Wikipedia:articles For Deletion Dead Air (2007 Film)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep‎. Vanamonde ( Talk) 15:10, 29 July 2023 (UTC) reply

Dead Air (2007 film)

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I am not able to find any reliable sources or reviews for this film, other than profiles. Upper Deck Guy ( talk) 02:03, 1 July 2023 (UTC) reply

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Film-related deletion discussions. Upper Deck Guy ( talk) 02:03, 1 July 2023 (UTC) reply
Keep. There is the review currently on the page and there is this one. At least. MY, OH MY! (mushy yank) 06:39, 1 July 2023 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Hong Kong-related deletion discussions. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 08:36, 1 July 2023 (UTC) reply

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗ plicit 02:32, 8 July 2023 (UTC) reply

I think ~~weak~~ keep given the language divide here. It looks like this film did not get much exposure in English-speaking markets, but has just enough coverage in English to soothe my doubts, plus a very reasonable cast list. — siro χ o 04:26, 8 July 2023 (UTC) reply
Comment I am unconvinced that Asian Movie Web is a clear-cut reliable source. The about us page neither lists the staff or editorial policies, which is not promising. The only potential claim is some WP:USEBYOTHERS in Google Books, i.e., 1, 2, 3 from obviously RS books, and a few others, but I'm unsure whether it is widespread and consistent per the guideline. Likewise, movieXclusive has no clear staff page or detailed editorial policies, and USEBYOTHERS is even weaker (based on Google/Google Books at least). Otherwise I'm unable to find sufficient sources and will probably vote weak delete later, but I'm aware of the language barrier here and might take another look again at TWL and Baidu to find sources if I have energy for that.I had another look and was unable to find sufficient sources, and remain unconvinced on the reliability of existing reviews. However, I am not proficient at Chinese or Cantonese and had to rely heavily on the unreliable Google Translate, so on the balance this is a Weak Delete . Siroxo and Mushy Yank, if you find more sources please ping me. Thanks. VickKiang (talk) 10:45, 13 July 2023 (UTC) Updated on 22:33, 21 July 2023 (UTC) reply

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read!
Talk!} 02:15, 15 July 2023 (UTC) reply

Delete. The film already has an article in the Chinese wiki. The film released during the age when film reviews were online yet no reliable reviews found. DareshMohan ( talk) 18:06, 21 July 2023 (UTC) reply

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read!
Talk!} 01:27, 22 July 2023 (UTC) reply

Weak keep per Siroxo. Regarding the arguments above: (1) I don't think there is a policy basis for AFD to require clear-cut reliable sources, in the sense of addressing every possible concern. Adjudicating the fine points of reliability is not something the AFD process is really suited for; we have a whole separate board for that. As we are assembled here to decide whether an article should be deleted, as a rule, any genuine doubts about the appropriateness of deletion should be resolved against deletion. (2) To the extent the existence of an article on the Cantonese Wikipedia weighs at all, it should be in favor of retention, since it shows that an independent community of editors who share our encyclopedic purpose decided that this was worthy of an article. I would consider that one of various secondary indicia of notability here, along with the existence of a Baidu article. (3) An awful lot of content from 2007 is nowhere to be found today (or is buried UnGoogleably behind paywalls) (or was never online to begin with), so I don't think our difficult in locating clear-cut RS reviews is likely to indicate their actual absence. In sum, as there doesn't seem to be any real problem with verifiability or encyclopedicity, and especially as there is at least a prima facie case that the GNG is met, I think the balance of considerations weighs in favor of retention here. -- Visviva ( talk) 02:44, 24 July 2023 (UTC) reply
- Well said in (3), Visviva ( talk · contribs), as a lot of sources from 2007 are buried behind paywalls or were never online. Cunard ( talk) 10:47, 29 July 2023 (UTC) reply
Delete. The default here is that we keep things if they meet WP:GNG and we delete them if they don't, or if someone makes a compelling argument that we ought to keep it. AsianMovieWeb is not a reliable source, as far as I can tell, it is a website published by a one "movie fan" who doesn't want any other authors to contribute (source: https://www.asianmovieweb.com/en/about.htm). It is normal to discuss if a source is reliable at WP:AFD. CT55555( talk) 02:09, 26 July 2023 (UTC) reply

Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources.
1. Lin, Xinruo 林欣若 (2006-09-26). "曾志偉兒子「鬼計」嚇人" [Eric Tsang's son's "Dead Air" is scary]. United Daily News (in Chinese). p. D5.
  The article notes: "由陳德森監製、李伯達執導的新片「鬼計」昨天在香港開鏡，參與演出的演員包括曾志偉的兒子曾國祥、尹子維、谷祖琳也參加開鏡儀式，陳德森解釋，雖然片名是「鬼計」，但其實是一部驚悚懸疑片。... 「鬼計」雖然昨天開鏡，其實早已拍攝四天 ... 在「鬼計」裡，曾國祥飾演靈異節目的導演，因為收視跌到谷底，被尹子維飾演的監製譏笑，為了突破收視率，曾國祥找來自殺未遂人士上節目表演各種自殺方法，雖然收視告捷，卻引來更多危機。「鬼計」的劇本很有創意，光是構思自殺方式，就讓編劇想破頭，還得忙著四處蒐集資料。"
  From Google Translate: "Produced by Teddy Chan and directed by Xavier Lee, the new film Dead Air opened shooting in Hong Kong yesterday. The actors involved in the performance include Eric Tsang's son Derek Tsang, Terence Yin, and Jo Kuk who also participated in the opening ceremony. Teddy Chan explained that although the title of the film is "Dead Air", it is actually a thriller and suspense film. ... Although Dead Air started filming yesterday, it has already been filmed for four days... In Dead Air, Derek Tsang plays the director of a supernatural show. Because the ratings fell to the bottom, he was ridiculed by the producer played by Terence Yin. In order to break through the ratings, Derek Tsang recruited suicide attempters to perform various suicide methods on the show. Although the ratings were successful, it caused more crises. The script of "Dead Air" is very creative. Just thinking about the method of suicide made the screenwriter want to break his head, and he was busy collecting information everywhere."
2. "曾國祥首次擔正感壓力" [Derek Tsang feels the pressure for the first time]. Macao Daily News (in Chinese). 2006-09-27. p. D3.
  The article notes: "由陳德森導演的電影《鬼計》昨舉行開鏡拜神儀式,出席演員包括曾國祥、黎耀祥、谷祖琳、黃浩然、謝雪心及尹子維等,影片將在衛視電影台獨家首播。曾國祥在片中飾演一名電視台導演,由於這是他首次擔正演出,加上稍後還要拍劉國昌執導的 ..."
  From Google Translate: "The film Dead Air directed by Xavier Lee held a shooting worship ceremony yesterday, attended by actors including Zeng Guoxiang, Li Yaoxiang, Gu Zulin, Huang Hao Ran, Xie Xuexin and Yin Ziwei, etc., the film will exclusively premiere on Satellite TV Movie Channel. Zeng Guoxiang played the role of a TV director in the film, because this is his first performance, and he will be filming the film directed by Liu Guochang later."
3. "曾國祥幫女鬼接生嚇破膽" [Derek Tsang was scared out of his wits when he helped a female ghost deliver her baby]. Ta Kung Pao (in Chinese). 2006-09-26. p. C1.
  The article notes: "另外,唐寧在片中首次扮演大肚女鬼,更要駁長發演出。甚少拍鬼片的她,雖然相信世界上有鬼但卻不會太驚,相信不刻意去想及拜過神便沒問題,而且媽咪也會為她祈禱。幸而故事環繞在電視台發生,不用去偏僻恐怖地方拍攝。而她雖聽過電視台不少怪異事,卻從未遇過怪事。至於拍鬼片經驗較多的谷祖琳,今次乃飾演電視台監製,是女版俞琤,故沒有感情線。"
  From Google Translate: "In addition, Tang Ning played the female ghost with a belly for the first time in the film, and she even had to cut her long hair. She seldom makes ghost films, although she believes that there are ghosts in the world, she will not be too shocked. She believes that it will be fine if she does not deliberately think about it and worship God, and her mother will pray for her. Fortunately, the story revolves around the TV station, and there is no need to go to remote and scary places to shoot. And although she has heard many weird things on TV, she has never encountered any strange things. As for Gu Zulin, who has more experience in making ghost films, this time she plays the role of a TV station producer. She is the female version of Yu Teng, so there is no emotional line."
