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The contents of the Hachimata page were
merged into
Yamata no Orochi. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected page, please see its history; for the discussion at that location, see
its talk page. (November 2006)
Name
I've seen the creature's name billed as both "Yamato no Orochi" and "Yamata no Orochi", both in believable media. Are both correct?
The S04:10, 20 February 2006 (UTC)reply
This article has been unprofessionally written since day one - it was created as fancruft and has remained almost entirely so since then. Usually "...in popular culture" sections are brief and to-the-point, but here it is the highlight of the article.
elvenscout74211:34, 6 March 2006 (UTC)reply
They're all named 'Orochi' from the original mythology. This page is akin to a "disambiguation" in that it explains all the creatures named 'Orochi' because they share a common name, therefore it collectively lists them here. I constructed the 'Orochi', (King of Fighters,) because I was making multiple articles about 'King of Fighters' and because the character was becoming to complex to remain limited by the description in this article. Describing a fictional character is no less meaningful for a specific Wiki, and the individual sections are too small to require separate, distinct articles.-ZeroTalk17:47, 7 March 2006 (UTC)reply
I did some editing to get rid of extraneous fancruft and completely delete entries when the link was too tenuous. Anyone else watching this page, keep an eye on it so that the fancruft can't return. --speak togadren01:52, 20 May 2006 (UTC)reply
The fancruft section grew to about half of the entire article. This is not acceptable in my opinion, and
I'm clearly not alone; none of the items listed were at all enlightening about the subject, so I removed all of them.
To editors: Please only list items that are relevant to the subject. "X appeared in Y anime" is not relevant or enlightening. -
Amake10:34, 3 September 2007 (UTC)reply
Exactly what is this referring to?
The Orochi is portrayed as an invincible chinese dragon that has to be weakened by light orbs before it can be killed. The storyline is nearly identical to that of the myth except that Kushinada is not turned into a comb and the dragon was killed by the heros, not Susano. The sword "Cloud brand" is also a reference to the Kusanagi no Tsurugi.
This is in the "popular culture" section. However, it never gives the name of a game or movie or anything. Is this supposed to be with
Okami? If so, then this additional information isn't much more than fancruft. When talking about a popular reference to a mythological character, it's enough to mention that it's, say, a boss in a videogame, without mentioning each small departure from the original myth or the method to defeating it. --hello,gadren04:42, 27 May 2006 (UTC)reply
Hello, I was fixing links that linked to disambiguation pages. I found this article's link to
Yamato, and I was wondering what topic would be appropriate to link to. If you have a topic in mind, feel free to make the changes. Once this has been completed, can you please contact me at my talk page so that I know that this has been done. Thanks. If you have any questions, please see my talk page.
Ian MankaTalk to me!18:48, 7 June 2006 (UTC)reply
I think it is same as
Orochi (Yamata-no-orochi). According to the description of
Kojiki, Yamata-no-orochi has not only eight heads but also eight tails.
nnh02:16, 3 March 2006 (UTC)reply
Absolutely not. From the Japanese culture I've absorbed over the years, These two are not the same entity and cannot be utilized interchangably. -
ZeroTalk18:01, 4 March 2006 (UTC)reply
I disagree as well. Hachimata is supposedly a Dragon with eight tails, while Orochi is an eight headed snake. To merge the two profiles, you would have to come to a compromise, which could jepordize the information compiled for the two. -
User:Omega4590
Don't you mean that Hachimata is an 8-tailed SNAKE and Orochi is the 8-headed DRAGON? Anyways... they're no more similar than the Basilisk and Dragon myths of Medieval Europe.--
Marhawkman00:02, 10 October 2006 (UTC)reply
The Orochi is described as having both eight heads AND eight tails. Also, the description given in this article is precisely the same as that given to the Orochi. See the Talk section below this one for more on why they seem to be the same creature.
Kotengu21:43, 9 November 2006 (UTC)reply
Hoax?
