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Looks like there's a lot of interested people with a lot of good information out there.
However. One of the fundamental guidelines of contributing to the Wikipedia is to cite your sources.
Please.
Who knows: you might learn something new. :-)
DanielVonEhren 02:09, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I've just split the Sushi article in two by separating its History section into a separate article (this one).
The initial words are a simple cut-and-paste from the sub-sections on the Sushi page. This means that at the moment this is a poorly structured article: no real introduction, no context, and therefore no clear flow. I intend to rectify that over the next few days, but if anybody want to beat me to it, please do.
DanielVonEhren 16:33, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Hi this is Charles from Japan. This is an interesting article, and I dont want to seem too critical, but I think the claim that sushi originated in China is absurd. Someone appears to have done some digging to come up with all these old Chinese characters, but none of it is explained, except that none of them refer to what we know of as sushi - which, as the second part shows, was clearly developed in Japan. The Chinese had nothing to do with the development of sushi, for Pete's sake.
Why can't the Japanese be given credit for their own national dish? Everything here didn't originate in China, you know. Yes, ramen originated in China. Sushi originated in Japan and it's unfair to the Japanese to say otherwise.
Finally, the standard Romanization for ?? is ritsuryô. You're using an outdated system. So, take my adivce and dump the whole first section on China, clean up the romanization, dispense with all the fancy characters that have nothing to do with the subject, and give credit where credit is due.
These old characters prove nothing. Equating the language to the characters used to write it is a common fallacy in the Orient. The problem is that the Japanese often took Chinese characters and applied them to something different from the original item. This was one way of adapting the Chinese writing system to write their own language. (In other cases they made up their own characters, or just took characters for their sound). It does look like someone Chinese has come up with a new way of claiming that everything originated in China.
Bathrobe 4 April
Well, well, it looks as though this was not written by a Chinese history megalomaniac but by a European! In fact, the soberest reaction (see further down) comes from a Chinese who expresses surprise at the statement that sushi was invented in China and requests evidence showing that the Japanese actually imported "鮨" and gradually improvised it. Toytoy has also clarified the fact that the characters used don't actually prove anything. I heartily agree with the overall thrust of Toytoy's rewriting of the article.
Bathrobe 4 April
It would be helpful if articles would provide transliterations of terms in non-Western scripts would provide transliterations. Either Wade-Giles or Pinyin will do - but do indicate which. Septentrionalis 20:00, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Can anyone take a picture of the mug filled with Kanji letters with the fish radical? In Japan, some sushi restaurants are using this kind of mug.
These mugs are educational. Most educated Japanese cannot read, possibly, 50% of the word -- Toytoy 00:55, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)
I ran across this interesting article when I was looking up something else. I was attracted by the claim that sushi originated from China, which I heard for the first time. The only other origin place for sushi that I heard before is Korea.
Firstly, I need to disclose that I am a Chinese. I am having hard time in linking "鮨" with sushi. Could the author clarify his rationale that "鮨" was the early version of sushi? Similarity is not good enough. For example, we can find things similar to hamburg exisiting long time ago in China, but it would be very difficult to argue that hamburg originated from China. To support the Chinese origin claim, evidence of showing that the Japanese actually imported "鮨" and gradually improvised it is needed. There have been all kinds of exchange among Chinese, Koreans and Japanese for thousands of years. The mutual influence is abundant. It would not be surprising to find similarities among things from these countries. Invention never starts from complete scratch.
I look forward to learning more history of sushi, but I couldn’t care for less which people actually invented it.
-- Hong 01:00, 2005 Apr 4 (UTC) MA, USA
More can be written on this subject:
This is an interesting subject. -- Toytoy 05:15, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)
The history of sushi is possibly too complex a subject for just a few non-expert Wikipedians like us. For the record, I cannot speak Japanese. My taste buds are also ruined by the McDonald's. -- Toytoy 06:30, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
I know sushi has been popular. But it is unfair to pit sushi against soba this way.
Fact: You cannot make nigirizushi at home. Even in Japan, you usually don't make your own nigirizushi. A full course of nigirizushi includes possibly more than 5 to 10 different fish and shellfish. You don't know how to select them. You may know how to fillet these fish but you don't know how to prepare them (some lightly salted; some marinated in vinegar or soy sauce; some litely burned in straw smoke; some charcoaled burned or heated by hot water on one side; some served 6/12/24 hours after death; some stewed in a thick sauce; some wrapped in sea weed to reduce water; ... blah ... blah ...). The meat may look like raw fish to an untrained person, it may take some behind-the-scene hard working to bring out the best flavor of that particular kind of fish. You don't know how to cook the rice THE EXPERT WAY. You don't know how to form the rice THE EXPERT WAY. Even if you know how, it is stupid to buy so many kinds of fish for a single meal. You end up going to a food stand or a restaurant. Even armed with an egg beater and an oven, you usually don't make soufflé at home. Making nigirizushi is even more difficult.
In contrast, cooking soba at home is possible. You may even make your own soba from a 70%/30% or 80%/20% mixture of buckwheat flour and wheat flour (pure buckwheat soba is much more difficult). A soba restaurant has to compete with housewives. -- Toytoy 04:50, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)
Tekka-maki (known also as the Tuna Roll) is a raw tuna and rice roll. The name "tekka" refers to the gambling parlours in Japan, where this snack was served at the gaming table as finger-food.
It was in 1765 that the 4th Earl of Sandwich invented the sandwich for convenience while gambling.
The question is; when was Takke-maki invented? Would it be a significant coincidence if it were invented around the same time?
The etymology section doesn't actually list the most common kanji used for sushi (as mentioned by Toytoy)- 寿司. What's the etymology for that? -- DrHacky 02:57, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
Sushi is a Japanese dish considered a delicacy. It started out as a fast food in Japan because of its simplicity. A round sandwich of sorts, it is most often made with rice, sashimi, and circled with nori. The ingredients have caused controversy due to the fact that they are often raw.
This is hilariously bad writing, "a round sandwich of sorts", and "caused controversy due to the fact that they are often raw". I'm going to point this article out to Wikiproject Japan. JoshuSasori ( talk) 03:23, 12 December 2012 (UTC)
Shouldnt there be a section about the introduction of salmon? http://www.nortrade.com/sectors/articles/norways-introduction-of-salmon-sushi-to-japan/ 85.167.13.32 ( talk) 19:05, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
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"As an example of tax paid by actual items" - not sure, but this should be "paid on"... ? Schissel | Sound the Note! 22:20, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
I came to this article because I just learned about Hoe_(food). I was hoping it would tell me about the Chinese origin of it, and what the Chinese name of a similar dish was, since that article says that Hoe was introduced to Korea from China... It seems to me that we might want to add some information about Hoe into this history article? And dive more into the origins and history from other areas of the various countries and peoples of Asia? I would think they're more interrelated than is generally thought of.. Centerone ( talk) 02:44, 29 December 2018 (UTC)
Here's a link to an article that says that sushi was mentioned in an English and French newspapers in October of 1878.
https://eccentricculinary.substack.com/p/sushi-in-paris-october-1878 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:1700:1431:4F90:EDAD:247F:55FC:2116 ( talk) 20:34, 17 January 2022 (UTC)