Kndimov (
talk)
23:58, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Comment Even if some executive orders are not notable, which I don't agree with, this one in particular is the culmination of a talking point during the presidential campaign he repeated numerous times. Plenty of room for expansion beyond the verbatim words of the order itself.
South Nashua (
talk)
15:21, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Weak Keep because it's almost impossible for this to not have coverage from multiple independent sources: Considering the broad scope of this executive order — probably an attempt to reverse Obamacare to the maximum extent allowed by executive branch — I'm pretty sure multiple sources can be found soon, analyzing what this executive order's effect is, and how it affects healthcare in the United States until more complete acts of Congress are passed, and possibly also how it sets the tone for the Trump administration. --
Closeapple (
talk)
02:57, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Move the text of the order to Wikisource; anything remaining can be merged with Donald Trump's first 100 days article, or an article about efforts to repeal the ACA. This order is little more than a statement of principle.
331dot (
talk)
03:42, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. loads of news sources discuss it. If the article is more than just the text of the order, if it also includes historical context and effects, etc., that's a legitimate subject for an article. --
Coemgenus (
talk)
16:52, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
The substance of this order is essentially that it is a step towards repealing the ACA; I'm not sure what historical context it has, but I would think that it could be discussed as part of the ACA article, or an article detailing efforts to repeal it.
331dot (
talk)
17:19, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Comment Either list them all, or none of them. Some being more important than others is subjective and only having articles for a few is inconsistent. I like how the past two terms from Obama lists them all at Wikisource per
Kndimov. --
Charitwo(
talk) (
contribs)02:15, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete All Trump's executive orders will be listed in
List of United States federal executive orders 13765 and above. The article has an external link leading to the text, so there's no need for separate articles if those articles only present the content of the order. In this case I think the executive order should be discussed in the article about ACA or in a separate article about the repeal of ACA.
Sjö (
talk)
10:36, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete Whatever replaces Obamacare will have an article. This executive order is a single step towards that replacement and by itself is insignificant. Maybe there could be an article
2017 Obamacare repealment effort if you find yourself unable to wait. Brightgalrs (/braɪtˈɡæl.ərˌɛs/)[1]05:56, 28 January 2017 (UTC)reply
If and when that subject gets beyond this executive order, it may be plausible that the executive order is no longer separately notable from that subject and can be merged. But right now, all there is to the actual Obamacare changes in the current term is this.
Efforts to repeal the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act exist, but the only effort that has actually has the force of law so far is this executive order. --
Closeapple (
talk)
11:53, 28 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete Not every presidential executive order needs its own page. This one, the content can be easily assimilated into the first 100 days and PPACA page. Compare and contrast with the newsworthiness of the executive order on Muslim travel and refugees. –
Muboshgu (
talk)
04:28, 29 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Seriously? For a guy who is apparently an administrator, that was kind of unprofessional. We are trying to have a serious discussion here, thank you. --
Kndimov (
talk)
17:31, 29 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Pretty much, yes. One article on the endless series of fuckwittedness emanating from the White House is enough right now. Guy (
Help!)
22:25, 30 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep - improper use of WP article delete procedure. This process is for identifying topics that *should not* be articles in WP. It is not meant for poorly written articles, which should be listed at
WP:CLEANUP, not here.
Davodd (
talk)
06:07, 31 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete This is a classic example of
WP:COI editing and it seems that the articles creator, Decodicil, is using an
WP:SPA account. I am further troubled by the lack of references in this article. If anything, the article could be merged into
London Musicians Collective due to the affiliation. It might help if Decodicil offers some sources while its deletion is being discussed per
WP:BURDEN.
Eliko007 (
talk)
22:58, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete - Fails [WP:GNG]]. Article lacks independent reliable sources. Google and NYT searches provides nothing to establish notability.
CBS527Talk03:49, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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I cant find any third party references mentioning this at all. Some mention of a film of the same name, and a gaming company of the same name, but no mention of this game except in self published or primary sources. InsertCleverPhraseHere20:18, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Article based on a concept described in a single Journal paper (that has not been cited by any others). References within this article, apart from the reference pointing directly to the paper, do not mention "The Friedmann-Balayla Model" and in fact, they pre-date the publication of the Journal paper by many years. The GNG is definitely not met. (Note - improvement tags have been removed repeatedly and a PROD based on notability was declined by the page author)
Exemplo347 (
talk)
19:47, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
This is a rigorous scientific and epidemiological paper, published in a scientific, peer-reviewed medical journal. The model is new and innovative, and addresses a concern that is raised by years of medical literature. It is an important addition to the zeitgeist, and it should be commended as such
Tedmfm.
Nothing that you have said addresses the concerns that I have raised, both here at this discussion and on the talk page of the article. Please can you respond to my specific concerns, because they are related to Wikipedia's policies.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
20:01, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
It is a new paper precisely because there was a need for the concept herein developed. As a consequence, all the references will be from the past, and won't cite the model. The fact it hasn't been cited has to do with it being so new. Similarly, the fact it is peer-reviewed means it has undergone strict and rigorous scientific scrutiny from the community, and it is NOT self-published. -
Tedmfm. —Preceding
undated comment added
20:21, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
"Self Published" means exactly that - the journal paper was written by the people who came up with this scientific model, so that's a self-published source. It doesn't fulfil the requirement under the
General Notability Guideline that I've already suggested that you read, but I don't think you have. Specifically, the GNG calls for Significant coverage in reliable, independent sources.Exemplo347 (
talk)
20:54, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I don't think your definition of "self-published" is correct. Self-publishing means you publish your own article by yourself. i.e without an independent editorial house, scientific journal, rigurous peer-review. In that case, the findings have no reliability and questioned validity. The Friedmann-Balayla model is different. While you are correct that the eponym comes from the authors who submitted the article, the peer review gives credence to the findings, which now make part of the medical literature. I have read the GNG and do not believe this article is in violation of the guidelines on the topics you have brought forth -
Tedmfm —Preceding
undated comment added
21:17, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete - An academic paper was published in the Journal of Maternal-Fetal and Neonatal Medicine on 23 January 2017, the same day this article was created. While an article has been published in a peer-review journal, there has not yet been any review of this work that has been undertaken of this paper by other authors, such as asked for by
WP:MEDRS. So there is nothing presented to suggest this theory itself is notable at this point.
Drchriswilliams (
talk)
19:42, 29 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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The result was speedy keep. Per
WP:SKCRIT. The nominator is now proposing simply "reducing the article to a stub." While I agree with more experienced editors that a better way forward might be to reference what we have rather than cut it back -- any such improvements don't require an Afd and we're looking at a
WP:SNOWy keep. Further discussions should take place on the article talk page. (
non-admin closure)
Shawn in Montreal (
talk)
18:00, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Although the lead and definions sections have some value, all the other sections have no sources. Maybe only the offending sections could be deleted, reducing the article to a stub.
Iamaplayer33 (
talk)
17:32, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. This article dates to the early days of Wikipedia. At that time it was felt to be not necessary to provide references for material that was well-known enough to be in textbooks. Many, many science and math articles have few references even today for that reason. Deleting them and starting over is not a good solution. Even mass labeling of sections as having no sources is not a good idea. Put a single tag at the top, look at some textbooks, and provide sources.
StarryGrandma (
talk)
04:49, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
As there is now a HUGE tag atop the article declaring this problem for all to see, I've removed all the subsequent sourcing tags per
WP:TAGBOMB. I've left the tag that claims there is a factual accuracy issue in one particular section, though.
Shawn in Montreal (
talk)
16:25, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep the solution is not to delete it, the solution is to add references. Having recently brought
ionic compound up from a state like this, and now nominated it for Good Article, I have experience in this area. Referencing such simple stuff is sometimes tedious and dull, but it is never difficult to find a source.
Iamaplayer33, you seem new around here. I suggest having a go at finding a source for some of these statements. Grab a General Chemistry textbook, and pitch in. If you need help, you're welcome to contact me or WikiProject Chemistry. --
99of9 (
talk)
05:34, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep This is a fundamental article in the field of chemistry and there are already more than enough sources to establish notability. If it needs more sources, add them.
Alansohn (
talk)
16:01, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Not notable reality show contestant. She appeared in a season of The Bachelor Australia and subsequently in I'm A Celebrity...Get Me Out of Here but doesn't meet
WP:ENTERTAINER in my eyes. She didn't win either program, and hasn't done anything else of particular merit that warrants an article. --
Whats new?(talk)05:20, 6 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep (as article creator): the subject passes
WP:ENTERTAINER #1 as having a significant role in two different shows. She came third in Celebrity while in the Bachelor she was (according to the
Daily Mail) ""
one of the most popular contestants" She has more than 1000 hits on GNews, and even if most of them are tabloids it still indicates a significant impact well above that of the average reality show contestant.
StAnselm (
talk)
05:51, 6 January 2017 (UTC)reply
How were they 'significant' roles? Why is she more notable than the winner or any other contestant in her season of The Bachelor, none of whom have articles. The depth of coverage about her is mostly trivial and almost exclusively related to events in either program. --
Whats new?(talk)06:14, 6 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Reluctant keep, or perhaps redirect to either The Bachelor Australia or I'm A Celebrity...Get Me Out of Here. The article as it stands only has one secondary source, so delete, but yes there is heaps of guff about her. So however meets GNG
WP:NEXIST it seems just because she is a very little bit famous for being a very little bit famous. Her show appearances do not need to get her over the line. GNG does not need to have any remarkable events or achievements, just IRS to demonstrate notability and verifiability, and able to support a reasonably comprehensive article. I suggest the article creator turns the article into an in-depth multiply referenced article asap. As it stands the article's content does not demonstrate any notability.
Aoziwe (
talk)
12:17, 9 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Sorry but I suggest you aim to have a few multi-sentence paragraphs in each of sections such as Early life and education, and Adult [personal] life, and Film and media, and Fashion industry, etc. These if all referenced by reliable secondary sources (and not for example any social media, or self publish, or personal blogs, might win you the day).
Aoziwe (
talk)
11:45, 10 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Well, I think you misunderstand what AfD is all about - sources generally only have to exist, not be in the article. AfD is not for cleanup.
StAnselm (
talk)
20:24, 10 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Completely agree. But the author was active so why not have them get "their" ((not) OWN) article up to scratch and make it easier to keep? AfD is not about cleanup but it sure can be an incentive for (other) interested editors to get to work on an article. No harm in that surely?
Aoziwe (
talk)
12:57, 12 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Weak Delete; one of those people famous for being famous. A Google search at first seems to pick up loads of coverage, but when you look into it I'm not sure that much of it is reliable; mainly gossip magazines and the celebrity inserts in newspapers, neither of which I think meet
WP:RS.
