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An edit-war has broken out between me and LucyWalshWhite over the presence of material in the 'personal life' section. The bone-of-contention is as follows:
I have attempted to add a small line of text stating "Bronze is a member of the LGBT community". This is cited by what I believe to be a reputable source, Vice, who's articles have been used in thousands of Wikipedia articles. Vice is a non-tabloid news American news cooperation, and its articles are accepted by Wikipedia as reputable sources. The article in question states "The women's game, however, has many openly lesbian or bisexual players, both on a professional and grassroots levels – from Karen Bardsley to Lucy Bronze". [1] The article has the advantage of being published quite recently, in June 2019.
Lucy Walsh White argues that she believes Bronze is not openly a member of the LGBT community and as such adding this information is an invasion of privacy. However, I respectfully disagree, since the trustworthy source provided clearly states that Karen Bardsley and Lucy Bronze are openly lesbian or bisexual, pointing to the fact that Bronze is already public with her identity. Therefore, I believe that it is not an invasion of privacy to add this information as the fact is already in the public discourse. I therefore think it is in the public interest to document the information that is recorded in already-published sources, since this is the aim of Wikipedia: to inform. LucyWalshWhite has failed to provide a more trustworthy, recent source which discredits the information I am attempting to add, appearing to be using her own opinion to disregard the truthfulness of the information.
LucyWalshWhite also argues that the Vice article should not be allowed as it "does not give any evidence or additional sources and could have been opinion of the writer". I do not share this view. Using this logic, many newspaper articles should not be allowed as sources on Wikipedia merely because they do not have a bibliography of sources, or because the opinion of the writer has appeared to have been used to make points (which in truth is sometimes difficult to determine). In reality, such rules do not exist. It is my belief that as long as a news source is considered to be a reputable non-tabloid trustworthy source, it may be used in references for a biography of a living person.
There has been a suggestion that what I am attempting to add is disrespectful since it 'outs' Lucy Bronze, and as such is disrespectful to people in the LGBT community. I have no intention of being disrespectful nor of outing her. It is my solemn belief that this source already shows she is comfortable and open with her identity. I do not think it is necessary nor proper for Bronze to have to, for example, 'come out' in a public interview or to the media directly, which LucyWalshWhite argues is necessary before any claim can be made that she is LGBT. If she has just been quietly but knowingly been living as openly part of the LGBT community and that is a known fact (as I believe this article shows), then that is quite adequate. Individuals do not need to make a public statement to make others aware of their sexual orientation. I also think that any suggestion that Bronze's identity in this sense should be 'hidden' or 'protected' when it appears to be already known is disagreeable: such a suggestion implies that Bronze's LGBT identity should be hushed up, which I think gives a completely wrong message of intolerance. Bronze is an idol for many young girls and women who aspire to be footballers or like football; I think that to record how she is comfortable with her LGBT identity would sent a positive and powerful message to these individuals that being LGBT is okay, and it will encourage young girls to be open and comfortable with their identity. Hiding facts about Bronze in this area will do the opposite.
In summary, there is a considerable amount of debate and disagreement in this area, but I strongly believe that the addition of this small, 8-word comment is necessary in this biography. I am happy to discuss this with other users to come to an agreement on this matter.
AmSam13 ( talk) 13:44, 30 May 2020 (UTC)
References
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:
You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 04:23, 14 August 2021 (UTC)
MOS:LEADBIO says to include details that give context to the subject's notability:Context (location, nationality, etc.) for the activities that made the person notable.
Bronze is notably as an England International footballer, and including nationality is standard here. Multiple editors have tried adding, but are reverted.
Spike 'em (
talk)
20:07, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
as an England International. This is different to English.
professional footballer who plays as a right-back for Barcelona and the England national team- if you want to claim adding "English" is necessary to meet MOS notability requirements (which for this bio is kind of a stretch anyway; locational context can easily be which famous clubs Bronze has played for - indeed, she has had most success in France), you haven't even read to the end of the sentence. "England" is already there.
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 15:51, 18 November 2022 (UTC)
In the lead, infobox and honours section the club is referred to as Lyon but in the club career and career statistics section the club is referred to as Olympique Lyonnais. Which name should be used? ( Fran Bosh ( talk) 11:10, 4 June 2023 (UTC))
The first debate can be found here on my talk page, and the second one is ongoing at WT:WPF. Paul Vaurie ( talk) 20:23, 22 July 2023 (UTC)