This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Welsh Labour article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives:
1Auto-archiving period: 365 days
![]() |
![]() | This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.
Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. |
Reporting errors |
![]() | This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
@ Bmcln1: I looked at dictionary websites and they all had a comma after "Meanwhile", even when it said "Meanwhile, the". Noah 💬 21:56, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
Llewee, I want to discuss your revert of my edit to the headings in the History section.
My change to the the heading of the 'Pre-history' section was mainly because prehistory usually means 'history before written records', which does not apply here. However, the third definition given in the Wictionary page for ' prehistory' is "The history leading up to some event, condition, etc.", which presumably your intended meaning. My second reason for the change was that it looks wrong to have a 'Pre-history' section as a subsection of a 'History' section'.
I split the section at Kier Hardie's election in 1900, as this is a key development in the party's history, and it makes sense to group this with the period until the 1945 general election. I split this into a new section with the heading 'Rise to power'. This may not need a separate section, but I still favour a paragraph break here.
Thank you got your edit summary when reverting, which clarifies your thinking:
I was treating this section as a history of the Labour Party in Wales, whereas you treat it at as the history of Welsh Labour as a separate organisation. We should cover both of these in the article.
I am still unhappy with the 'Pre-history' heading, but 'Beginnings' is not ideal. I now propose 'Origins'.
Verbcatcher ( talk) 02:59, 29 March 2022 (UTC)
Dear Verbcatcher, Thank you for contacting me, my main objection to your edit was the use of the heading "rise to power". Like I said in my revert, this was partially because their wasn't really any power specifically associated with electoral dominance in Wales in the early 20th century and as it seemed like a strange tone to use being the kind of language which is often used elsewhere on Wikipedia to describe dictators entering government and suchlike.
In relation to splitting the section, most of the beginnings section you created consisted of a paragraph I had inserted at the start of the history to briefly explain the context of Welsh politics at the turn of the 20th century. As their is only really one or two sentences about events prior to the official founding of the Labour Party I'm not sure anything is gained by splitting them into their own section it arguably also doesn't really fit with the typical length of the other sections of the history. I'm also generally of the view that having one or two sentences split into their own paragraph looks quite scruffy on Wikipedia and should be avoided if possible.
I can understand your concern that having the word history in the name for one of the subsections for a history section, particularly the first one. I'd be happy to change the title of the first section as you suggested to solve that.
Llewee ( talk) 13:53, 31 March 2022 (UTC)
The referenced PDF document from "British unionism" under Ideology in the info box has lots of instances of the word "union" referring to trade unions, a couple of instances of "union" referring to the European Union, but none at all that I can see referring to unionism. Should a better source be used? Sbiki ( talk) 11:27, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
The article currently
I am unsure of the precise history, but as a starting point
a footnote in the French Wikipedia article gives the following names, but those differing from archives.library.wales have no cited sources:
I think there is a difference between three things:
Previous related discussions from Talk Archive 1:
A related question is whether Welsh Labour has/had more autonomy from London HQ than the party's Regional Councils in England; if so, perhaps the 1975 name change reflected this; if not, perhaps it was just window dressing? This 1972 article has interesting points: