The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
Comment - This may be an autobiography or a COI creation by a promo-only editor, as the article creator, Beeb28, seems to only work on articles/drafts promoting her, her songs or her record company Beeb Music.
Netherzone (
talk)
14:46, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Delete - I really wonder how articles like this get through the
AfC process. There is a committed team of volunteers there, helping new Wikipedia editors write articles with proper formatting and grammar and presentation. And yet somehow nobody on that team does a basic notability check? Or as I have seen argued a few times, an author sends their AfC article to mainspace prematurely, in which case the AfC team needs tougher oversight processes. As for Ms. Reine, I wish her luck as she launches her music career, and she is surely pounding away at the
usual self-created streaming and social media services to spread the word. But she has no
significant and reliable media coverage to come anywhere close to the requirements for
musical notability. Charitably it is
too soon for an article; less charitably this is another attempted
promotion. ---DOOMSDAYER520 (
TALK|
CONTRIBS) 14:50, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment -
User:Doomsdayer520 - This article was not approved by AFC. This article was in AFC, and was then moved into article space twice by the author, not by AFC reviewers, and was moved back into draft space once by a New Page Reviewer. There is an incorrect tag on such articles, which states that they were approved in AFC, which actually means that they were in AFC and were moved into article space. The tag may also correctly be on articles that were accepted, but where the script did not finish cleanup. In this case the tag is incorrect.
Robert McClenon (
talk)
15:44, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Doomsdayer520, that is part of the reason that articles approved at AfC still have to go through an NPP review (in many cases). Some advanced editors automatically get their moves marked as autopatrolled (this seems to be pretty consistent among Sysops who work at AfC).
Onel5969TT me19:06, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Note to others - I have been convinced elsewhere that this glitch in the AfC process is not particularly common and it was unfair of me to imply that it happens a lot. Some of us are discussing possible procedural ideas elsewhere. Now back to the discussion at hand... ---DOOMSDAYER520 (
TALK|
CONTRIBS) 23:14, 13 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment - I disagree with the notion that the sources are not sourced well enough. everything is located there. I see countless articles with little or zero sources at all and they are there forever. I also disagree with the implication that I wrote this article with the intent to self promote. I am a fan of the artist and I was doing it to help out the artist and fans I have no direct connection with the artist. so i don't appreciate that accusation.
Beeb2814:56, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment - Netherzone, "seems to only work on articles/drafts promoting her, her songs or her record company Beeb Music" is not true, firstly I again want to make clear I am a fan with no direct connection and that I wrote things based on the internet. my username was in reference to the artist because I like the music. I have worked on quite a few other musical wikis like Keith Tippet and Gordian Knot. The reason why it seems like I have only worked on one topic is I was working on connecting everything together for a seamless experience if anyone came onto the page
Beeb28 15:13, 11 December 2020 (UTC) — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Beeb28 (
talk •
contribs)
I did not make the direct accusation against Beeb28 (though I do think the article's writing style is too promotional), but I think we can accept Beeb28's claims of good faith. However, that still accomplishes nothing for the musician's notability, which is what needs to be discussed here. ---DOOMSDAYER520 (
TALK|
CONTRIBS) 15:35, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Beeb28: thank you for your comments, and for your interest in Wikipedia and your efforts here. WP is an encyclopedia, it's not a venue for promoting non-notable content just because one is a fan. That is what websites, social media or sites like LinkedIn, etc. are for. In my comment below, I've linked some things (as have the editors above) - these may be helpful in familiarizing you with some of WP's policies and guidelines. Regarding my comment about a possible autobio or COI, it struck me as quite odd that your username pretty much matches the name of her music company, however, I'll take your word for it that you are not a directly connected editor.Netherzone (
talk)
15:48, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Delete After a BEFORE search, I could find nothing in the way of significant coverage
WP:SIGCOV in reliable sources
WP:RS independent of the subject
WP:IS, therefore does not meet the notability criteria for
WP:GNG. Also does not pass
WP:MUSICBIO nor
WP:CREATIVE, as all I could find was user-submitted content such as social media, music streaming/downloading/purchasing sites, and zero reviews, or articles about her, no notable awards nor chart placements.
Netherzone (
talk)
15:29, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
deletewith fire yikes. There is 0 credibility to the sources and there's barely even a claim of notability, much less a substantiated one.
Praxidicae (
talk)
15:33, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
I'd also like to note my delete vote includes all the other crap related to this in mainspace, which has since been moved to draft by the creator, to avoid continued tendetious editing.
Praxidicae (
talk)
13:51, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Praxidicae, "delete with fire yikes" this is a very inflammatory remark. I appreciate everyone else being civil with the process but you are not. I'm not a veteran wikipedia user so I make mistakes
Beeb2816:07, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Delete - per nom and comments above; if this article cannot be sourced to anything other than Tidal, Spotify and social media sites then it should not be retained
Spiderone15:58, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment - Thank you all for the feedback. I will use that to make sure I do a better job at finding sources. I just ask that the whole thing not be deleted, but instead drafted so I can work on improving the article in the future
Beeb2816:12, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Beeb28: Could you please explain why all of the files you uploaded to Commons in relation to this artist, her music and her record company are credited to you as "own work" and with either Isabelle Reine or Beeb Music credited as the "Author"? Thank you.
Netherzone (
talk)
16:49, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Hi yes I put the artist's name and/or label in the copyright section. and I had emailed the label for permission to use the images. I'm not used to Wikipedia so i don't exactly know how to use commons. I have since changed it to fix the error. Thanks
Beeb2817:05, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Beeb28: If I'm not mistaken, you need to send that email regarding licencing permissions to OTRS at Commons, if you have not already done so. Editors, please correct me if I'm wrong about that.
Netherzone (
talk)
20:10, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Netherzone: You are right. The permissions granted by the owner should be sent for review which takes up to 2 weeks. Also the guys at the OTRS do not accept permission sent from generic email accounts, they require an official verifiable email account.
Less Unless (
talk)
22:35, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Delete - Not notable per nom (and others). The sourcing is not of a standard to be considered acceptable and quick search reveals virtually no useful results.
Eagleash (
talk)
18:16, 11 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Draftify per author's request or delete but in either case, SALT so she can't return to mainspace out of process a third time.
StarM01:12, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Comment to
User:Cabayi - The last six pages in your list are drafts. Deletion of drafts is considered at
MFD, and my guess is that the drafts would not be deleted if a request were made to delete them. Notability is not considered at
MFD, because one of the uses of draft space is for a subject that does not currently meet notability, and are normally not deleted simply for
COI. Drafts are typically deleted for
disruptive editing, and we haven't seen disruptive editing here. If you want to comment on the drafts to recommend that they be rejected, that is all right.
Robert McClenon (
talk)
18:39, 12 December 2020 (UTC)reply
Delete per nom and per everyone else above. No evidence of notability. The sourcing is trash. Spotify and the like does not establish notability. They never did and they never will.
GhostDestroyer100 (
talk)
16:30, 14 December 2020 (UTC)reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
talk page or in a
deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.