Lankiveil(
speak to me)03:25, 22 January 2017 (UTC).reply
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Delete. Two poorly sourced articles about radio programs produced by a single community radio station. While both programs are claimed to have been syndicated to various other radio stations in Canada, and thus would pass
WP:NMEDIA if they could be
reliably sourced as such, all of the sourcing shown here is to the programs' own
self-published content about themselves, with no evidence of independent media coverage shown at all.
Bearcat (
talk)
18:27, 30 December 2016 (UTC)reply
Keep, both need more sources but both seem quite notable for their guests, topics, and format. Canadian Voices, a non-profit show, was broadcast and seemingly syndicated across 37 college radio stations in Canada and one in the US, so it's not a local program but a national show. The Deconstructing Dinner article is about an internationally syndicated prominent show, program, and other topic areas which have been host to many extremely prominent food safety advocates, and seems a one-of-a-kind topic which for many reasons is notable.
Randy Kryn16:10, 10 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Notability, for Wikipedia's purposes, is entirely a factor of whether the topic can be shown as the subject of enough
reliable source coverage in media to pass
WP:GNG — there's nothing that an article can claim about its topic that gets it included in Wikipedia, if it's just asserted without proper referencing for it. But I've done the necessary searches, in more than one place, and found that the depth and breadth of coverage needed to get the articles referenced properly simply isn't out there — Deconstructing Dinner gets namechecked a couple of times in articles about other things, but there's no substantive coverage about it on either Google or ProQuest, and Canadian Voices gets even less than that. There's simply none of the kind of media coverage it takes, and a radio show does not get a Wikipedia article just by having a
self-published website about itself.
Bearcat (
talk)
17:28, 10 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Don't know if editors know there are two pages listed here. Both needs sources but are notable per the page, and both, as well as a third page up for deletion, seem to be the only progressive radio programs in Canada, which may explain their lack of cites. Deconstructing Dinner's page, for example, includes "It is one of the only sources of media in Canada and the U.S. solely dedicated to investigating the origins and impacts of food choices and sharing the stories of people and communities who are constructing food systems abroad." Canadian Voices and the other page are similarly unique in their subject matter. All three pages should be relisted again and notices given to other appropriate Wikipedia projects besides the two listed.
Randy Kryn14:29, 21 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Notability on Wikipedia is entirely a matter of whether the article is properly sourceable or not. There is no way for a topic to be notable enough for an article in the absence of enough
reliable sourcingabout that topic to carry the notability — because notability is inherently a measure of sourceability. It's not a measure of whether any individual user does or doesn't care about the topic, or of how "unique" the topic claims to be — it's a measure of the degree to which the topic is or is not the subject of reliable source coverage in media, and if that simply doesn't exist then the article simply does not get to be kept regardless of what type of significance or uniqueness its own self-published content about itself claims that it has.
Bearcat (
talk)
20:27, 22 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep per Randy Kryn. There is adequate if not tons of source material, the program appears to be well-distributed and the guests who appear are notable entities. I would concur that more projects should be noted, particularly WikiProject British Columbia.
Montanabw(talk)19:59, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Where is there "adequate source material", exactly, given that there's noreliable sourcing locatable about either show on either Google News or ProQuest? You can't just assert that adequate sources exist, if no adequate sources have been shown to exist.
Bearcat (
talk)
17:51, 27 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Comment – Note that a total of two articles are nominated for deletion herein, but the last two !votes only appear to be addressing the Canadian Voices article listed atop the nomination, per the singular nouns used in the prose (e.g. "neither the sources now on the page...", "the program appears to be ...") (italic emphasis mine). North America100004:29, 31 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Deconstructing Dinner. Sources: I ran a proquest search, which turned up a 2008 article in the
Mission City Record of
Mission City, British Columbia, promoting a cross-Canada bicycle ride by the program's two hosts undertaken to The two co-producers are quoted saying that Deconstructing Dinner began on "January 2006 at Kootenay Co-op Radio CJLY in Nelson." (that's
Nelson, British Columbia). Also, in 2004, the
Nanaimo News Bulletin in Nanimo, British Columbia ran an announcement about this as a new program. So, all of this is uber local.
E.M.Gregory (
talk)
12:41, 31 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Note that "Deconstructing Dinner" was a phrase that had some currency at the time, so searches turn up hits to articles with this title tha thave nothing to do with this program.
E.M.Gregory (
talk)
12:56, 31 January 2017 (UTC)reply
However, in 2009 the
Moncton, New BrunswickTimes & Transcript ran a story entitled "The future of local food: deconstructing dinner" which is partly focused on this program, and interviews one of the program's co-producers. Here's that text: " Leading the presentation and discussion at the Dieppe Market will be Jon Steinman from Nelson, B.C. His remarkable radio program entitled "Deconstructing Dinner" serves as a sounding board for his belief that "food deserves far more attention than it currently receives and that we owe it to this planet and each other to fully understand the implications of our food choices." His broadcasts bring together farmers, journalists and researchers who "deconstruct the issues" to provide deeper context to consumers across the country. Those of you with an internet connection can access past programs at any time via podcasts. A podcast is simply a file found at a website that can be opened by your computer to play an audio recording. In other words, radio when you want it. A wide ranging list of food related topics is covered by this unique program that is heard on 34 radio stations." The article is a feature, not by one of paper's journalists, but by a writer described as "a founding member of Post Carbon Greater Moncton, President of the Riverview Environmental Strategies Committee, and writes a column called Energy Matters for the Saint John Telegraph Journal." Here:
[4].
E.M.Gregory (
talk)
12:56, 31 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Redirect Deconstruciton Dinner to
CJLY-FM. In addition to the above, there were a number of stories about this program in small publications in British Columbia. Another paper in Moncton listed the talk he gave there, and at least one paper in another province took note of the fund-raising bike ride. It may be that sources exist elsewhere (I stopped with after the Proquest news archive search detialed above) but I did not see enough to persuade me that this passes
WP:GNG.
E.M.Gregory (
talk)
13:04, 31 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete While perhaps in technical compliance with
WP:NMUSIC#4, that merely creates a presumption that there is likely to be notability. In this case, there simply isn't any apparent evidence, in the article or in searches, of any significant coverage in independent sources.
Eggishorn(talk)(contrib)21:29, 21 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Comment: My normal view is to recommend a merge to the band article, but the band article was deleted (which, I think is questionable, and I might have it userfied to work on it, actually). No !vote, as my solution is currently moot.
Montanabw(talk)20:02, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep Not only was it nominated for the Grammy, it won the Best Historical Recording award at the
Native American Music Awards.
[5] Here's some more coverage on the album.
[6] In my opinion, these are the cases why NMUSIC has been made. NMUSIC points to the probability of general notability coverage existing or coming up in the future. For example, Veterans has been covered significantly by University and college magazines
[7][8], has featured in the listings of multiple books, encyclopedias and Billboard publications.
[9][10][11] Of course, while the university publications are significant coverage, they don't perhaps qualify pristinely on our reliable source requirements, and while publications like Billboard magazine are reliable, the mention is just in a listing. I would suggest giving this article some more time. Veterans qualifies on NMUSIC and we should appropriately support the existence of such cultural benchmarks for a part of our less represented population.
Lourdes03:12, 1 February 2017 (UTC)reply
Comment: I'm now seeing that this band's album could be worked on a bit. The band itself could be added back again if we have the proper sources to identify it as being notable. I officially withdraw my nomination for deletion.
Evking22 (
talk)
03:33, 1 February 2017 (UTC)reply
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I don't think this performer is up to the level of notability called for under
WP:GNG or
WP:ENTERTAINER. There is a little bit of focused coverage in possibly suitable sources, such as
[12], but that's a hometown local weekly), and
[13], but that article "originally appeared in" the same hometown weekly. What coverage there is, is in connection with a single off-Broadway role for which he was nominated for, but didn't win, one award (though that's the main reason why I didn't submit for
speedy deletion under A7); and, more recently, he's Ensemble and understudy. Perhaps
WP:TOOSOON.
Largoplazo (
talk)
17:23, 7 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete Most significant coverage is hometown coverage of his parents. Credits are all of "ensemble" or "understudy" level. Remaining sources are to bare database listings or not really about this performer.
Eggishorn(talk)(contrib)21:49, 21 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Weak delete Since the two articles linked by Largoplazo are by the same author and from the same publication, they count as one source under the GNG. I couldn't find any other articles to count as a good second source. There are
twoarticles from TheaterMania, which is probably a reliable source, but they are so short and contain so little info on Lingner that I think they fall just short of the GNG level of significant coverage. And he fails
WP:ENT since his Broadway roles have all been ensemble or understudy. --
Cerebellum (
talk)
22:53, 29 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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KeepMrs.India is a national pageant for married women just like Miss India is for unmarried girls.Winner of Mrs.India represents India in international pageants like Mrs.World ,Mrs.Asia,Mrs.International etc.Winner of Mrs.India need not be models but they are role models & accomplished women from India who are successful in their own areas because they set an example of following their dreams by balancing both personal & professional lives & fighting the so called patriarchal system in India where women are only expected to stay home ,cook & raise children after marriage. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Mcp123* (
talk •
contribs)
09:07, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
— Note to closing admin:
Mcp123* (
talk •
contribs) is the creator of the page that is the subject of this
AfD.
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Contested PROD. Concern was Article about a footballer who fails
WP:GNG and who has not played in a fully pro league. PROD was contested on the grounds that he has played Nigeria's youth national teams. However,
WP:NFOOTBALL explicitly excludes youth football as a source of notability.
Sir Sputnik (
talk)
17:44, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Contested PROD. Concern was Article about a footballer who fails
WP:GNG and who has not played in a fully pro league. PROD was contested on the grounds that he has played Nigeria's youth national teams. However,
WP:NFOOTBALL explicitly excludes youth football as a source of notability.
Sir Sputnik (
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17:44, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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The article relies heavily on unverifiable third-party sources such as blogs and fan posts, and lacks any significant coverage from verifiable sources to warrant the page's creation.
