This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Lindsay Shepherd article. This is
not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.
The
contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to articles about
living or recently deceased people, and edits relating to the subject (living or recently deceased) of such biographical articles, which has been
designated as a contentious topic.
This article was nominated for
deletion on 11 June 2018. The result of
the discussion was keep.
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or
poorly sourcedmust be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially
libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to
this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page.
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to
join the project and
contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the
documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Conservatism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
conservatism on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ConservatismWikipedia:WikiProject ConservatismTemplate:WikiProject ConservatismConservatism articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Canada, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Canada on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.CanadaWikipedia:WikiProject CanadaTemplate:WikiProject CanadaCanada-related articles
This article is of interest to WikiProject LGBT studies, which tries to ensure comprehensive and factual coverage of all
LGBT-related issues on Wikipedia. For more information, or to get involved, please visit the
project page or contribute to the
discussion.LGBT studiesWikipedia:WikiProject LGBT studiesTemplate:WikiProject LGBT studiesLGBT articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Women writers, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
women writers on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Women writersWikipedia:WikiProject Women writersTemplate:WikiProject Women writersWomen writers articles
The main reason for Lindsay Shepherd's notability is that some found her lecture to be harmful to
transgender people (or transphobic). This article, however, appears to go out of its way to avoid discussing those widespread objections. The only mention of the word trans or transgender in the body of the article – "one told a college newspaper that students had used the discussion 'as an excuse to make fun of trans identities'" – is not even directly about the negative reaction in the public discourse to what she had done. The article should reflect the substance of the allegations made against Shepherd as well as the polarized public response to the issue. Accordingly, I have placed a POV template on the article.
207.161.86.162 (
talk)
05:32, 9 November 2020 (UTC)reply
I disagree. She's notable for the high level of coverage for the way in which she was treated by her employer, which was found to be inappropriate. But, If you have sources to support your position, please add them to the article. As long as your sources support your position, you can be
WP:BOLD and fix the article yourself, instead of just tagging it for others. --
Rob (
talk)
06:13, 9 November 2020 (UTC)reply
Fred Zepelin, your changes to the lead (restored here
[1]) are problematic. Adding "what she is called" to the lead without it being part of the body violates WP:LEADFOLLOWSBODY. Additionally, using such labels, which can be viewed as loaded, instead of the factual description violates IMPARTIAL. Rather than applying those labels to the lead the reasons for those labels, assuming they are DUE, should be in the article body. Since this is a BLP we need to err on the side of not including such content, especially when there isn't a consensus to make such changes. For those reasons I've restored the lead from before those changes were made.
Springee (
talk)
22:33, 30 August 2022 (UTC)reply
I've edited this article in the past and have it on my watch list, and Fred Zepelin has asked me to chime in now.
I was only restoring the long term stable lead. I'm not specifically endorsing that version so much as rejecting a series of changes. However, you are correct, medium shouldn't be cited.
Kyohyi fixed the issue with this edit
[2]. I will redo that removal which makes no changes to the text of the lead.
Springee (
talk)
04:17, 31 August 2022 (UTC)reply
@
Fred Zepelin and
Springee: I'm a bit late to the party here, but starting the first sentence of the lead of a biography with a list of quotes which are critical of the article's subject is a bizarre thing to do for any biography on Wikipedia. Following it up with a very long quote from the subject of the article about her own political beliefs is also bizarre. The sources those quotes are pulled from are bad too -- I've never heard of
Canadian Dimension before (looks to be a small left wing/socialist magazine?) but it doesn't look to be a reliable source,
Vice is really
not great, and the quote in the
Toronto Sun only appears in the
WP:HEADLINE so is not usable.
The lead should be summarising the body, and should start off with why's she's notable and related context (e.g. nationality), not start off by litigating how right-wing or left-wing she is.
Endwise (
talk)
14:20, 9 September 2022 (UTC)reply
MBFC says it's pretty far left but the reporting is mostly fact
[3]. It doesn't seem like a "mainstream" source but not a total throw away either. Regardless, using it to apply a subjective label to someone (alt-right folk hero) in the second sentence of a BLP article is not OK. Endwise is spot on here.
Springee (
talk)
15:24, 9 September 2022 (UTC)reply
You're welcome, its a weird article all around... In parts it feels much more like an article about the scandal and not the person, which makes sense because the person doesn't actually appear to be independently notable suggesting that we should perhaps have an article on the scandal instead of a bio on its key figure.
Horse Eye's Back (
talk)
19:12, 9 September 2022 (UTC)reply