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Archive 1 |
This section is especially pathetic in this article, listing unimportant allusions from unimportant TV episodes. I suggest its complete removal. Any objections? Mlouns ( talk) 18:35, 10 September 2010 (UTC)
The article mentions that Marie Antoinette never modified the French Blue nor did she wear it. I don't believe that her resetting of the crown jewels is common knowledge; I'm not sure what the relevance of her inaction is. Perhaps mention of her should be removed and the paragraph should focus on the fact that the French Blue in the Order of the Golden Fleece pendant was unmodified from 1749-1792 with only the one exception of the "scientific study." Any thoughts?-- 68.225.131.130 ( talk) 17:02, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
This article mentions Winston mailing the Hope to the Smithsonian in a brown paper bag through the postal service. However, the article on Winston himself identifies a different diamond as "The Jonker" that he had put in the mail. Since it was also a large diamond, the two could be confused. However, since The Jonker was uncut it is much more likely this is the one he had mailed as it would have appeared unspectacular to anyone who came across it. The Hope would have been finished and easily recognizable as valuable. 66.152.251.226 ( talk) 14:45, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
I wonder, what is the estimated value of the hope diamond to date?
I have added the estimated value of the Gem in British pounds as well as in American dollars. Where in the world did the preposterous value of $300 to $350 BILLION come from for this diamond? That is ridiculous. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.148.111.26 ( talk) 02:28, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
The Wittelsbach Blue, which is smaller by about 10 ct and has a similar, if less lurid provenance, just sold for $24 million. A range of $40-50 million is probably realistic. 205.143.123.10 ( talk) 00:14, 7 February 2009 (UTC)
Ten Years ago the Smithsonian estimated the value of the Hope Diamond at $100 Million. I would'nt imagine the value increasing very much over the past decade. —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
72.59.101.93 (
talk)
17:45, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
actualy I just read it and in 2011 it would go for: 200-250 MILLION dollers!
...due to the circumstances surrounding the curse, et al. -- Chr.K. 19:14, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
Sieur Piteau is not the forename of the jeweller, it is his title in french it is like writing in english Lord Pitau. I'd rather write 'The jeweller Piteau,' —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Chris CII ( talk • contribs) 00:27, 3 March 2007 (UTC).
The two images at the end of the article are pretty atrocious quality, and don't show the diamond nearly as well as the first pic. Can we get rid of them? They add nothing to the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.213.220.186 ( talk) 06:07, 12 September 2007 (UTC)
this is a bunch of poopie. and curses are not real. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.68.12.134 ( talk) 19:35, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
I have renamed the old "Legends" heading to Legend.
I removed the quotes that surrounded the heading's name because it seems to be silly to put quotes around the word legend as if you are saying, "this is the supposed legend."
I also changed the heading so that it can be singular since there is only one legend being spoken about at the time of the edit. When another legend is added, we can change it back to plural: Legends.
Joel M. ( talk) 15:51, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
I vividly recall watching this program during the 1970's about the Hope Diamond (more than once in fact). It would be a good addition to the section titled "In Popular Culture"
http://tv.nytimes.com/show/53166/Legendary-Curse-of-the-Hope-Diamond/overview —Preceding unsigned comment added by Katyraider ( talk • contribs) 03:08, 2 March 2009 (UTC)
If you look very carefully at the bottom of Harry Winston's original setting for the Hope Diamond, you will see a tiny hook. From this hook, Evalyn Walsh McLean often hung the diamond named "The Star Of The East", a pear-shaped diamond weighing nearly 95 carats.
While the Hope Diamond was on exhibit in South Africa in 1965, it was displayed on a gold rosebush. The diamond rested in the center of a golden web like spider; alluding to the legend of bad luck.