User:SubZeroSilver (
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17:12, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:13, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
21:00, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete. I read the above !votes before I looked at this and I fully expected that I would find this one to be a rare keep among the Roller Hockey articles up for deletion but what I found, or rather didn't find, makes me wonder how anybody thinks this is close to being notable. Of the two Google News hits, one of which is for the "The 50 creepiest hockey logos of all-time (Ranking 50-26)". There are zero Google Newspapers hits. (Yes, I counted twice.) Where is the verifiability here? Was this really a professional sports team? Did nobody bother to tell their local newspapers? Two of the 6 Google Books hits are people republishing Wikipedia articles and the others look like passing mentions. In a world where even the most minor sports news is published and devoured this team seems not to have made a ripple in the media. How can a professional sports team make money (which is what "professional" implies) if the world has never even heard of them? I see no scope that a proper referenced article could ever be made for this subject as the sources do not seem to exist. The bar is "significant coverage in reliable sources". I don't see how that can be met. I do see some justification in those arguing that the nomination should have been researched better but keeping a truly hopeless article to prove that point does not seem justifiable. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
20:48, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:14, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep A notable team that played in a notable professional sport at the peak of its popularity. Ample sources are available to establish notability; sadly the nominator refuses to follow the obligations of
WP:BEFORE.
Alansohn (
talk)
20:28, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
21:00, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep, per Lepricavark. And these other AFDs all seem similar:
The weakest keep possible. Nothing in Google News but the one source on the article, coupled with the mentions in the Tampa Bay Magazine found under the Google Books search are enough to make it a valid stub if the unreferenced and over-detailed cruft is removed, so I have removed it. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
22:38, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional team in the highest level league of roller hockey at a time when roller hockey was hugely popular and had games in primetime on ESPN. Notability is not temporary. Secondly this article like most of the others were not all created by one editor. The nom hasn't even done the slightest check on the article's notability, to the point where he claims one person created it when it was a completely different user. Op seems to be on a one man war to wipe out all of roller hockey from the wiki. -
DJSasso (
talk)
18:47, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:59, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep, per Lepricavark. And these other AFDs all seem similar:
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. Also stop misinforming everyone that these articles were all created by one user as it was not. -
DJSasso (
talk)
18:42, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:59, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep, per Lepricavark. And these other AFDs all seem similar:
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:14, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:59, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Strong Keep and Trout Slap It is truly disturbing to see what one editor with an axe to grind can do to destroy encyclopedic content. Every one of the articles that I have looked at as part of this
March to the Sea of AfDs was sourced with minimal effort; this one was no exception.
User:Zackmann08 has utterly failed to meet the obligations imposed under
WP:BEFORE to "Search for additional sources, if the main concern is notability". This and other such articles should be kept (at a minimum, on a procedural basis), and efforts should be made to find the world's largest trout for slapping purposes.
Alansohn (
talk)
04:04, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep, per Lepricavark. And these other AFDs all seem similar:
Keep. This one seems adequately referenced but most of the others are not. Please do not blanket !vote Keep on all the others
just to prove a point, even if that point has some merit. Many of them would only need to be AfDed again with a better nomination and we all have better things to do than think about roller hockey twice in our short lives. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
22:24, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:14, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:59, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep, per Lepricavark. And these other AFDs all seem similar:
Neutral Not easy to research this one as it is by very far not the most famous team with this name. (This is why you should never call your dog Elvis if you want him to be famous.) I found a couple of very weak sources that are enough to stop me !voting Delete but I didn't find any more to persuade me it could be even a weak keep but I didn't look very hard as, tbh, after looking at so many of these damn things I never want to hear of bloody roller hockey ever again. ;-) --
DanielRigal (
talk)
22:18, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional team playing in the top league at the height of roller hockey when it was playing games on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD. Clearly notable. Secondly
WP:SPORTCRIT is for players not leagues and teams and says so right on it. Thirdly this article was not created by that "one" user that you keep claiming on all these noms. Nom seems to be on a crusade to remove roller hockey from the wiki completely nominating many clearly notable articles for deletion without even doing an ounce of
WP:BEFORE checks. -
DJSasso (
talk)
18:52, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:58, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Strong Keep It took me a few minutes, but there were ample sources available about the team, which have been added to the article; with a bit more time (and patience) I could probably find and add dozens more. As with all of the other nominations cited above, nomination of this article for deletion utterly fails
WP:BEFORE, a fundamental obligation that must be met before moving forward with an AfD. Sadly,
Zackmann08 has ignored all of the issues raised at these AfDs, refused to withdraw nominations where articles have been improved to add easily located sources and has simply moved on to destroy other encyclopedic content at XfD, without having learned any lessons from these previous failures to observe policy. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Alansohn (
talk •
contribs)
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:15, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:58, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete. Only Google News hit is Wikipedia itself. Google Newspapers finds nothing and offers up other things called "stingers" by way of apology. Enough passing mentions in Google Books to prove the team existed but nothing that shows notability. I see nothing that could be used to build up a properly referenced article on this subject. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
22:05, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:15, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Strong Keep I remembered when the team was created at the peak of hype in roller hockey and it took me just a few minutes to expand the article with some of the dozens upon dozens of sources about the team available from The New York Times. The team was active more than two decades ago and I'm sure that if I dug a bit deeper I'd be able to find, and add to the article, another couple of dozen sources. But just as easily as I found the sources, the nominator -- who seems to have prejudged the entire sport -- could have and would have found those same references. This is a complete and total failure by the nominator to meet the obligations of
WP:BEFORE and to make a legitimate effort to preserve encyclopedic content.
Alansohn (
talk)
19:26, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:58, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep While I've generally been skeptical that many of these teams meet
WP:ORG, the two most significant added cites from the NYT -- a single media outlet, to be sure, but a journal of record -- shows to me that this one is close enough to meeting GNG.
Shawn in Montreal (
talk)
18:41, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. I'd like to see sources from more than one publication but the NYT is enough to keep it. Unlike most of the others up for deletion there is actually some content here worth saving. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
21:59, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:16, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:58, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Strong Keep It took me a few minutes, but there were ample sources available about the team, including
this lengthy article in The New York Times. As with all of the other nominations cited above, nomination of this article for deletion utterly fails
WP:BEFORE, a fundamental obligation that must be met before moving forward with an AfD. Sadly,
Zackmann08 has ignored all of the issues raised at these AfDs, refused to withdraw nominations where articles have been improved to add easily located sources and has simply moved on to destroy other encyclopedic content at XfD, without having learned any lessons from these previous failures to observe policy.
Alansohn (
talk)
15:29, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:16, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:57, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
One and two are good, I'd say. The rest are either non-RS or passing mentions. I think there are some notable teams that meet ORG. Not convinced this one, based in tiny Glens Falls, is one of them.
Shawn in Montreal (
talk)
14:56, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:16, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:57, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep, per Lepricavark. And these other AFDs all seem similar:
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:16, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep Everything about nomination is wrong.
WP:SPORTCRIT only applies to players, professional sports teams are notable, and pages were not all created by the same user. Stop wasting everybody's time.
Smartyllama (
talk)
20:31, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:57, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep, per Lepricavark. And these other AFDs all seem similar:
Very weak keep but not for the reasons above. Reference material is thin on the ground but there is a passing mention in the New York Times. Ironically, that is in an article about how the whole sport is (or maybe, was, as this dates to 2011) in decline
[19]. That is the only Google News hit. The team seems to have lasted less than a year and its main claim to fame seems to be that it is mentioned in a lawsuit
[20]. I don't see any harm in having a stub, particularly if it were referenced to those two sources, but I see zero chance that it will ever be a proper article. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
21:06, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:17, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:56, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Though neither the English nor French article states it, the team was named for the nickname of its coach, former Habs great
Yvan Cournoyer. Anyway, that bit of lore out of the way, we do still have strong one existing reliable source, this
RDS retrospective. Hockey and Cournoyer being what it is in Montreal, I'm confident a good archives search could find more RS -- though those would be mainly local press, raising
WP:AUD concerns. (RDS is not local. It's a national French-language sports network, though of course mainly watched in French-speaking Quebec. Still, it would satisfy AUD). There are no RS at all on the French wiki article.
Shawn in Montreal (
talk)
18:54, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep Professional team in the highest league in the sport during the height of the sports popularity with prime time games on ESPN. Easily meets GNG with looks in archives from the time. As well
WP:SPORTCRIT does not apply to teams. It only applies to players as mentioned on that page. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:02, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
There are discussing the article ON ITS MERITS. Stop being so defensive. I haven't seen a single personal attack against you in any of these discussions. Criticism is not the same thing as a personal attack.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:56, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Except I wasn't attacking you personally. I was being critical of your actions. Those are two different things, I also never said you did anything against policy although after a number of nominations where you didn't put notices on the pages, copying the same rational to many AfDs without checking to see if they fit, prods when the articles weren't eligible for prods, misrepresenting facts, among other things it would be any easy case to make for being disruptive. However, that was before you did actually violate a guideline
here and
here when you
WP:CANVASSed some editors. Now you have been breaking a guideline. You see just stating "comment pro or con" when you message only select people who all happened to agree with you in a previous Afd doesn't negate the canvass as that is known as
votestacking. Especially when you use words like "Go Team" in regards to your deletion efforts. -
DJSasso (
talk)
02:06, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:56, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I've looked for Montreal -- which maybe fares best of all the teams - and a few other franchises. I couldn't find anything else of note. To !vote keep because the nominator hasn't made a strong enough effort to search for sources that don't seem to exist doesn't seem to me to be the strongest argument.
Shawn in Montreal (
talk)
20:59, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Mass-creating ~20 AfDs without doing proper research is disruptive. Furthermore, it is unreasonable to expect the editors in this discussion to spend the time needed to search for sources for each one of these articles individually. These articles should be reviewed on a case-by-case basis, but that's essentially impossible to do under the circumstances. Therefore, I am !voting keep because I don't want anything deleted without proper review.
Lepricavark (
talk)
21:09, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I understand. And I have modified my comment above to say that I think the nom was mainly policy based. He did cite GNG first and foremost. And WP:SPORTCRIT, well, that's relevant only in the section that says it isn't, and that
WP:ORG applies. I'd rather like to keep the Roadrunners article for purely sentimental reasons as well as a feeling that this franchise + Cournoyer would have garnered good press back in the day. I daresay many of the teams in non-hockey markets or without notable people attached wouldn't fare so well. But if would take thorough archival searches for each and every one, as you say.
Shawn in Montreal (
talk)
23:00, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep I added and sourced the Cournoyer content. Certainly it can expanded upon. What I am looking at is a mass of AfDs that the NOM is apparently unwilling to retract. That is not a personal attack, it is mentioning bad behavior. And since he is mentioning my name above, Note: I have not been to this article previously.
