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A fact from Liberty Tower (Manhattan) appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the Did you know column on 8 September 2020 (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
Did you know... that New York City's Liberty Tower(pictured), now a residential building, was once occupied by
Franklin D. Roosevelt's law office and by German spies plotting to intervene in World War I?
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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as
this nomination's talk page,
the article's talk page or
Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.
... that New York City's Liberty Tower(pictured), now a residential building, was once occupied by Franklin D. Roosevelt's law office and by German spies plotting to intervene in World War I? Source:
Mansion Global;
Tuchman p. 70
ALT1:... that New York City's Liberty Tower(pictured) was occupied by Franklin D. Roosevelt's law office, and then by German spies plotting to intervene in World War I? Source: Same as above
ALT2:... that when New York City's Liberty Tower(pictured) underwent a $6 million renovation in the 1990s, some residents could not pay their share, so they sold their units? Source:
NY Times 1996
ALT3:... that residents of New York City's Liberty Tower(pictured) paid for the building's major renovation in the 1990s, and then another renovation in the 2000s due to damage from the September 11 attacks? Source: NY Times 1996,
NY Times 2010
Comment: The listed hook, containing the phrase "...then by German spies plotting to stop World War I..." remains particularly inaccurate; the office, according to the primary article, remained leased to German spies attempting to prevent American intervention within the war, with the conflict known as World War I occurring during the period of time when Imperial German spies occupied the building. Perhaps the hook should remain altered to address this issue; thank you.
SurenGrig07 (
talk)
01:07, 11 August 2020 (UTC)reply
5x expansion confirmed, QPQ done, long enough, , , passes earwig, article cited. I'm not thrilled with any of the hooks, but think the original has the most promise. Can we copyedit that hook? Proposing a new image. --
evrik(
talk)20:14, 21 August 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Evrik: Thanks for the review. I have modified the original hook, and I think the proposed image is all right. Sadly, I didn't find any of the article's other facts interesting, so I don't have any other hooks unless you had a suggestion.
epicgenius (
talk)
20:26, 21 August 2020 (UTC)reply
Here are some things I noted. Feel free to just mark the things you've done with Y or, if you disagree, leave a comment as to why you didn't want to make the change so we can discuss. I don't feel strongly about all these changes, of course.
0. Lead
Move "at 55 Liberty Street at the corner of Naussau Street" to later in the first paragraph; I don't think it belongs in the very first sentence
Done
"Federal Reserve Bank of New York Building" -> "Federal... York" or "headquarters of the Federal... York". Makes the sentence a bit less confusing to me and makes the importance of this building clear
Note: the second usage of Federal Reserve... Building is fine, imo
2. Design
"had intended the Liberty Tower as" -> "intended the Liberty Tower to be" a bit simpler
Done
"contains a facade" -> "has a facade" I'm not sure if the side of a building can "contain" a facade, but maybe this is building jargon I'm unfamiliar with
"floor-to-area ratio" -> "floor area ratio", or change the earlier usage to make it consistent. Honestly I prefer the hyphenated version because of its clarity
Done
"main elevation" -> "main elevation (side view)" I don't feel too strongly about this, but given that you can't hover over the link to get a definition (because it's a redirect to a section in another article), I think this would be helpful for non-building aficionados (like me!)
This actually does change the definition of the term, though. An elevation is the technical term for a side of the building, and the Liberty Street elevation is the main side of the building.
epicgenius (
talk)
14:58, 8 September 2020 (UTC)reply
Maybe rename the section "Facade" to "Facades"? I've never seen it being used as an uncountable noun, but maybe that's more unfamiliar jargon :P
In this case, this is a specialized use of the term - the facade refers to the entire exterior of the building. This is done in other articles as well.
epicgenius (
talk)
14:58, 8 September 2020 (UTC)reply
Add link for "pinnacle"
Done
"exceptions. The" -> "exceptions: the"
Done
Add link for "dormer"
Done
Comment: The description in Facade is really thorough and well done!
"thick, reinforced" -> "thick, and reinforced" or "thick and reinforced"
Done
"twenty-four columns" -> "24 columns" for consistency
Done
In that sentence containing the previous comment, you can use commas instead of semicolons
Done
In section Features: you seem to use a mixture of past and present tense. I think present tense makes more sense, otherwise it sounds like the superstructure is no longer fireproof and that there are no longer five passenger elevators (though if the latter is true, do clarify that the number has changed)
Perhaps you could clarify how many stories it has in the Design section? I'm a little confused, are there 33 or 29 floors? What is the source of this discrepancy?
I'm not sure why this discrepancy exists, but it's very common in NYC skyscrapers, even with famous ones such as the Empire State Building. However, in this case, there are more than 29 stories visible on the facade. There are actually 30 stories to the top of the dormers, plus two additional stories with windows inside the sloping roof. I can't really go into the discrepancy without going into
WP:SYNTH/
WP:OR territory. The
New York City Department of Buildingsdoes say there are 33 stories, which is the number I'm going with.
epicgenius (
talk)
14:58, 8 September 2020 (UTC)reply
Y Very minor: citation to New-York Tribune shouldn't have a hyphen (I just went ahead and did it. 10:26, 8 September 2020 (UTC)) Turns out the hyphen is correct.
Ovinus (
talk)
15:15, 8 September 2020 (UTC)reply
The article is very well sourced, and the citations are all of high quality (with specified page numbers, too). All of the statements in the lead have corresponding cited information in the body. Really great work!
Ovinus (
talk)
10:22, 8 September 2020 (UTC)reply
Criterion 3
The article is quite broad, and while the information in Design is quite detailed, I also think it is quite interesting, because it explains the construction of a building with an extra narrow floor-to-area ratio, which involved some unusual features.
I might add some information about modern usage of the building. I know it's now just a residential building, but maybe some information on its average occupancy and carrying capacity would be pertinent. As I mentioned earlier in the review, I would also clarify the status of the building's five elevators. Are they still there? Are there more or less?
I'll try to do this. Details on modern use are pretty few and far between, even in databases. Average occupancy may be a bit too detailed for this article, probably because it rises and falls with the housing market in NYC. I'll see if I can get planning documents for this building.
epicgenius (
talk)
14:58, 8 September 2020 (UTC)reply
Criterion 4
Nothing that controversial about a building. The Teapot Dome scandal is neutrally mentioned in passing.
Criterion 5
The article is stable. Most of its content was added recently by the nominator.
Criterion 6
The article is well-illustrated, and the images are properly attributed as I noted earlier. A google search didn't reveal any images of the building during construction.
Really well done Epicgenius! I'm no expert on featured articles but I think with a bit of trimming in the Design section and more info about modern usage, this could be an FA. I'll take another look at it after you've responded to my comments above. Cheers,
Ovinus (
talk)
10:22, 8 September 2020 (UTC)reply
@
Ovinus Real: Thanks for the comprehensive review. I've responded to these comments now. At the current moment I think this would be fine as a GA, but I appreciate your extensive comments.
epicgenius (
talk)
14:58, 8 September 2020 (UTC)reply
Everything looks good. Ping me when you're done with finding any relevant info about modern usage, I'll take a look at what you've added (if any) and then pass the nomination. Cheers,
Ovinus (
talk)
15:06, 8 September 2020 (UTC)reply