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Is there any source before even 5 years ago that links Pascal Olivier Count de Negroni to the Negroni cocktail? All online sources with Pascal Negroni are very recent (2008-09), and I believe may stem from spamming by Noel Negroni claiming that his ancestor originated the drink. The refs given here are only a couple months old. While the origins of the drink are definitely cloudy, a quick search shows mention of the Camillo Negroni story at least as far back as 1999 on the internet. http://groups.google.com/group/it.hobby.cucina/browse_thread/thread/44dbfdcdf2a23688/91b067cb7b3de999?hl=en&q=%22camillo+negroni%22#91b067cb7b3de999 I'm just concerned that through ubiquitous spamming of the internet, people are rewriting history.
Is there any reference to Pascal and the cocktail drink even older than 3 years? - Chromatikoma ( talk) 17:20, 5 November 2009 (UTC)
I'm attempting to clean up some of the references here, and I have made a link to the relevant pages of the Annuaire officiel de l'armee francaise in the references section of the main article. These clearly point out his rank, what brigade he commanded, and that he was a recipient of the Officer medal of the Legion of Honor. His name appears hypenated like this: Pascal-Olivier de Negroni. No mention of any "count". Is there a reference for the count part?
There is a problem however with this reference which was given as "Title:'Bulletin des lois de l'Empire français, Volume 38'; Author France; Page 965; Publisher Imprimerie nationale, 1889; Original from Harvard University; Digitized 17 Jan 2008".
As far as I can tell, it was not called "l'Empire français" in 1889 because Napoleon III was captured in 1870, and France had entered the French Third Republic. So I believe I have found the likely target of this reference being titled the Bulletin des lois de la République française, which was published in 1889 as the 38th volume. Unfortunately, the hunt doesn't end there, because "Bulletin des lois" is a bulletin of the laws of France, and therefore would not likely show an award for a General. Here is a link to the image of page 965, which doesn't seem to have any mention of de Negroni.
http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k214125m.image.r=Bulletin+des+lois+de+l.f993.langFR
I would imagine it's buried somewhere in one of the annals of the army as the above reference, but I haven't located it yet. I'm removing the reference, as it appears incorrect, but I've left all the historical information there waiting to have a legitimate source provided. -
Chromatikoma (
talk)
20:50, 31 December 2009 (UTC)
I would also like to point out that the reference that is given in the article as "'The Negroni family' - genealogical, demographic, and nobiliary study from its 11th century origins to its 20th century branches in Italy, France, and Puerto Rico; by Héctor Andrés Negroni; Published in 1998, H.A. Negroni (Madison, AL)" is self-published so its use should be restricted to the guidelines given here: Wikipedia:Reliable sources#Self-published sources (online and paper) so it is most likely not permissible for use in this article. I will leave it for others to decide for now. - Chromatikoma ( talk) 21:11, 31 December 2009 (UTC)
I have just created a redirect for Pascal-Olivier de Negroni, but I would suggest that it should be the main name for the article. For the first time searching for Pascal-Olivier de Negroni actually turns up some results which with the added Count did not. I believe Pascal-Olivier de Negroni was his given name, so it should be the primary name for the article. - Chromatikoma ( talk) 22:05, 31 December 2009 (UTC)