Trackinfo (
talk)
23:31, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:17, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:54, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete. The two Google News hits are about an artists group of the same name. Google Newspapers got nothing. Google Books shows that it is also the name of a bar and some other stuff sports stuff unrelated to this. It is far from clear that this team even has the strongest claim on the article title. Stripping all that out the coverage of this team is close to nothing. I don't see notability. I don't even see verifiability. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
21:49, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:17, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:54, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Neutral. It is all very well for people to be criticising these identical nominations but pasting identical keep !votes on all the AfDs seems almost as bad. Are you checking each subject for notability or just !voting Keep to them all automatically? Anyway, I can't decide on this one. It would be a delete from me, as it seems to have pretty much nothing in RS coverage when I look at Google News, Newspapers and Books, except that it is mentioned in a lawsuit in which they sued their own league
[21]. That probably deserves a mention, either here on in the RHI article, if only to provide a bit of interest to an otherwise tedious subject. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
21:22, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I respectfully disagree. If the nom wants each article to be reviewed on its own merits, he should not open ~20 AfDs at the same time. I am not going to search for references for each article individually, especially since the nom evidently made no such search either.
Lepricavark (
talk)
13:35, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I have been checking each one individually. Most of them take less than 5 minutes (using the Google News, Newspapers and Books links provided at the top of the page) to be found clearly non-notable or clearly exceptions to the general non-notability of most things about this subject. Only a few lurking just on the edge of deserving the benefit of the doubt take longer to decide and those are the ones that I have been saying "neutral" to as I don't want to spend too long on this either. Even if the nominations were better and the AfDs grouped (which I agree would have been helpful) it would still be the case that some of the subjects would be more notable than others and so I think we would still be looking at them individually either way. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
19:40, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Professional major league team that was playing at the height of roller hockey popularity when it was on prime time ESPN which easily meets
WP:AUD.
WP:SPORTCRIT is about players, not leagues or teams. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:17, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep no evidence that nom made any effort to search for sources. Nominating with the same rationale for every AfD without (apparently) even checking to see if each article fits the rationale is a non-starter.
Lepricavark (
talk)
20:53, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep I see
WP:SNOW Keeps. Someone is out of line. Let me explain the principle behind
WP:BEFORE. A responsible editor sees a problem, does a google search on the subject (so they become educated). If the subject does not google; take action, take it to AfD. Let's get rid of the junk. If you find sources for an unsourced article, add them. Problem solved. No other editors need to get involved. Instead, this lazy NOM didn't do step 1 or 2 and caused all of us to be bothered by this. Multiply by some 20 articles all AfDed at the same time and it detracts from all our our editing time.
Trackinfo (
talk)
00:39, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep Based on the source that Shawn in Montreal found. There is a story to tell here. It will probably never be more than a few paragraphs but it would be slightly more than an uninformative stub. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
21:12, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep First off. World Championships are very clearly not trivial. Easily sourced per
WP:GNG if the nom followed even the slightest
WP:BEFORE process. Secondly,
WP:SPORTCRIT applies to athletes not leagues or teams. Who created the articles is of little matter, many editors edit only in specific topics. For some unclear reason the nom has been trying to wipe out all inline hockey articles. Some of which are very clearly notable. -
DJSasso (
talk)
18:19, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep The size and international scope of the tournament, combined with the sources already in the article and available elsewhere, all add up to surpassing the notability standard.
Alansohn (
talk)
19:38, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Speedy keep World championships are clearly notable. Plenty of sources are available. Nomination is disruptive. Nominator should be ashamed.
Smartyllama (
talk)
20:47, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep This nom is on a one man wrecking crew, call it a
WP:AGENDA to wipe out the existence of this sport. In the process, he is out to destroy the hard work of other editors of years past. This article has been around for more than 5 years and has had multiple editors contribute. He is using a misapplication of
WP:SPORTSCRIT to misguide the discussions. The appropriate standard is
WP:NSPORTS where this World Championship level event would obviously pass the notability standard. For other editors, as I dissect the damage of already deleted articles, I am having them restored to my sandbox. I don't have much editing time currently, so please feel free to look those articles up in my sandbox.
User:Trackinfo/sandbox/Inline hockey restoration project Go ahead, properly add sources. Make these subjects worthy of reposting and capable of passing (or better, discouraging) any AfD.
Trackinfo (
talk)
02:17, 29 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep Team at the top level professional league during the height of roller hockey popularity with games on ESPN in prime time. Hardly trivial. Easily meets GNG with some newspaper archives from the time period. Also
WP:SPORTCRIT applies to players, not leagues and teams which it mentions on its page. Also like a number of other articles in these mass nominations was not created by that "one" user. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:00, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep The initial critique was that this article only had one source. In fact it had five at the time. The NOM clearly did not do a
WP:BEFORE but is apparently on a one person concerted attack to delete all of this content and wipe this league from wikipedia existence. In the few minutes between when I saw the NOM's intent to take this to AfD, I added another 5 sources and still am not off of the first page of google.
WP:NTEMP This league may not have become a sustaining entity but it survived for six seasons over a seven year period of time. It had one, lop sided team get close to 10,000 in attendance, meaning it was a real phenomenon. This is the master article over 28 team articles and apparently a bunch of other articles about this league which have already been deleted. Since no history is available I can't see what has already been deleted. All of this development is individually being attacked in an improper, wholesale attempt to overwhelm the system.
Trackinfo (
talk)
17:45, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
@
Zackmann08: What I am saying is 1) You did not look before you went on this attack. There are a lot of sources out there. And 2) in that blind rage to delete this content, you are doing a mass deletion piecemeal. You are deliberately and improperly overwhelming the system. That is not the way to do such a thing and as an experienced editor you should know better. This should be part of a wider RfC on the wholesale concept. Stop all of these individual AfDs and redirect to a wholesale discussion.
Trackinfo (
talk)
18:01, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep This was the major league of roller hockey. It had a national prime time spot in the US. There are hundreds if not thousands of sources that can be easily found for this. The nom has been on a crusade to delete all inline hockey articles. At this point I am seriously considering this to be at a disruptive editing situation. Did you even remotely try to fulfill
WP:BEFORE when nominating? -
DJSasso (
talk)
18:21, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
No what they said was you didn't put the notices on each page. So a lot of things got deleted because people didn't know they were nominated. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:04, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
And now you have successfully deleted pages, which in turn leaves pages full of redlinks that also have gotten deleted. That my friend is disruptive editing. I will gladly join Djsasso in pursuing a case.
Trackinfo (
talk)
19:20, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
What blows my mind more than anything is that he even nominated World Championships articles. Like who in their right mind would do that. -
DJSasso (
talk)
19:27, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Strong Keep I came here through the nominator's AfD for the
New Jersey Rockin Rollers, where it took me seconds to find
this source, which is one of dozens that are in-depth articles about the team and the league available from The New York Times. The failure to observe even the spirit of
WP:BEFORE raises significant concerns regarding the legitimacy of the nominator's effort to destroy encyclopedic content about this league.
Alansohn (
talk)
19:31, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Speedy Keep This is completely ridiculous. There are ample sources available. Nominator is throwing out baseless accusations claiming all pages were created by a single user, which is completely wrong. He should be ashamed of himself. Let's close this and stop wasting everybody's time.
Smartyllama (
talk)
20:39, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Strong Keep (and consider this a blanket Keep for the rest of the RHI noms which are trying to nuclear option anything that used an inline skate and had a crowd watching). The
United Football League (2009–12) and
Fall Experimental Football League also exist just fine, even if very few followed those. Was plenty notable in its time, and notability does not expire even if we don't look back at professional roller hockey that much. It is plenty sourced and the nominator needs to definitely pursue
WP:BEFORE before any future noms, and unless said departing editor was creating complete falsehoods (and here the editor was an IP back when they could create an article, so yeah, disqualifying that), there should never be a cause to delete articles just because the creating editor departed the project. Nate•(
chatter)14:37, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep, per Lepricavark. And these other AFDs all seem similar:
Keep. There is definitely scope to make this a shorter and better article by losing the unreferenced cruft but the subject itself is perfectly valid and there is enough source material for a well referenced article if anybody wants to write one. --
DanielRigal (
talk)
22:42, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep - has received coverage in various industry publications, in addition to the references in article see
this from Aviation International News and
this from Aviation Week. All are from independent publications and have the company in question as the primary focus, satisfying
WP:GNG and the depth clause of
WP:CORP, and none of these are self published, all the articles carry bylines from independent authors instead of a PR company, fulfilling the independence clause of
WP:CORP.
C628 (
talk)
15:58, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete - Sources based on press releases aren't reliable. The GNG isn't met. I appreciate that the creator of the article wants it to be retained but let's get serious - it's a small private charter service, it's not a commercial airline. "Significant coverage in independent, reliable sources" is what the GNG requires, not a bunch of PR department-produced "press".
Exemplo347 (
talk)
23:46, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I question again how you can come to the conclusion that the sources presented are publicity materials—if they were reprinted press releases as is often done I would agree with you, but they were all written by independent authors in multiple separate publications. In fact, if you could provide evidence that the sources are merely reworded press releases I would appreciate it, because ironically the company itself seems to be
using third party coverage in lieu of press releases. I also do not agree that the size of a company has any relevance to its notability.
C628 (
talk)
00:29, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
It's quite simple - the article you've created is based on, and is referenced to, interviews with the person running the proposed air charter service. Those interviews are not Independent Sources by long-standing convention here. Furthermore, the two links you've posted here are also based on interviews with the same person. I don't see how an experienced editor could have tripped up like this.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
22:24, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Hey, I'm an inclusionist. I don't think it's a trip up at all, but I'm fully aware my opinion with regards to notability is sometimes more liberal than others.
C628 (
talk)
22:30, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Fails
WP:GNG: BEFORE did not produce significant coverage in demonstrably independent and reliable sources. PROD removed by page creator with no statement. —
swpbT15:41, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Thanks for that Shawn. I first heard of this editor in December last when he tried to put his village
Bahanaga on the map. The article was very poor, so I rewrote it, added pushpin, coordinates, refs, and I even managed to identify the local language, (
Oriya), so I could add the translation in the infobox. I detest advertizing on Wikipedia, but I'm happy to assist a newb, with little command of English, when his purpose is only to get his small corner of the planet identified on wikipedia. I had only been addressing the article for 1 hour 20 minutes when you posted, so patience - please.
MarkDask19:54, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete:I came up with him being a solid, but not award-winning player at Michigan and a member of the USA (gold medal) team in the
2009 World Junior A Challenge, neither of which meets
WP:NHOCKEY standards; he currently plays tier 2 German hockey, and is unlikely to move up. I have vetted him as carefully as I could.
Bill McKenna (
talk)
21:57, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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According to the creator of the article, Fabanelka (or Fabenelka, see history) played for a well known team in 2016. However, Google shows zero hits for the name, and for alternative spellings. There's one Ghanese player nicknamed 'Anelka'; he died in 2015 though.
