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1. U.S. News & World Report is a somewhat limited news publication. Its views on and rankings of business schools are just plain irrelevant.
2. Crain's New York Business is hardly a top business journal. Crain's does a great job following the advertising industry; its other papers are at best tier-two sources, and limited largely to the New York scene.
3. Baruch College / Zicklin School of Business does not appear on the lists of
In short, the business press -- the name-brand elements of it -- does not find much to say about Baruch, or CUNY in general, or the Zicklin School of Business in particular.
4. Baruch may in fact be a pretty good school for accountants. Sadly, gone are the days when accountants are at the heart of running businesses. We could explain this, but better not. It is not nice to be unkind. They can't help it. It's really not their fault....
5. Taken altogether, Baruch is actually not the best of the CUNY colleges. There is more to education -- especially undergraduate education in business -- than accounting and the odd management and marketing class. Half the degree program is arts-and-sciences; Baruch's arts and sciences programs are not stellar, and in general Hunter and Queens -- to a smaller degree, City College -- do far better. In particular, Baruch's undergraduate social sciences departments include some of the dullest people around; my kindly nature precludes me from naming names publicly. Since modern business education rests heavily on high quality research in the social sciences (economics, but also psychology, sociology and anthropology, and certainly history -- look at the best stuff coming out of HBS if you don't think this is so...), a crummy social sciences faculty is the kiss of death for the modern business education program.
Not to put too fine a point on it, this article is just plain bogus and should be flagged, or pulled.
And I think we will leave this anonymous. I teach in a CUNY college and am fond of my salary -- as is my landlord and my butcher and my grocer. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.101.131.20 ( talk • contribs)
Now that I've looked closely, the Baruch site indicates they're number 25, but the actual underlying cite indicates number 9. I suppose it's a just a choice which to refer to, but I'd think the underlying source. ButtonwoodTree ( talk) 20:26, 22 July 2015 (UTC)
This edit request by an editor with a conflict of interest has now been answered. |
I am working on behalf of Baruch College, of which Zicklin School of Business is a part, to improve the quality of the college's entries. In keeping with WP:COI, I am not making any changes to the article myself. In keeping with WP:NPOV, I am carefully providing references, avoiding marketing language, and otherwise adhering to the letter and spirit of Wikipedia guidelines.
The Zicklin entry does indeed have "multiple issues," but not the issues cited in the current templates at the top of the entry. The edits by the conflicted "major contributor" (who was not me) have been reverted, and the puffery/advertising issues have largely been resolved -- and I believe they will be entirely eliminated by the edits suggested below. So I suggest the templates should be removed as the edits below are made.
The currently existing "issues" include insufficient sourcing, outdated or undated rankings information, haphazard organization, repetitive statements, and typos.
Because the edits I propose are so extensive, I am providing complete formatted text for each section of the article. At the end of each section, I explain why I think the edits are appropriate.
The Zicklin School of Business (commonly known as Zicklin) is Baruch College's business school. It was established in 1919 and is named after financier and alumnus Lawrence Zicklin. Zicklin offers the following degree programs:
Since 2014 the dean of the school has been H. Fenwick Huss, [1] the former dean of the J. Mack Robinson College of Business at Georgia State University. Zicklin is the only unit of the City University of New York that is accredited by the Association to Advance College Schools of Business ( AACSB).
In 1919, the City College of New York established a School of Business and Civic Administration, offering its first MBA program one year later. The school was renamed in 1953 in honor of Bernard M. Baruch, noted statesman and financier, who was instrumental in the school's formation. In 1968, after the addition of arts and sciences departments and degree programs, Baruch became a senior college within the CUNY system.
In 1998, Baruch's business school was renamed the Zicklin School of Business, in recognition of an $18 million donation by Lawrence and Carol Zicklin. Zicklin ('57) was formerly the managing partner of investment management firm Neuberger Berman.
See also: Baruch College Rankings
Lex 1503 ( talk) 17:14, 11 November 2015 (UTC)
If you are looking for a way to experiment with Wikipedia there is the Wikipedia:Sandbox link up at the top where your User page, messages and Talk Page, etc are. There is also the option of userfying something you could look into. But the Talk Page should not be edited in the manner it just was, namely to mirror changes in the Article space. I understand why the user did this, but after discussion in the relevant subsections above the takeaway should have been to be bold (see: Wikipedia:BRD) and actually make any remaining edits needed on the actual page. No reason to parrot them here. Talk page comments are a testament to the history of the conversation about the page and should not be bowdlerized to make them appear more in line with the current look of the main page. JesseRafe ( talk) 19:59, 17 November 2015 (UTC)
Starting a discussion on the city versus state issue. While I've equivocated myself, based upon a review of the facts, in my opinion, it should be characterized as a city institution, not a state institution. Although CUNY was established by an act of the state legislature, all entities commercial, charitable, educational, philanthropic, are creations of the state, cites can't create their own legal entities. As a consequence, we wouldn't say that all state chartered entities are "state" institutions. Although there is no doubt CUNY receives both state and city funding, to me, the compelling fact is that it seems CUNY tuition is HIGHER for non-city residents and the only way to obtain the city rate is the live in New York City. To call something a state entity, I believe all residents of the state need to be treated equally. For example, entry fees to a state park are the same for everyone regardless of where you live. This contrasts with county and local parks which may charge higher rates for non-residents or may not permit entry at all. As a result of CUNY's differential tuition structure, I believe this renders it a "city" entity versus a "state" entity: CUNY Admissions-Tuition Just my opinion, of course and based upon my understanding its tuition structure. ButtonwoodTree ( talk)