Source for these additions: "Blue Mystery The Story of the Hope Diamond" copyright 1976 by Susanne Steinem Patch, Smithsonian Institution Press. Foreword by Paul E Sesautels, then curator in charge of the National Collection of Gems.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by Sabrina Sprite ( talk • contribs) 00:05, 19 February 2010 (UTC)
Hi, In the section 'The Museum national d'Histoire naturelle (MNHN) in Paris' there is the sentence, 'Like many kings before him, Hope could have pawned the French Blue to Eliason to get cash at a time the sterling was highly depreciated.' However, Hope was a banker and not of royal blood, am I correct? This sentence needs clarification as it implies Hope was a King. Not sure how to do this as I am not overly familiar with the details of the Hope diamond (having come here from the media reports of the new setting at the Smithsonian).
However, a casual reader, such as myself, may come away with the impression that Hope was a King. Could someone with real expertise please correct! Maybe something along the line of, 'Like the kings who owned the the diamond before him, the Dutch banker Hope could have pawned...'
Hope this helps in the improvement of this article :-) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mondegreen de plume ( talk • contribs) 05:24, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
Source for these additions: "Blue Mystery The Story of the Hope Diamond" copyright 1976 by Susanne Steinem Patch, Smithsonian Institution Press. Foreword by Paul E Sesautels, then curator in charge of the National Collection of Gems.
When is somebody going to post a photo of the new necklace??? -- 98.232.176.109 ( talk) 08:12, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
Hello! Done and done folks! Now if someone more qualified than I can move it around so it shows at the "right" place instead of waaay at the botom, it would be appreciated. I'm not suggesting it should be the "main" photo but surely it should be a bit higher up. Cheers, Observer31 ( talk) 02:04, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
I took the liberty of adding the tag and category -- it looks like this hasn't seen a significant update since before Harry Winston revealed its new anniversary setting, and since then Smithsonian Channel aired " Mystery of the Hope Diamond," which also provided more information. -- Magmagirl ( talk) 22:41, 19 January 2011 (UTC)
I'm worked on a tentative redraft of this article as part of the U.S. collaboration of the month in a sandbox here. I kept pretty much all of the previous information, with occasional copyedits, but added numerous references, a few sections and pictures. I added two wikitables to summarize info about the changing ownership and value, as well as the fates of previous owners.-- Tomwsulcer ( talk) 01:08, 12 July 2011 (UTC)
It's possible to swap the sandbox article in to the Hope Diamond article, then swap it out soon thereafter (this permits the two versions to be compared side by side); but it probably wouldn't be worth it because so much stuff has been moved around.-- Tomwsulcer ( talk) 01:08, 12 July 2011 (UTC)
While working on it, I was kind of surprised to find other sources on the web which were more thorough and comprehensive than Wikipedias so I hope the revamp will make it competitive out there. There are loads of interesting stories, as well as fabricated stuff about the supposed curse probably to generate publicity (to up the diamond's value?) but I tried to keep everything in and maintain the neutral perspective and yet try to write it (while keeping facts hopefully straight) to keep a flow going. I'm wondering:-- Tomwsulcer ( talk) 01:08, 12 July 2011 (UTC)
Where the diamond was sold in countries other than the US, the values should be given in that country's currency first, with the value in US dollars in parentheses afterwards. As it stands in this article at the moment, for its sale in the UK, in some cases the values are given in US dollars alone, which is clearly a nonsense as the USD is not the currency there. There must be consistency, I realise, in providing USD values for all its sale prices over the years, especially as it now resides in the US, but to give primacy to USD values for sales not in USD is just plain worng, especially in an international encyclopaedia. Conversely, the table is a mess - all values such as livres, francs etc should have 2011 USD value in parentheses. 86.133.210.78 ( talk) 08:45, 10 November 2011 (UTC)
Hi folks. I've uploaded a 1974 official photograph from the Smithsonian of the Hope Diamond. Perhaps it's of value for this article. You can find the image here. -- Sarah ( talk) 00:08, 27 May 2012 (UTC)
This section seems unnecessary to me, as it pertains to the general process through which diamonds are created, rather than any specific feature of the Hope Diamond. I propose that it be deleted - objections? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.15.32.35 ( talk) 22:05, 30 May 2012 (UTC)
Seconded, in favor. I found it a nice refresher on very basic geophysics with specifics on the hue and structural peculiarities that make this diamond unique. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Raiders88 ( talk • contribs) 10:23, 19 January 2014 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Propose to merge from Tavernier Blue into Hope Diamond history section; "No need for two separate articles"; discussion here. GenQuest "Talk to Me" 06:28, 14 September 2014 (UTC)
* Same here. — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
108.36.142.129 (
talk)
11:08, 25 September 2014 (UTC)
I've flagged this as dubious, for a whole pile of reasons.