IMirjamI (
talk)
15:22, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Speedy delete Blatant hoax. Hoax gallery is only for pages which survived at least a year or were covered in mainstream sources, this only survived about six months. Shame it lasted even that long.
Smartyllama (
talk)
20:53, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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The result was keep. The consensus is not to delete, therefore a default keep. Merge or other similar actions can be discussed separately. Tone09:36, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Nations at the xxx pages are usually reserved for events with multiple sports or disciplines. This one focuses on just one sport. Also quoting Peter Rehse, from another similar AFD
[22], "they are all a rehash of a single source. National results for events that are borderline notable themselves. Even there there is nothing demonstrating that [the country] performed anywhere near notable."
Sportsfan 1234 (
talk)
00:02, 9 January 2017 (UTC)
Also nominating the following for the same reasons:reply
230 more nominations
Please view the
AfD page for the full list of additional nominations.
Speedy Keep - These should should be judged on their notability individually - Mass nominating all 230 articles is just plain disruptive!, Also I've collapsed them as they were taking up half of the AFD log!. –
Davey2010Talk01:13, 9 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete – this is the kind of spam information that doesn't warrant its own article and will likely never be looked at in its current form.
Laurdecltalk09:24, 11 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. EAC is a high-profile, high-level competition, and I don't think these articles are overkill. They "make sense" by serving a useful purpose: extracting information about whatever e.g. Albania achieved in the 80-year or so history of the EAC is something a reader might legitimately be interested in, yet is extremely hard to do using just articles on individual editions. Merging into e.g.
Albania at the European Athletics Championships is a remote possibility, but since EAC is a multi-event championship with 23 editions thus far, this is bound to create huge and unwieldy articles.
GregorB (
talk)
20:11, 12 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Merge to "Nation at
European Athletics Championships" articles. Individual country performances at a single edition are not of note in themselves. The history of the country at the competition as a whole certainly is as these performances form a key part of countries' athletics history. The competition spent much of its history at the second most important athletics meet after the Olympics and remains a key competition for a region which created and excels at the sport. A topic of much national importance and note.
SFB00:46, 21 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Sorry for the mis-spelling in the edit summary, there was a floating text block blocking my view, and I tried to put the edit summary in blind. Samuel Morrow is indeed mentioned in passing in a number of religious history books, but as far as notability, I don't see it.
GenQuest"Talk to Me"13:13, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Non-notable preparatory school (UK sense, ie to age 13) with one court case. Does not seem notable enough for an article.
PamD11:33, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete Does not meet the General Notability Guidelines. Before someone comes along and says that "schools are always notable" let me pre-emptively say that you'll need to provide verifiable references to prove that this particular establishment meets the requirements.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
16:49, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
+comment. Considering the court case was about corporal punishment, I would like this artto stay for awhile until it can be figured out what the implications were for corporal punishment in the U.K. There is the potential that the case had some influence. Considering the article and stub is new, I would like the article to stay for awhile to give editors an opportunity to improve it. If it turns out this is all there is, it can always be deleted but at least we have an opportunity to improve it.
Postcard Cathy (
talk)
20:06, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
The reliable sources aren't out there, beyond this single newspaper article. What possible purpose can be served by retaining this? Have you found any additional reliable sources to support your suggestion?
Exemplo347 (
talk)
21:01, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete A head master was sued unsuccessfully 71 years ago. I don't think we want to consider preparatory schools notable simply because one of their administrators has been unsuccessfully sued. In any case this subject lacks the coverage needed for notability. Corporal punishment was not banned until 1987 ([
[24]]) in the U.K. That's 43 years later which makes it very unlikely this incident is a significant factor in it's history.
Gab4gab (
talk)
20:58, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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delete A bit hard to search but an article sourced entirely from research papers from a small group of researchers is not appropriate.
Mangoe (
talk)
17:41, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Not sure if anyone noticed the talk page I created with multiple other sources lacking in topics of the article, and high IF replicated studies on topics not discussed. This page could use many many edits but I have a COI and cannot/should not. Happy to provide sources. As for no 'reality based sources' I am unsure what that means, and will add their are published studies in Nature Medicine, Science and Circulation among many other reputable journals. As for reputable teams from large institutions:
The Lucas Group at the Max Planck Institute is pursuing molecular hydrogen as a radical scavenger in diseases as one of their key topics
Dr Garth Nicolson
/info/en/?search=Garth_L._Nicolson published the review article that was deleted from this topic regarding cancer patients and radiotherapy. Not sure why the statement was linked to his review, when the original source, this 49 patient randomized controlled study, would have been a better reference
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22146004
I understand that it has it's own page which may be the issue. Many other therapeutic references to molecules with 1/100th the study or less(often a single rodent study) are posted as sub sections of the main article.
TarnavaA (
talk)
19:43, 23 January 2017 (UTC) —
TarnavaA (
talk •
contribs) has made
few or no other edits outside this topic. reply
Can you please keep your remarks short? You mention above that you have a Conflict of Interest here. Can you explain, very specifically, what your conflict of interest is?
Exemplo347 (
talk)
23:40, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
COI: I have international patents filed for a tablet that creates super saturated levels of H2 in water in minutes, as well as other int patents filed for various devices relating to hydrogen rich water and manufacturing techniques to do it.
TarnavaA (
talk)
02:52, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Comment Your conflict of interest basically means that you're not commenting with a neutral point of view. You have a direct financial interest in the continued existence of this article, meaning your comments will be given less weight than someone who is independent of the subject. I'd also like to point out that none of the references you have provided represent the Substantial Coverage in Reliable, Independent Sources that Wikipedia requires. You need to read
WP:COI and
WP:GNG. Wikipedia does not exist to provide free advertising space.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
22:30, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
RESPONSE: I am not sure what you are implying. This is neither my article, nor am I convinced it was properly posted. I am simply adding a body of evidence that was lacking, and no one else had bothered looking into or verifying. The very first thing I wrote was that I have a COI. I also commented that this may be better suited in a more condensed version as a subsection of the H2 page, as is the case with many other molecules that have 1/100th of the research and published articles. I can give many examples.
TarnavaA (
talk)
22:40, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I'm not implying - I'm directly stating that your conflict of interest means that you are not able to give a neutral point of view. These discussions are based purely on Wikipedia's policies and guidelines, nothing more. "Molecular hydrogen therapy," as a concept, does not meet Wikipedia's General Notability Guideline. The links you have provided either completely fail to use the phrase "Molecular hydrogen therapy" or mention it purely in passing - that's not enough.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
22:45, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
You stated 'advertising.' Again, I will say that this subject is more suitable as a sub section of the H2 page. Ample studies exist for the topic to be touched on briefly. Many molecules have a single study, in rodents, in a low impact factor journal, which is mentioned on the wikipedia page in a sub section. I started the talk page to offer higher quality studies for a NEUTRAL party to edit before it was nominated for deletion.
TarnavaA (
talk)
22:50, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I'm sure that if the time comes when "Molecular hydrogen therapy" becomes notable, someone totally unconnected with it will create an article. At this present moment, the guidelines aren't met. There's not even enough independent sourcing to justify adding this concept to the article about Hydrogen at the moment. You'll have to be patient - currently it's nothing more than a fringe concept.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
22:54, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Again, I didn't create this article and do not know who did. I came to address errors in the articles design and offer sources to higher IF replicated articles. I agree that this page does not meet the thresholds. If there is any consistency in Wikipedia it absolutely meets the threshold to be a sub section in the H2 page.
TarnavaA (
talk)
22:57, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Nobody has said that you created this article so let's just put an end to that. As for the Hydrogen article - it's a Featured Article, and as such the threshold for inclusion is strictly enforced. There's no way a Fringe theory could be added to that article without it being immediately reverted.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
23:00, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I do not fully understand the threshold then, or how a featured article differs from a normal article and to what extent research needs to be done. With over 600 published articles, 40~ clinical trials, several large scale clinical trials under way and published articles in journals such as Nature Medicine, Science and Circulation... the evidence threshold is 100x higher than the evidence presented in these pages:
/info/en/?search=Nicotinamide_riboside/info/en/?search=Pyrroloquinoline_quinone
that isn't even mentioning the paid studies included above, and the fact that the NR page is a half advertisement for chromadex.
TarnavaA (
talk)
23:10, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
The articles you have just linked to have a huge variety of coverage, meaning that they meet the General Notability Guidelines that I have already taken care to point out to you. You really should take the time to actually read the guidelines.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
23:16, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I did. it says significant secondary source coverage. I did not see a definitive measure of what constitutes significant. The majority of the news surrounding NR is regarding Chromadex announcing it's own studies, so self propogated publicity, or mostly negative publicity regarding the brand Elysium.
TarnavaA (
talk)
23:26, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
"Significant" is the key word there - not passing mentions - and the argument that other articles are weak has no effect here - this discussion is about this article specifically.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
23:31, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
when a definition in terms of acceptance is subjective, the question of why the weaker sourcing has been accepted for article A but stronger evidence proposed under the same subsection parameters for article B is flat out rejected is a legitimate one to ask and can lead to a better udnerstanding of said subjective terms, which you were quick to point to. I presume consistency is deemed important.
TarnavaA (
talk)
23:52, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
As I've already said, this discussion is about this article, in isolation, and not about any other article.
WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is pertinent here. I don't want to keep repeating the same answers to you over and over again, so feel free to read them again at your leisure if you're going to keep asking the same questions.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
23:56, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
After reading that I would argue WP:Bias, as found in the huffington post article I linked in Japan over 10% of the bottled water industry is now hydrogen rich water, and the inhalation devices are being widely used in hospitals. Hydrogen rich water has it's own Japanese wiki page, not even considering h2 inhalation and saline
TarnavaA (
talk)
00:17, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
That article doesn't give any significant coverage to "Molecular hydrogen therapy" as a concept. That's the problem here, which I've already pointed out to you very clearly.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
00:19, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Do any of them give significant coverage to "Molecular hydrogen therapy" - specifically this - and not just the surrounding theories that may or may not be connected? Come on, this is quite simple and it shouldn't need me to repeat it so many times.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
00:23, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Look, if you want an article about Hydrogen-rich water to exist, you should head over to
Wikipedia:Requested articles and request an article about that concept. THIS article is specifically about "Molecular hydrogen therapy" as a concept. The two things may be connected but they are NOT interchangeable terms.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
00:46, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Is part of the deletion process not suggesting different topic names and modifications? That is right at the top of the wikipedia deletion page.
