This article was nominated for deletion on 3 August 2023. The result of the discussion was keep. |
Raziel (Legacy of Kain) was nominated as a good article, but it did not meet the good article criteria at the time (February 17, 2013). There are suggestions below for improving the article. If you can improve it, please do; it may then be renominated. |
There should be a spoiler warning over the last trivia fact.
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BetacommandBot ( talk) 21:55, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
According to this article, when referring to the Tomb of the Sarafan, where Raziel found the coffins of himself, his vampire brethren, and Malek, it is stated that Malek was slain by Vorador, but that's not true. Vorador was just beaten down by Vorador, but it was Mortanuis the Necromancer the one who "slay" him, though he was not slain, but only cursed to inhabit his enchanted armor for all of eternity. I suggest this part of the article to be removed, since the fate of Malek is not relevant to Raziel's life whatsoever. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.65.195.101 ( talk) 22:08, 24 December 2007 (UTC)
No no, its refering to Malek's death by Vorador during Kain's journey in Blood Omen 1; after he was infused to the armor. Malek was too strong for him so Kain used an enchanted ring that Vorador had previously given him, to summon him whenever he was in need; and after some angry words :-D Vorador really did kill him. 82.132.248.238 ( talk) 13:58, 12 May 2010 (UTC)
Has whoever wrote the bulk of this article ever heard of paragraphs? Christ. That huge, page-long block of dense text with no breaks of any sort anywhere in the middle of the article is extremely reader-inhospitable.
Jack Vermicelli 98.243.84.182 ( talk) 07:23, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: Retrolord ( talk · contribs) 05:01, 9 February 2013 (UTC)
Rate | Attribute | Review Comment |
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1. Well-written: | ||
1a. the prose is clear, concise, and understandable to an appropriately broad audience; spelling and grammar are correct. |
"he is variously described" Could you make clearer? Not done
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1b. it complies with the Manual of Style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation. |
"broken, ruined" can we rewrite to remove one of those words Done "unproduced, non-Legacy of Kain related" Could we just change it to "unproduced, unrelated" Done "Raziel's typical physical design" What does that mean? Does he appear differently in different games? Typical implies that he appears roughly the same in most games, but in a few he is significantly different, is that true? Done "undamaged, outstretched wings" Rewrite to remove either undamaged or outstretched Done " indirectly official media." not sure what indirectly official means Done " radiant, pupilless" remove radiant Done "cloven, tridactyl claws and feet" what does the word cloven refer to? Done " human, Sarafan incarnation" remove the word human? Done "upon devouring souls" Please remove the word devouring from the article, it isn't suitable for an encyclopedia Done "He evolves batlike wings" Please remove all 'batlike's from the article Done "his tragic nature" Make this more objective please Done In video games appearances section is a combination of the plot of several games, goes into excessive detail regarding these plots, and is confusing to someone such as myself who has not played the game. I would suggest a total rewrite of this section. Not done
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2. Verifiable with no original research: | ||
2a. it contains a list of all references (sources of information), presented in accordance with the layout style guideline. | ||
2b. reliable sources are cited inline. All content that could reasonably be challenged, except for plot summaries and that which summarizes cited content elsewhere in the article, must be cited no later than the end of the paragraph (or line if the content is not in prose). |
"story conforms to that of a tragic hero." I can find no mention of this in the sources listed near this. Could you please reference this? Not done
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2c. it contains no original research. | ||
3. Broad in its coverage: | ||
3a. it addresses the main aspects of the topic. | ||
3b. it stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style). |
"having originally been used by the necromancer Mortanius to sire Kain." I think this is excessive and confusing. Not done "His likeness appeared extensively in promotional material and televised commercials for the Legacy of Kain series" Unneccessary detail, It is not required to point out a video game character appeared in adverts for the game that character features in. Not done "Darksiders' creative director Joe Madureira, former Capcom artist and game designer Akiman, and Clash of the Titans concept artist Tsvetomir Georgiev have also created fan art interpretations of the character" I don't understand why this is in the reception part of the article. I don't think this should be in the article at all either, as it is not that important. Not done
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4. Neutral: it represents viewpoints fairly and without editorial bias, giving due weight to each. | ||
5. Stable: it does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute. | ||
6. Illustrated, if possible, by media such as images, video, or audio: | ||
6a. media are tagged with their copyright statuses, and valid non-free use rationales are provided for non-free content. | ||
6b. media are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions. | ||
7. Overall assessment. | Pending |
OK? -- Niemti ( talk) 22:44, 14 February 2013 (UTC)
I'm cool with everything about it, I didn't even really insert any content outside of Reception to begin with. -- Niemti ( talk) 00:36, 16 February 2013 (UTC)
Regarding point 2b, this is actually sourced in both of the references given (explicitly, look at page 4 of the director's interview, but the first one calls him a "tragic figure" too).
I'm not the nominator, but was the article failed because the review lapsed seven days? I don't wish to quibble as I realise there are still problems, and I am always grateful and pleased to help rework an LoK article based on any and all feedback until the reviewer deems it has reached a good standard, but, with the greatest of respect, this borders on impossibility when a series of new changes is requested less than ten minutes before the final verdict. -- LoK Wiki ( talk) 13:10, 17 February 2013 (UTC)
I didn't fail it because of the 7 days rule, It failed because there were significant issues with the article and it was not compliant with multiple GA criteria. Once these issues are addressed it's fine for either you or niemti to renom the article. Any questions on what i've said here let me know. ★ ★ Retro Lord ★★ 13:17, 17 February 2013 (UTC)
Sure, i'll post the additional comments tonight. ★ ★ Retro Lord ★★ 20:44, 17 February 2013 (UTC)
Sorry about the delay. The issue I had was that the section wandered all over the place and wasn't concise. If you could trim it down to just a "Raziel appeared in Game X and did X then X", which would be more concise than it is now I think.
Let me know if you still need help★ ★ Retro Lord ★★ 20:54, 24 February 2013 (UTC)
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