- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. JohnCD ( talk) 16:49, 13 July 2016 (UTC)
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An eSports player with no real assertion to notability beyond niche interests. Fails WP:GNG. Notably, unlike some eSports subjects on Wikipedia, he hasn't even won anything - and just appears to be a typical run-of-the-mill professional player. Also a lack of reliable sources, as much of it is eSports specific sites and The Daily Dot, which is disputed as an appropriate source for asserting notability. KaisaL ( talk) 14:15, 4 July 2016 (UTC)
- Comment. He certainly does not fail WP:GNG as he was on the cover of Urheilulehti a few months ago, and there are plenty of articles about him in Finland's largest circulation newspapers. [1] [2] [3] Prolog ( talk) 08:11, 5 July 2016 (UTC)
- @
Prolog: Is there evidence of him being on the cover? If there is then
I would be happy to agree with youchanged to weak delete instead, this is exactly the sort of coverage we need. KaisaL ( talk) 11:59, 5 July 2016 (UTC)- The issue is
available online.
Prolog (
talk)
13:09, 5 July 2016 (UTC)
- I think I am going to change to weak delete - but still a delete - if that's ok. I'm not convinced there's enough beyond that, and while being on the cover of that magazine is certainly an achievement, it's a single example from an albeit long-established magazine with a circulation of
31,000 as of 2014 and only about
6,000 followers on Twitter. (I appreciate the latter of this is not a reliable metric in itself, but it says to me that this isn't the major magazine it may have initially seemed to be.) But at the same time it's a better source than most eSports content is throwing up. Yet as
Ravenswing says below, we're dealing in casual mentions the rest of the time. So lots of flip sides but overall I'd say not quite enough.
KaisaL (
talk)
01:02, 6 July 2016 (UTC)
- Urheilulehti was the most read sports magazine in Finland in 2014. [4] I don't know how many subscribers you expect for a non-general magazine written in a language spoken by about five million people, and published in the country with the heaviest library use per capita. I also don't understand how anyone can call this 1000-word article on the subject published by Helsingin Sanomat a "casual mention". Prolog ( talk) 07:09, 6 July 2016 (UTC)
- I think I am going to change to weak delete - but still a delete - if that's ok. I'm not convinced there's enough beyond that, and while being on the cover of that magazine is certainly an achievement, it's a single example from an albeit long-established magazine with a circulation of
31,000 as of 2014 and only about
6,000 followers on Twitter. (I appreciate the latter of this is not a reliable metric in itself, but it says to me that this isn't the major magazine it may have initially seemed to be.) But at the same time it's a better source than most eSports content is throwing up. Yet as
Ravenswing says below, we're dealing in casual mentions the rest of the time. So lots of flip sides but overall I'd say not quite enough.
KaisaL (
talk)
01:02, 6 July 2016 (UTC)
- The issue is
available online.
Prolog (
talk)
13:09, 5 July 2016 (UTC)
- @
Prolog: Is there evidence of him being on the cover? If there is then
- Delete: Sorry, but I've just gone over those sources, and I'm not seeing anything that clears WP:ROUTINE, never mind that two of them involve casual mentions. Ravenswing 13:39, 5 July 2016 (UTC)
- Why are you applying Wikipedia:Notability (events) to a person? Prolog ( talk) 13:56, 5 July 2016 (UTC)
- You'll find, as you become more familiar with AfD, that WP:ROUTINE is, well, routinely applied to issues of press coverage for biographical articles. Ravenswing 17:09, 5 July 2016 (UTC)
- I can indeed confirm users have applied their favourite guidelines, whether relevant or not, in AFDs for at least a decade. That doesn't mean such application needs to carry much weight, particularly if more established concerns are satisfied. Regardless, you should explain what is "routine" about an esports player being the cover story in a 118-year-old sports magazine. Prolog ( talk) 21:42, 5 July 2016 (UTC)
- Keep, even I wasn't aware of the extent of coverage for this person in Finnish newspapers and magazines-- Prisencolin ( talk) 00:56, 6 July 2016 (UTC)
- Keep per Prolog's sources. Obviously passes GNG given the Finnish coverage, arguably would have passed WP:BASIC without them. ---- Patar knight - chat/ contributions 17:02, 6 July 2016 (UTC)
- Keep per basic. -- Usp ( talk) 10:12, 9 July 2016 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MBisanz talk 01:26, 12 July 2016 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MBisanz talk 01:26, 12 July 2016 (UTC)
- Keep. Passes WP:GNG and WP:BASIC. There are no problems with notability here. Anarchyte ( work | talk) 10:15, 12 July 2016 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.