TarnavaA (
talk)
00:55, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Again, I am proposing the name be changed. I would suggest 'Biological effects of Molecular Hydrogen' as a neutral name. As for hydrogen rich water vs inhalation vs saline, many drugs and other products have many different delivery methods, oral, injection etc and DO NOT have different wiki entries for different delivery methods, and different delivery methods are known to have different side effects and efficacy targeting certain pathologies. By your remarks, both hydrogen rich water and hydrogen inhalation possess the required threshold of reliable, replicated research sources and significant secondary source attention to justify an article. It would be silly to have them as separate articles. Here are more news articles, a great benefit of Wikipedia is to give reliable, neutral sources of information rather than the awful information present in some of these news articles:
I can continue posting more articles and reiterating that the name can and should be changed, and much of the information present can and should be edited and cleaned up.
Note At no point have I said that this unproven fringe theory deserves its own article, so I don't know how you could have got that impression & I'm astounded at the mischaracterisation of my remarks. It definitely does not deserve one - Wikipedia does not give undue weight to conjecture-based ideas that have not been proven to be anything more than placebo effect-driven fads.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
07:15, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Have you read any of the high impact factor articles? Replicated studies consisting of human trials, in high impact factor journals? I posted several on the talk page. Do you have any expertise or background knowledge of any kind to form your statement? I got that idea from your statements. 100's of articles from Many research teams, numerous clinical trials and replicated studies in high IF journals meets a threshold for discussion and is well beyond countless articles on wiki. Secondary sources became the issue, to which many were linked and I could link 100 more. The exact phrasing 'molecular hydrogen therapy' became your next point as articles spoke specifically to H2 inhalation or hydrogen rich water. I addressed that and added that a name change is warranted. Now it's gone round about and you're dismissing the science baselessly, at this point I'm going to add presumably without bothering to read any of it or possessing the ability to interpret it even if you had.
TarnavaA (
talk)
07:45, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete Arbitrary thing created by one person's opinion. Also "Arabic music video" is not a notable thing, any more than "List of French youtube videos" would be.
ValarianB (
talk)
14:00, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete - several concerns including blatant OR, misleading title (the article is specifically about music videos but the title doesn't tell us this), fails
WP:LISTN due to no reliable sources covering this and, lastly, it would require constant updating. Inclusion criteria is also a bit wishy washy
Spiderone21:23, 30 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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This is an indiscriminate directory of businesses that happen to be located in, or have their headquarters in, the same city -
WP:NOTDIRECTORY points 3, 4, and 7 explicitly say that this sort of page is not encyclopaedic. There is no source that treats a business being located in Omaha as a defining feature of a business any more than any other location (contrary to
WP:LISTN and possibly
WP:NOTDIRECTORY point 6). There are four citations given, one is about Warren Buffett (only tangentially relevant to the topic of the list), the other three are solely to verify that a non-notable business is located in Omaha.
Thryduulf (
talk)
10:42, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep - per
WP:LISTPURP and
WP:LISTN, this list has a well-defined inclusion criteria, serves as a useful navigation tool, takes the place of a list as a part of the
Economy of Omaha article, and similar lists can be found in reliable sources, such as regional trade magazines and newspapers.
Smmurphy(
Talk)14:11, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep per
WP:LISTPURP. The nominator seems to be confused about the purpose of the
WP:NOTDIRECTORY policy; it was created to avoid Wikipedia become a poor, badly maintained copy of the original
Yahoo or
DMOZ, i.e. a partial, incomplete listing of links to external websites or entities. The nominated article is no such thing: it is a list of Wikipedia articles about companies, not a mere listing of companies. That makes all the difference, as the purpose of the list is to allow readers to reach the relevant article (i.e. no different to a category, and therefore allowed per
WP:NOTDUPE)
Surely there's a couple of red links here and there in the list, though those have always been considered request for someone to create the article. If there are entries without a wikilink, those could be removed, but I don't think there are.
Diego (
talk)
14:19, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
How is this any different to a DMOZ list of companies in Omah that have Wikipedia articles (along with some that don't, and some that might have in future)?
Thryduulf (
talk)
17:31, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Because DMOZ is not restricted to companies that are subject of encyclopedic coverage, and this Wikipedia list is. (Which BTW means that there should only be red links for companies that would merit a Wikipedia article, per
WP:REDLINK). Being a navigational aid within the project to index its content is an accepted purpose for Wikipedia lists per the
WP:LISTPURP guideline.
Diego (
talk)
17:57, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
KeepDiego Moya has a very good rationale for keeping this list. Most all of these items in the list are blue linked articles. A very few have red links. I think this is probably the most acceptable kind of list article that we have on Wikipedia. If this was a list that had no blue links, then serious pruning would be in order, and even deletion would be a possibility,. Also, because most all of these are blue linked, this means the articles are already sourced (supposedly), and therefore the list satisfies the criteria for inclusion across core
content policies. Sometimes it is refreshing to come a across an article at AfD, such as this, which is a
slam dunk. ---
Steve Quinn (
talk)
15:06, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep The majority of the entries do have WP articles, but for those that don't, per
LISTCOMPANYA company or organization may be included in a list of companies or organizations whether or not it meets the Wikipedia notability requirement, unless a given list specifically requires this. If the company or organization does not have an existing article in Wikipedia, a citation to an independent, reliable source should be provided to establish its membership in the list's group. I'm not seeing anything in
WP:NOT that clearly overrules this, and if we don't want such lists to remain we'll have to get the policies and guidelines changed
: Noyster (talk),15:36, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
The list has to be encyclopaedic, not just the contents, otherwise any list of X in Y would be suitable for Wikipedia, regardless of any other consideration but that is clearly incorrect.
Thryduulf (
talk)
17:31, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Strictly speaking, being discussed as a group is "one accepted reason why a list topic is considered notable" per
WP:LISTN, not a requirement.
LISTN also says that "There is no present consensus for ... what other criteria may justify the notability of stand-alone lists".
Diego (
talk)
17:51, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Another way to look at this is - this can be viewed as a
spinoff article and article that is related to "
Economy of Omaha, Nebraska", which has been previously mentioned (above). So in essence, this topic has been discussed as a group, in a general way in the article entitled "Economy of Omaha, Nebraska". It can be seen that it is not necessary to look for reliable sources that cover the intro for this list article due to these circumstances. This list article and the "Economy" article seem to directly correlate to each other. Also, it seems that it would be easy enough to copy some of the refs, as needed, from the "Economy" article for the intro of the list article - I would guess. I haven't really taken a serious look at those references yet. --
Steve Quinn (
talk)
18:52, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. A bit of good faith should be applied here as the article title is misleading. It isn't just a indiscriminate list of businesses in Omaha (of which I would most certainly support deletion) but it really a list of notable companies or corporations that are centered in Omaha. I support renaming the article to suit the lists true purpose The outlying issue is that the list has been used for promotional by local businesses - I recently culled a good number of them, and could probably do plenty more, but this is really just a cleanup issue that can be easily maintained. So long as there is enough notable companies to be included in the list criteria, it passes
WP:LISTN.
Ajf773 (
talk)
07:28, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
This nomination has nothing to do with bias against Nebraska or anywhere else. It's simply the only list of this nature that I was aware of when I made the nomination (it's the only such article named "List of businesses in <city>"). Having now looked at those other lists I think they are just as unencyclopaedic as this one is. The lead section of the Seattle article is good prose and belongs in an article about the area. Similarly the list of Fortune 500 companies in Dallas could be a significant, discriminate list if there was a little bit of prose about why such companies have chosen to base themselves there (and if there were any citations that would be a bonus). Listing the hundreds or maybe thousands of other companies in these large metropolitan areas can never be anything more than a directory of businesses - even if restricted to those with Wikipedia articles there is no link between their notability and their location in most cases so it's not a relevant categorisation. As for being an extension of the economy article - nice theory but it would still need to add something encyclopaedic that was too large to include, but it doesn't it's just a directory.
Thryduulf (
talk)
11:05, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep A well-organized list of notable businesses in a well-defined area. This is exactly what lists are for. Per the editing guideline
WP:CLN, lists and categories are intended to co-exist and "these methods should not be considered in conflict with each other. Rather, they are synergistic, each one complementing the others." Irrational fears inspired by the essay
WP:LISTCRUFT are hardly a justification for deletion; for that matter, *every* list must be deleted lest LISTCRUFT become a problem once we take this to its illogical conclusion.
Alansohn (
talk)
16:14, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. The list is certainly not indiscriminate--it is limited to the ones that are notable enough to have WP articles. Lists and categories serve complementary functions--a category is automatically populated and very compact; a list however gives some indication of what the subject is. If you are want to look at articles of some particular type of companies in Chicago, a list lets you select them. If you don't know the exact name, a list helps you find it. If, , you are looking for potentially dubious articles, or articles worth upgrading, a list helps you screen them DGG (
talk )
16:43, 27 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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The result was keep. It would, however, be helpful if any of the editors advocating to keep the article would assist in editing to add independent sources. – Juliancolton |
Talk03:44, 31 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Weak keep - Bartercard has quite a lot of hits on google news from reliable sources (when you sift through sporting sponsorship mentions) so I think notability is there, but as the editor points out, none of them are used as sources in the article and in parts it is written like an advertisement. Not opposed to any editor doing a rewrite or adding in reliable sources, but it may be potentially easier to
start again. --
Whats new?(talk)21:57, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Assistance please. I could only find four independant reliable secondary potential references. Could you please list some of what your found for me.
Aoziwe (
talk)
12:13, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete per nom. Not individually notable; all relevant content can be covered in the main article (my redirect was
reverted by a fan without explanation).
User:Scott Sanchez, it is not the nominator or the closing administrator's responsibility to move material to a fan site. The main "Alvin" article is bloated already, and seems to contain enough relevant material.
Drmies (
talk)
18:33, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep How can a company with a "sales revenue of $353 million in 2005" not be notable? "most of article is about Genius, not KYE Systems Corp." As there isn't a separate article for Genius, perhaps
WP:RM is the answer.
Timmyshin (
talk)
07:43, 16 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete as the two comments, one of which confirms this current article is unacceptable, simply ascertain the company must be notable but there's nothing genuine for satisfying our policies, this article is complete advertising complete with the blatant sections and PR sources alone.