A Google search for this word will yield a little over a thousand results, mostly (if not all) just anime fan sites or this very web page. I usually just blame it on Encyclopedia Mythica, but the blame for this doesn't seem to be placeable on them. Anyone got a verifiable source for this? This article doesn't give any Japanese form of the name (more evidence), and Jim Breen's, while suporting the idea that "mata" can mean "thigh" or "crotch", gives that only as a kun'yomi, and so it would not fit in a compound with "hachi" (as opposed to "ya"), and there are no external links. It was contributed, rather messilly but still largely with the same info it contains now, as
Isogane's only edit, and has only been contributed to in any significant (non-categorizing, non-stub-sorting) manner by Anons.
elvenscout74223:45, 4 March 2006 (UTC)reply
It would seem to me that there is no thing as a hachimata "eight-tail", and that it is simply erroneously interpreted as an individual entity, especially considering that the name hachimata would be impossible if the intended meaning is indeed "eight-tail".
In all likelyhood, "yamata" as in "Yamata no Orochi" is intended, especially considering that the entry here coincides 100% with Orochi's, except the last part about them supposedly being separate.
To my knowledge, "hachimata" first surfaced in posts on anime/manga forums dealing with the backstory of
Naruto, considering the "tailed beasts", the
Bijū. It would seem that not even
Encyclopedia Mythica can be blamed for this one.
I support the above, that both pages should be merged. More specifically,
this page should be merged into
Orochi.
After poking around on the Japanese internet for a while, I agree. 八股 seems to bring up some mentions of the yamata-no-orochi, but nothing about a snake just called "hachimata" - "Hachimata" just seems to be a bad/alternate reading of the "yamata" in the
orochi's full name. Since it's been months and nobody has protested any, I'll go about merging these two.
Kotengu21:39, 9 November 2006 (UTC)reply
Coincidental Similarity
This may be just a coincidence, but the Orochi could be considered the Japanese equivalent of the Hydra.
I didn't understand that part either. I also checked the Orici article and the only thing a group of fictional extraterrestrial religious fanatics has to do with an eight-headed serpent is the similarity in names, and even that is a stretch. Thus why I added the link in "See also" to the "Serpent" character in Golden Sun: The Lost Age which does have a direct connection to the story. I normally don't add pop culture references, but when I played the game I realized how similar the plot was for the "Serpent" quest and the story of Yamata-no-Orochi. Whomever keeps putting back in the Orici link and taking out the "Serpent" and "Blue Seed" ones does not understand how the latter two links are directly related to the Orochi mythos and the Orici one is not. A personal agenda and/or vandalism, perhaps?
67.162.118.167 (
talk)
06:08, 16 May 2008 (UTC) Chris G.reply
Mythological Parallels
Perhaps Jormangandr vs. Thor could be seen as a mythological parallel? Admittedly it doesn't have many heads, but it is an apocalyptical serpentine creature intent on destruction which is defeated by a central god figure with a celestial weapon. - Pumpkin
You are correct in the sense of a storm god fighting a sea serpent is a very common mythic trope. (Thor vs Jörmungandr; Indra vs Vitra; Zeus vs Typhon; Ba'el vs Yam; Yahweh vs Leviathan; Marduk vs Tiamat; Susanoo vs Orochi). I think the most popular theory at the moment is that the story originated in the Indo-European line and was transmitted into the other cultures, although this theory has many holes in it.
72.89.142.128 (
talk)
05:11, 19 September 2011 (UTC)reply
It says that the name is translated in English as "Eight-forked serpent". Uh, no. That might be the English meaning, but I've never seen it translated as that. Usually it's brought over as Orochi, Yamata no Orochi or (for those who want a rough equivalent), hydra or Japanese hydra. And no, I'm not talking videogames. Anyone got a citation for this?--
ip.address.conflict (
talk)
01:21, 13 October 2015 (UTC)reply