- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. Consensus is for the article to be retained. North America 1000 19:56, 6 February 2018 (UTC)
Fallon Fox
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The article primary written around Fox's gender issues of being a transgender MMA fighter in female division. No top tier promotion fights - fails WP:NMMA and Fox's last fight 3.5 years ago, meeting nobility criteria seems distance. The page might be written by a paid editor. CASSIOPEIA( talk) 17:40, 30 January 2018 (UTC) CASSIOPEIA( talk) 17:40, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
- Question - @ CASSIOPEIA: Can you please explain how this BLP fails WP:GNG? NMMA is about presumed notability, not a threshold for all articles about MMA fighters. From what I can see, she passes GNG as there's significant coverage of her in reliable and mainstream sources. EvergreenFir (talk) 20:25, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
- *Comment. it is not fails of GNG that I refered to but
WP:MMA.
CASSIOPEIA(
talk) 23:21, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
- @
CASSIOPEIA: i understand you mentioned
WP:NMMA, but that is not a requirement for all articles about MMA fighters. Rather, MMA fighters who meet those thresholds are presumed to be notable. However, some may be notable for other reasons. I think that's the case here. Fallon Fox notable in part because she is a trans woman MMA fighter. She appears to meet
WP:GNG to me. Unless you can convince me her article doesn't meet GNG, I see no reason to delete it. Not meeting NMMA alone isn't sufficient reason.
EvergreenFir
(talk) 05:00, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
- @ EvergreenFir:, Fox has not fought not only on top tier promotion she has not fought in second tier as well. She got coverage on news was comment from UFC personals/commentators/press on how would she match up with former champion Ronda Rousey. However, in reality, in term of Fox's fights record or achievement, she was far from meeting the criteria to be make the match up. The coverage she received was not about her fights as a MMA fighter but as a transgender for her fights were mainly routine same as thousands of MMA fighters. It has been always a debate between GNG and SNG in Wikipedia - same as many business men, singers, artists and musicians, they do have coverage on media but most do not pass WP:DIRECTOR, WP:CREATIVE, WP:NACTOR or WP:ENTERTAINER for the criteria to meet nobility based on their achievement of their work, significant of their roles on their field, significant "cult" following. This is same as in sportperson on sport specific nobility criteria to meet on participating on top level competitions, award winning record. GNG covers less form of nobility criteria as long as subject passes significant coverage with reliable source but not subject's achievements. Nobility should be permanent but not passing in my opinion, Fox might meet the criteria 3.5 years ago when she was an active fighter but does she has not been active since and no major achievements received, just as an singer received coverage entering a singing competition but not album was produced years after that. This is mainly my thought. CASSIOPEIA( talk) 09:27, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
- @
CASSIOPEIA: i understand you mentioned
WP:NMMA, but that is not a requirement for all articles about MMA fighters. Rather, MMA fighters who meet those thresholds are presumed to be notable. However, some may be notable for other reasons. I think that's the case here. Fallon Fox notable in part because she is a trans woman MMA fighter. She appears to meet
WP:GNG to me. Unless you can convince me her article doesn't meet GNG, I see no reason to delete it. Not meeting NMMA alone isn't sufficient reason.
EvergreenFir
(talk) 05:00, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Martial arts-related deletion discussions. PRehse ( talk) 10:34, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
- Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sexuality and gender-related deletion discussions. EvergreenFir (talk) 19:39, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
- Keep - While I appreciate the time and thought they put into their reply, I am not convinced by CASSIOPEIA's rationale here. This article meets WP:GNG. Though Fallon Fox might not be in the spotlight anymore, this is akin to a "one hit wonder"; her MMA career was notable, even if short. EvergreenFir (talk) 19:35, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
- *Comment. Wikipedia MMA project WP:MMA defined MMA record notability that a fighter had 3 top tier fights or more - see here WP:NMMA and the top tier promoters are UFC and Invicta FC - see here WP:MMATIER. I have nothing against LGBT community - There are plenty of them in top tier MMA today, notably Amanda Nunes, Jéssica Andrade, Tonya Evinger, Nina Ansaroff, Tecia Torres, Raquel Pennington and Sijara Eubanks to name some. CASSIOPEIA( talk) 20:58, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
- Keep - per above. Rab V ( talk) 20:52, 31 January 2018 (UTC)
- Keep clearly passes WP:GNG.-- TonyTheTiger ( T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:41, 1 February 2018 (UTC)
- Keep - easily passes WP:SUSTAINED. L293D ( ✉ ) 02:40, 4 February 2018 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.