SwisterTwistertalk05:36, 19 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete On Second thoughts. I spend some time today trying to find reliable secondary sources. Surprisingly there were like none (and I have no idea why). While this company might be a large corporation, if there are no third party sources, it is difficult to write an NPOV article per
WP:WHYN. Accordingly, I think I will go with a TNT delete. --
Lemongirl942 (
talk)
16:02, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Comment I'm starting to see a number of articles with "Delete" comments stating that the article is "too promotional for Wikipedia". That is *not* a reason to delete an article. The only question we need consider is whether the topic is noteworthy and meets GNG. There are far too many articles with this comment and it is due to a misunderstanding of policy and a misinterpretation of same. Obvious promotional content should be removed - and that's what the policy
WP:NOT is about.
-- HighKing++ 22:04, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep The current article is terrible but the topic is notable and is not made any easier by the fact that one of KYE's companies is probably better known as a brand that the parent - that being the "Genius" and the
Mouse Systems Corp. brand (which has its own article). Also there is every possibility that other published sources exist in other languages. Nonetheless, there are sufficient independent third party sources just for KYE that get it over the GNG line
Here's a random review of one of their products by an independent third party publisher (Computer Shopper).
And here's another. Tons of these but they demonstrate the products are notable.
The problem here is not that the company is a small company - it is that there are hardly any reliable secondary third-party sources to satisfy
WP:CORPDEPTH. I am aware that the company makes computer peripherals. However, the only coverage about it seems to be solely about the Microsoft scandal and that too a very brief mention (you can see that every source above only talks about this one incident and that too it is mostly about Microsoft, with a passing mention of KYE). There is literally nothing else available. The reviews about the mice are in websites which we consider unreliable sources and do not contain any information about the company. This falls far short of
WP:CORPDEPTH. --
Lemongirl942 (
talk)
08:55, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I disagree. The coverage in the links to the books I provided meet the criteria set out in
WP:RS and they are as much about KYE Systems involvement as they are about Microsoft and they are more than a passing reference.
I also disagree with your statement which we consider unreliable sources. I am very much aware of the criteria (both policy and guidelines) and both ComputerShopper and IXBTlabs are reliable and independent third party. Can you please provide another AfD where these websites were considered unreliable? The reviews demonstrate that the products are known and reliable.
Finally, I reiterate that the sole question being asked at AfD is whether a topic is notable. You appear to concede that the topic is notable, albeit that sources are hard to come by (in English with the standard alphabet and online). On the balance of probabilities, there are more sources available in other languages and in other alphabets. On the balance of probabilities, given the age of the company and its pre-internet existence, there are sources available that are not online. Finally, given the sources I've already provided above with minimal effort, while the article is poorly written and the sources are barely sufficient to establish notability, I believe it meets the criteria.
-- HighKing++ 11:18, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
You can see my analysis of the book sources. None of that meets the indepth coverage required in
WP:CORPDEPTH.
However for IXBTlabs I do not see any indication of editorial control. As for ComputerShopper, yes, the review seems to be done by a staff editor. However, I do not see any indepth coverage about the company here.
Notability is not the sole thing to debate at AFD - we have deleted articles for multiple reasons - promotional content, blp reasons, not enough sources. Notability is not the only reason for deletion. And the essential thing about notability that I use is
WP:WHYN. If there are not enough reliable secondary sources talking about the subject, we should not have an article. --
Lemongirl942 (
talk)
01:58, 30 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Non notable episode, Considering the show went on for 9 series' without individual episode articles I'm abit miffed as to why this was ever created, Anyway only links i'm, finding are DVD related, Nothing to merge and redirect is a bit pointless seeing as only one episode article out of 200 exist, ANyway Fails GNG. –
Davey2010Talk02:59, 16 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete - Fails [WP:GNG]]. Article lacks independent reliable sources. Google and HighBeam searches provides nothing to establish notability.
CBS527Talk03:56, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete. It's interesting, but just not really all that notable as there just hasn't been any true coverage for this. I was going to suggest a merge into the main article for the first game, like maybe a subsection about spinoffs by the game's creators, but it looks like
The Game (treasure hunt) has its own notability issues.
Tokyogirl79 (。◕‿◕。)09:57, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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This is about an event that is never going to happen. It is thus not noteable. If anything, it should probably be redirected to the article on Hillary's campaign.
Jtrainor (
talk)
04:30, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete per
WP:CRYSTALBALL; never occurred, and therefore serves as pure speculation. Don't redirect to the article on the campaign as the activities of the campaign would be entirely separate from the organization of the inauguration by committee.Mélencron (
talk)
06:14, 23 January 2017 (UTC) (struck as erroneous vote by user)reply
Redirect This very short stub can easily be made a section of the campaign article. Failing that, delete as not independently notable. Only 1 of the sources is actually specifically about Clinton's transition. The rest are generic "transition to whoever the next president is" articles, which would actually be more appropriate to be umbrella-ed somewhere under Obama as a function of his outgoing administration.
ResultingConstant (
talk)
16:20, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I'd be open to redirect, except my own search indicates there is a lot of expansion that can be done to this article, though I otherwise agree with you that it's not in a good state at present.
DarjeelingTea (
talk)
17:21, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
redirect - This material is best merged into the Clinton campaign article. Planned events do not make history. Same goes for the Romney transition.
Bcharles (
talk)
06:00, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Merge to campaign article. Considering how divided both candidates were on policy, the article has worthwhile information on what could have been, but since it will not actually take place there does not seem to be a viable reason to have a standalone article.
TheGracefulSlick (
talk)
03:55, 27 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Comment - What speedy category? Software doesn't fit any of the A7 categories, because it isn't a company, person, or web content. It isn't advertising if it doesn't describe the product well enough to try to sell it. Probably hoax, but the speedy criterion is clear hoaxes.
Robert McClenon (
talk)
15:32, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete May or may not be a hoax. Some secret company may or may not be working on a new programming language. The fact is, there are no reliable sources to reference an article, even a stub. The article can be recreated if/when the project comes to fruition and if/when the product becomes notable.
Neiltonks (
talk)
17:28, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete It indicates that the article is about a product under development which has no notability whatsoever, article is promotional and unverifiable.
Fbergo (
talk)
01:59, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Article was almost entirely copyvio (removed, see history). Band does not appear to be notable. Web search does not turn up coverage in reliable sources, band has not had major chart success. –
Jonesey95 (
talk)
04:37, 9 January 2017 (UTC)reply
This is not a valid reason to keep an article about a band. Note the header of that section: "Musicians or ensembles (this category includes bands, singers, rappers, orchestras, DJs, musical theatre groups, instrumentalists, etc.) may be notable if they meet at least one of the following criteria." (emphasis added.) It does not say "are notable".
In the header of that page, please read this: "It is not enough to make unsourced or poorly sourced claims in the article, or to assert a band's importance on a talk page or AfD page – the article itself must document notability through the use of reliable sources, and no criterion listed in this page confers an exemption from having to reliably source the article just because passage of the criterion has been claimed.–
Jonesey95 (
talk)
20:56, 22 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Yes that's fair, the SNG criteria support the presumption of notability but do not replace the GNG. It's also true that I haven't been able to find any reviews of this band or their work in reliable sources. What I did find are three profiles of this band on what appear to be fansites:
[25],
[26],
[27]. The danceartist page quotes an interview with Charles Simmons, but I couldn't find the interview online. The fansites are not reliable sources, but those plus the charting singles, plus the three other Wikipedias with articles on this band, plus the fact that this band was from the pre-internet era, lead me to believe that there are offline sources (probably in German or Russian) covering this band. It's all guesswork though, so I'll change my vote to a weak keep. Deleting this article would be no great loss. --
Cerebellum (
talk)
00:29, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. The national chart hits, while not huge, demonstrate sufficient significance for inclusion. I wouldn't expect a Google search to find much on a German Euoropop group from the mid-90s, but German print coverage from the time is likely to exist. --
Michig (
talk)
09:04, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
See
WP:N - notable if either the GNG or the SNG is satisfied. We have a reliable source for the chart placings, therefore the notability is documented via a reliable source. --
Michig (
talk)
19:54, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Sorry to butt in, but I understand the text differently - to me no criterion listed in this page confers an exemption from having to reliably source the article just because passage of the criterion has been claimed means that you have to provide a source verifying that you've met the criteria. You can't just say a single charted, you have to source that claim. The link to
Offizielle Deutsche Charts verifies the claim and thus meets the SNG. --
Cerebellum (
talk)
00:13, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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The fact that there are no independent sources certainly *IS* a valid argument. If it was not notable when it came out and is still not, does not meet our guidelines, right? That is what we are trying to determine.
W Nowicki (
talk)
17:31, 25 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep per NPOL and speedy close this Afd. This is an investment of time of volunteers that can be used in other places. The nominator needs to get their guidelines' knowledge up to speed.
Lourdes05:12, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Comment Well, I don't know. State-level recognized parties should, in my opinion, have a page, whether defunct or not - something like is done with high schools. What do you say? Thanks.
Lourdes05:31, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Yes, I can accept the argument that state-level recognized parties can have articles. But it does not meet
WP:GNG in the standard sense, i.e., have at least two reliable sources that significantly cover the topic. (There might be sources that I don't have access to.) I would request the people in the know to improve the article, providing at least the minimal information, such as the dates, office bearers, elections contested etc.. If the article is destined to be a stub for ever, there would not be much point in keeping it. That having said, I am happy to withdraw the nomination for now. --
Kautilya3 (
talk)
10:46, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Another option is to merge it into the article on its more famous namesake
Jammu Praja Parishad. It does seem that this party was an effort to revive the old one. So it is not unrelated. Can the commenters please consider this option as well? --
Kautilya3 (
talk)
11:00, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
No, I would advice against a merge. The PPJK claimed to represent the legacy of the original JPP, but such claims aren't very authoritative. --
Soman (
talk)
12:00, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. First of all, notability is not temporary. The party is defunct, but that is not reason for deletion. Unfortunately, this article was not properly referenced when created, and the sources that were used initially are nowadays no longer on-line. Coverage in media on PPJK;
[29] ,
[30] ,
[31],
[32],
[33] ,
[34] ,
[35] --
Soman (
talk)
07:27, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete as I stated at the 1st AfD, as nothing at all actually convincing apart from the simple information and the events themselves, which absolutely inherit him no automatic notability whatsoever, regardless of the news involved, as it still applies and we've never had a policy barring renominations and we never will, because that's now how articles work; any article is open to renomination especially when there was still questionability and there certainly still is in this case.
SwisterTwistertalk06:42, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete a citizen of Hawaii who stepped forward to participate in the democratic process. However, brief role as an Elector does not suffice to confer notability. Previous mentions are few and very minor, a caption in a news photo caption of him holding a protest sign at a 2015 demonstration is typical. Museum development directors are rarely notable. There really is nothing else.