4. Cheung, Wing-zi 張穎芝 (2006-09-26). "唐寧首次演女鬼恐怖血腥" [Leila Tong's first horror and bloody female ghost role]. Sing Tao Daily (in Chinese). p. D2.
  The article notes: "唐寧在戲中飾演大肚女鬼,首次擔演女鬼的她,駁了一頭長發配合角色。 ... 唐寧日前在郊區拍攝被殺後,曾國祥為她接生的一幕戲,場面很恐怖血腥,其餘大部分場景則在電影台內拍攝 ... 首次擔正的曾國祥日前在郊外拍攝,大髀內側慘被蚊狂叮 ..."
  From Google Translate: "Tang Ning played the female ghost with a big belly in the play. It was her first time to play the role of a female ghost, and she parted her long hair to match the role. ... A few days ago, Tang Ning filmed the scene where Zeng Guoxiang delivered her baby after she was killed in the suburbs. The scene was horrific and bloody. Most of the other scenes were filmed in the movie station. ... Zeng Guoxiang, who took the lead for the first time, was filming in the suburbs a few days ago, and the inside of his big thigh was bitten by mosquitoes."
5. "唐寧生仔血淋淋" [Leila Tong gave birth to a bloody baby]. Apple Daily (in Chinese). 2006-09-26. p. C13.
  The article notes: "唐寧、谷祖琳、曾國祥及尹子維等昨日齊到清水灣,參與新片《鬼計》開鏡拜神儀式。唐寧飾演腹大便便的女鬼,日前還拍攝一場血淋淋的生仔戲份,"
  From Google Translate: "Tang Ning, Gu Zulin, Zeng Guoxiang and Yin Ziwei all came to Clear Water Bay yesterday to participate in the opening ceremony of the new film "Dead Air". Tang Ning played the female ghost with a belly poop, and she also filmed a bloody birth scene a few days ago,"
6. "唐寧拍鬼片阿媽代祈禱" [Leila Tong's acts in ghost film, her mother prays for her]. Oriental Daily News (in Chinese). 2006-09-26. p. C12.
  The article notes: "飾演女鬼的唐寧透露,該片已拍攝了多天,她謂第一場拍攝的戲份便是由曾國祥替她接生BB"
  From Google Translate: "Tang Ning, who played the female ghost for the first time, revealed that the film has been filming for several days. She said that Zeng Guoxiang delivered her baby in the first filming scene BB"
7. "唐寧媽祈禱保佑女兒拍片平安" [Leila Tong's mother prayed to bless her daughter's filming safety]. am730 (in Chinese). 2006-09-26. p. M31.
  The article notes: "戲中唐寧與曾國祥有一段感情戲,而唐寧更首次要駁長發扮演女鬼,自言甚少拍鬼片的她相信世界上是有鬼的,記者問她是否害怕拍這類型的戲時,她答道:「《鬼計》故事主要描述電視台發生的怪事,我喺電視台就冇遇過鬼怪事,不過聽聞過好多怪異事件,我相信唔刻意去諗,同埋拜過神會無問題嘅,而且媽咪都會幫我祈禱,所以都唔會太驚嘅。」"
  From Google Translate: "In the film, Tang Ning and Zeng Guoxiang had a relationship scene, and Tang Ning even refuted long-haired female ghost for the first time. She said that she seldom made ghost films and believed that there are ghosts in the world. When the reporter asked her if she was afraid of filming this type of scene , she replied: "The story of "Dead Air" mainly describes the strange things that happened on the TV station. I have never encountered ghosts and strange things on the TV station, but I have heard of many strange things. Yes, and Mommy will help me pray, so I won’t be too surprised.”"
There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Dead Air ( traditional Chinese: 鬼計; simplified Chinese: 鬼计) to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".
Cunard ( talk) 10:47, 29 July 2023 (UTC) reply

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.