For one, it is devoid of a
neutral point of view; it reads like an essay arguing in favour of a particular position.
For another, the article is full of
such phrases as “supposedly”, “likely scenario”, “long been believed”, and “historians suggested” or “speculated”. It is a catalogue of special pleading and speculation.
Although the article argues forcefully that the Hope Diamond and the Tavernier Blue are the same stone (or some of the same stone, anyway) the Hope has no firm
provenance before 1839 (or maybe 1830). And though there is some scientific evidence of a link, that is based on examination of a lead replica, whose provenance doesn't extend beyond 2007.
Third, it is difficult
to verify (as the source of many of the references (NYT) is unavailable to casual (ie.unsubscribed) readers) and what is written here takes a cavalier attitude to them. The article states, for example, “in September 1812, the earliest point when the history of the Hope Diamond can be definitively fixed”....: ”Definitively”? Of the two sources given, one (the Smithsonian) says only that “strong evidence indicates” the Hope is a re-cut of the French Blue, and the other source is Farges, who is the person making the claim. It goes on, “although a second less definitive report claims that the Hope Diamond's "authentic history" can only be traced back to 1830”; Really? Less definitive? An article in a jewellers trade journal is less definitive?
As mentioned
above, this article is already
too big; it would make more sense to move the stuff here about the history prior to 1792 to the Tavernier Blue article, leaving a summary here with a statement to the effect that there is strong evidence the Tavernier Blue was recut secretly to form the Hope. My two pennies worth...
Moonraker12 (
talk)
15:33, 11 November 2014 (UTC)
In view of the erosion of support for the merge proposal ( above), may I make a counter-proposal, that the article here be split? I suggest we move the information about the jewel's history prior to 1792 to the Tavernier Blue article, leaving a summary here with a statement to the effect that there is strong evidence the Tavernier Blue was recut secretly to form the Hope (and a similar statement there). This would resolve the article size issue here and make the Tavernier Blue article more rounded. As has been said, the Hope and the French Blue may well be materially the same, but they are not the same jewel in any other sense. The point was also made by Francois Farges, who is the person who has done most to link the two jewels (quote: "The diamond has been recut, which means that the one in Smithsonian is a completely different stone"). Moonraker12 ( talk) 22:53, 23 December 2014 (UTC)
This edit request by an editor with a conflict of interest has now been answered. |
Since it a popular page[?] — 73.47.37.131 ( talk) 22:08, 27 September 2015 (UTC)
You say ...the McLeans may have fabricated concern about the supposed "curse" to generate publicity to increase the value of their investment.
This statement seems to relate to the time they purchased the diamond. If they did want to exploit the legend, it would have been well after purchasing it. Valetude ( talk) 19:39, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
Is it really necessary to actually spell out that the supposed curse might not be real? That's like arguing that a haunted house may not really be haunted. It's okay to note how marketers and salesmen sensationalised it but parts like "there are strong indications that such stories [about a curse] were not grounded in solid fact" are completely redundant and ridiculous of themselves for suggesting they could have been. Bataaf van Oranje ( talk) 12:44, 28 March 2016 (UTC)
The diamond has been surrounded by a mythology of a reputed curse to the effect that it brings misfortune and tragedy to persons who own it or wear it, but there are strong indications that such stories were fabricated to enhance the stone's mystery and appeal, since increased publicity usually raised the gem's value and newsworthiness.