E.M.Gregory (
talk)
20:31, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete The latest absurd instalment in the series of non-notable articles with a minor link to the United States presidential election of 2016. This man is not notable.
AusLondonder (
talk)
06:14, 29 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Nothing at all for actual independent notability and substance given the current information and sources are simply listing-esque and the sources are particularly only announcements, listings and mentions, none of which help for our non-negotiable policies, with searches then finding nothing else; overall, the article has only been significantly visited by such advertising campaigners, which is worse when it was in fact part of a multi-account campaign, showing signs of Orangemoody, OfficialPankaj and similar campaigners. All of this is enough for deletion since there's clear policy violations.
SwisterTwistertalk02:57, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Terrible BLP article written like an advertising skit. Fails
WP:BIO. Possible professor of advertising but with no verifiable source to confirm. Fails
WP:GNG. If keep would need drastic copyedit.
scope_creep (
talk)
02:54, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete as overly spammy: "...A pioneer in early 2000s of Mission Marketing Strategy..." -- ? The subject seems otherwise unremarkable. Wikipedia is not a platform for promotion.
K.e.coffman (
talk)
05:04, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Speedy delete G11. Purely promotional. I could not get through enough of it to gain any clue about whether the subject might have some actual notability, but I doubt it. Regardless, this is an ad, not an encyclopedia article.
Blow it up. —
David Eppstein (
talk)
05:25, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Comment. I don't follow WWE, but looking at the online reports he seems to have been appearing fairly consistently for several months now. 8 events, 5 televised, loser in all matches... but I've heard losing in pro wrestling usually requires more talent than winning! He might be around for a while if he keeps up that record. His most recent match was against
Brian Kendrick, who is kind of a big deal. WWE report says "Although Kendrick was victorious, Maluta proved he is a force to be reckoned with in the Cruiserweight division." Does that mean they are keeping Maluta in the rotation?
Jack N. Stock (
talk)
06:54, 18 January 2017 (UTC)reply
He also recently appeared in the
Cruiserweight Classic, which is a fairly notable event that occurred (in terms of professional wrestling). I'm not sure about the status of a contract or not, but he has been regularly appearing at house/live events and on television fairly regularly compared to their signed talent. I'd say that's enough. Regards, —
MoeEpsilon12:17, 22 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. He's participating in the biggest pro wrestling organization in the world. He has also held multiple titles in
WXW. Looking at other pro wrestler articles, it seems consensus that someone with his record is considered notable in that field.
Jack N. Stock (
talk)
15:50, 22 January 2017 (UTC)reply
The term "not officially signed" is unsourced and most likely misleading. I have no doubt that Maluta is under contract ("signed") to appear on WWE events.
Jack N. Stock (
talk)
19:34, 22 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Nothing at all for actual independent notability and substance in our non-negotiable policies as what's here is simply business listing sourced by their own website, with searches then finding nothing better hence unimprovable.
SwisterTwistertalk02:43, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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The result was delete. The article creator (and advancer of the sole "keep" vote) hasn't edited in over two weeks. If they return to editing and would like to continue work on this article, I'll happily restore and
WP:USERFY it. – Juliancolton |
Talk03:21, 31 January 2017 (UTC)reply
This page is not an autobio. It was created as part of the BBC 100 Women 2016 Wikipedia Editathon. I would request that the page is retained for another six months so that I (as the author and a newcomer to wikipedia) have time to create more pages and also so that further references can be added to the page which is the subject of this discussion. Keep Thanks
Spring Chicken (
talk)
16:01, 15 January 2017 (UTC)reply
I don't understand why you want the page kept 6 months so you can create other pages - you would still be free to create other pages whether or not this one is deleted. I have no objection to the page being
WP:USERFIED (read that link if you don't know what that means) to your namespace so you can try to track down and add more substantial coverage, and to remove the unsourced promotional material, although I've seen no evidence that such coverage exists.
FuriouslySerene (
talk)
17:56, 15 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete: If you're looking for an applicable guideline, Hergilei, try
WP:SPORTSEVENT. All the sources are primary, there's no evidence this event meets the GNG, and there's no Wiki policy (or guideline) that establishes presumptive notability for events on the ISU calendar, athletic events in the UAE, or ones that attracted more competitors than the year before.
Ravenswing 02:00, 7 January 2017 (UTC)reply
This is an event in the Arab world so independent sources are probably in Arabic. I can't read that language but perhaps others can. As for the guideline, it's talking about an individual game/series. It doesn't appear to address what to do with articles which summarize multiple years of results.
Hergilei (
talk)
14:26, 7 January 2017 (UTC)reply
And if you can produce multiple independent, reliable sources giving this event the "significant coverage" the GNG requires, that would save the article. However, deletion policy doesn't permit for speculation that such sources may exist; they must be demonstrated and produced, and it is the responsibility of an editor who wishes to save an article to do so.
Ravenswing 15:09, 7 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Comment: Errrm ... did you actually look at the sources? The first one cited (the National bit) isn't even an actual article; it's a picture gallery. The second cite (from Yle) is a press release (that much is mentioned in the text) that only mentions the event in passing; it's about two Finnish skaters. The third cite (Straits Times) is about a Singaporan skater, and the sum total of the subject's mention in it is "Ing obtained qualification after scoring 45.73 points at the 2017 FBMA Trophy, which is taking place in Abu Dhabi from Jan 5 to 7." The fourth cite (the second Finnish source) is an expansion of the previous Finnish cite, once again about the two Finnish skaters, and is the sort of routine sports coverage explicitly debarred by
WP:ROUTINE as contributing to the notability of a subject. The fifth cite is the exact same link as the third, bizarrely enough. The GNG requires that the subject receive "significant coverage" from multiple reliable sources, and fleeting mentions in sources that aren't about the subject at all don't qualify. I can't imagine anyone who took the time to review those sources contending that they satisfy the GNG. They don't.
Ravenswing 06:40, 18 January 2017 (UTC)reply
And it's just another namedrop where the (brief) article is about another subject entirely, and this event is mentioned in passing. There's no question that this event exists, Hergilei, but to establish notability, sources must provide "significant coverage" of the subject. Please review
WP:GNG.
Ravenswing 01:40, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete for want of reliable sourcing. Excessive fancruft, and none of this stuff is worth merging anywhere. It is
no use to assert others will eventually provide reliable sources.
ReykYO!12:14, 17 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Redirect to the aforementioned list. I think there's enough material out there to source a decent article on Devastator, but the current article is awful and it will be easier to start from scratch.
Argento Surfer (
talk)
13:44, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete Not notable - none of the reliable sources in the article even mention the subject of the article, not even a passing mention - there's just nothing.
Exemplo347 (
talk)
07:36, 15 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Delete Per nom. Nothing independent found to support notability in my searches. Happy to reconsider if better sources are found.
Gab4gab (
talk)
20:45, 9 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Non-notable sports broadcaster. An IP is trying to delete this, but it's not eligible for speedy or blpprod. Taking to AFD instead.
Bradv01:13, 8 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete It would be preferable if this could go to
San Antonio Spurs#Broadcasters to retain some content, but the NBA team articles are checkered about listing team broadcasters and they don't have a section on that. I'd encourage someone to take care of that in seven days and redirect Bill Land there, but I don't think that will happen. Outside of his Spurs broadcasting nothing else really hits
WP:N. Nate•(
chatter)01:19, 8 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Speedy delete per A7 of criteria no indication of importance at the time it nominated this article for deletion but we previously redirect to
Fox Sports Southwest but attempting to disrupt this but A7 speedy deletion will might cause it but an admins to delete it
209.242.141.27 (
talk)
21:05, 26 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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@
KGirlTrucker81: you're aware this is a building and not a person, right? Am I missing something as to why POLITICIAN would apply? I'm leaning weak keep right now as the official residence of a notable office, but haven't quite made up my mind.
TonyBallioni (
talk)
22:58, 21 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep as the official residence of a governor of an Indian state. Does it suck now? Sure, but I believe that official residences of the governors of states are notable. This
[38] also highly suggests that if enough digging is done it could meet GNG both with physical, online, and non-English sources. GNG does not require that the sources be present in the article, simply that they exist, and as an official residence its likely that there are more sources in libraries, etc. discussing its cultural significance.
TonyBallioni (
talk)
23:13, 21 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep Yes I think it's a reasonable assumption that all such official residences of gov't leaders/heads of state have some kind of protected or cultural status that would meet criterion 1 in
WP:GEOFEAT.
Shawn in Montreal (
talk)
21:11, 28 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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This article is sourced only to the websites of the software's author. I'm searched, and I am not able to find any independent sources, so I believe the topic does not meet the
general notability guideline, and this article should be deleted. The article author removed a PROD tag without adding sources, so here we are at AFD.
MrOllie (
talk)
23:36, 15 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Can I just write my response here? Sorry, first time poster long time visitor :)
What would you say would be a good source then? Third party blogs? I'm curious as this is a serious project offering a new ORM to a language that doesn't have one on wikipedia yet. It's not a commercial product either. Sorry if I'm going about this all wrong. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
RWOverdijk (
talk •
contribs)
10:44, 16 January 2017 (UTC)reply
It can be hard to navigate all of the policy at first. In short, you need significant coverage in independent, reliable sources, with each of these terms having a fairly specific meaning on wikipedia. See
WP:GNG linked above and
WP:RS. Unfortunately, such coverage may not exist for many smaller software projects.
WP:BLOGS are typically not used to establish notability, but there are occasional exceptions for recognized experts in a given field.
Dialectric (
talk)
16:47, 16 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Delete This may be a subject that will generate independent coverage in the future. For now it doesn't satisfy notability guidelines. Like the nom my searches found nothing helpful. Happy to reconsider if better sources are found.
Gab4gab (
talk)
06:37, 23 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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Keep A look at the previous AfD shows a suggestion to look at Google books. Arguments for NOT are proofs by assertion, for the obvious reason that identifying problems could lead to the fixing of problems.
Unscintillating (
talk)
01:05, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep. DW are one of the big names of drum hardware. Agree that the current article needs some serious work, but deletion is not the correct solution. The article contains more than enough material to verify notability, just check a few of the big-name endorsements for example.
Andrewa (
talk)
05:53, 24 January 2017 (UTC)reply
Keep The article needs a lot of copyediting to remove the promotion of products but there are sufficient independent third party reliable sources to confirm the notability of DW Drums. For example,
this Huff Post article mentions DW Drums being stolen,
here's one mentioning their use in an Alice Cooper setup and
here's another from Rolling Stone magazine mentioning their use and
this book on the history of drums.
-- HighKing++ 16:46, 27 January 2017 (UTC)reply
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