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You have been misinformed by the media. Look into the CCR5 anomaly and the link to the bubonic plague in Egypt at the time of Ikhnaton. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.130.84.37 ( talk) 20:29, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
Have they submitted samples to an OPEN SOURCE global DNA bank to see where they fit into the human DNA ma? Ultimately, everyone is going to know where they are coming from, and at specific times as well.... such is the marvels of science.
merge with
shinlung article? Good idea!
Myer Samra
17:13, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
"A group of 54 Jewish persons from Mizoram in northeastern India, who claim to be descendants of an ancient Jewish tribe, arrived here on Tuesday." Which Tuesday? Where is here? Israel, I suppose.
I have no idea which Tuesday, but I presume "Israel" was meant, or some specific locale w/in Israel. Since the supposèdly offending text has since apparently been removed from the article, however, this line of discussion seems to be "dead". Tom e r talk 03:58, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
This is an error, since the Hebrew text of Exodus speaks of a sea of reeds, as in the plants. Using red sea is a mistranslation. Taltman 22:24, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
The Red Sea translation is not an "error" in the way suggested, in that most Eurpoean languages, Arabic and others with a Christian translation of the bible, refer to the Red Sea, in words that are not necessarily similar to the word "reed" in their languages. This is the form in which it appears in the Septuagint, the original Jewish translation of the Hebrew Bible into Greek. However, the term Tui Pui Sen, Big Red Water, can also mean something like "raging river". Myer Samra 15:54, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
Can we get a figure for the number of Bnei Menashe?
There are a few million Chin-Kuki-Mizo tribesmen, but the term "Benei Menashe" is reserved for the few thousand actually practising Judaism. Myer Samra 17:13, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
I can't figure out if they are also called the Shinlung tribe, or the Sinlung tribe, even though Shinglung sounds more correct to me.
myanmar Gringo300 08:26, 8 October 2005 (UTC)
Ok....exactly how many people were converted in Mizoram and Manipur? One place says 700
[1], and most places write 220.
Here's the real kicker....A Washington times report states that 700 people were converted
[2], and another states that only 220 were converted
[3], the funny thing is that both was written by the same guy.
The term "Shinlung" or "Sinlung" is not the name of a tribe. In Mizo, "Chhinlung" is the term for the cave from which Chin-Kuki-Mizo legend says they emerged. "Sinlung" is the Hmar dialect equivalent, although Rochunga Pudaite's book "The Education of the Hmar People" identifies this as a town, possibly in China. While western writers have used "Shinlung" to mean either all the Chin-Kuki-Mizo peoples or more particularly those practising Judaism, in fact a) the dialects in Manipur and Mizoram don't have a phoneme equivalent to English "sh", and b) most of the tribes in Manipur are not familiar with any of the variations above [Chhinlung, Shinlung or Sinlung], using words like Khul or Khur to refer to the primordial cave.
In 2005, 218 people were converted in Mizoram, but the Rabbis were unable to get to Maninpur as their permits were wthdrawn, so no conversions occurrd there. See article "Bnei Menashe Conversions Halted" by Matthew Wagner, Jerusalem Post Internet Edition Nov. 9 2005.
There had, however, been over 800 converted and settled in Israel prior to this date.
Myer Samra 16:12, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
Do they look asian, like mongoloid?
Quite a god article on this obscure people. But it doesn't have a list of references - really would help if one were provided. PiCo 13:02, 24 November 2006 (UTC)
If you are interested in serious works on the topic, in addition to Dr Shalva Weil's article to which there is a link at note 13 in the main article, you might like to consult the following:
Hillel Halkin: Across the Sabbath River: In Search of a Lost Tribe of Israel, Houghton Mifflin, Boston & New York (2002);
Tudor Parfitt: The Lost Tribes of Israel - The History of a Myth, Weidenfeld & Nicolson, London (2002);
Tudor Parfitt & Emanuela Trevisan Semi: Judaising Movements: Studies in the Margins of Judaism, Routledge Curzon, London (2002);
Myer Samra: "The Tribe of Manassh: 'Judaism' in the Hills of Manipur and Mizoram", in Man in India, 1991, (Special Edition) 71 (1): 183-202;
Myer Samra: "Judaism in Manipur and Mizoram: By-Product of Christian Mission"' in Australian Journal of Jewish Studies, 1992, 6 (1): 7-22;
Myer Samra: "Buallawn Israel: The emergence of a judaising movement in Mizoram, Northeast India", in Lynette Olson (ed.), Religious Change, conversion and Culture, Sydney Studies in Society & Culture, 12, Sydney (1996), Pp. 105-131;
Shalva Weil: "Lost Israelites from the Indo-Burmese Borderlans: Re-Traditionalisation ad Conversion Among the Shinlung or Bene Menasseh", in The Anthropologist, 2004, 6 (3): 219-233.
Myer Samra 17:02, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
I'll tell you the truth about these mizo who call themselves the lost tribes of Israel, the real reason is economic opportunities coupled with Mizo fundamentalist christians obsession with Biblical Israel. This was particularly fanned after some mizo's notably Zaithanchhungi and C Rokhuma visited Israel and propagated all these rosy pictures of Israel, both of whom published books of their travellogue painting Jews as super people and arabs as the devil of all evils, especially in Ziathanchhungi's book. Her descriptions of arabs are downright racist ( of course I beleieved her when i read her book when I was in my early teens) and the religious leaders saw an opportunity in this and begun to call themselves the lost tribes of Israel, despite their obvious looks and traditions no different than the rest of Mizo's who migrated from Burma to mizoram. After some mizos started migrating to Israel they sent money to their families backhome and seeing how they helped their family, others want to go to Israel too. It is a disgrace for the mizo people to sold themselves to serve as labour for jewish people in Israel. If mizoram was developed like western countries and people have a chance to make a decent living, NONE of these mizo will convert to Judaism except a few religious fanatic ones. (for your information unskilled labour in mizoram earn $3 a day)
Pico|Pico, you can visit any North East state. You only need special permit from the embassy/High Commision and consulates where you applied your visa or at airport in major cities and other offices in major cities. Apparently, you can't travel alone to certain NE states-- Aryanbeauty 14:50, 23 July 2007 (UTC)
[4]Re TShilo12's editing comment "what on earth? That is _not_ what the article says. this is supposed to be an encyclopedia, not a 2nd grade book report".Tomer, please take note too as it may help stall your descent into dumberness.
Dude, I'll ignore your hilarious assessment and instead question your comprehension of English.........that is exactly what it says.
"Having successfully completed this task, the priest would place the animal on an altar and offer it up to God, in the process reciting a series of ancient Bnei Menashe chants and prayers. Perhaps the most extraordinary of them is known among the Bnei Menashe as "Miriam's song." We had to cross the Red Sea," it began. "Our enemies were coming after us with chariots but the sea swallowed them all as if they were meat. We are led by the cloud during the day and by fire at night. Take those birds for the food, and drink water coming out from the rock."
Now you may not like this but I have checked with a range of Kuki-Mizo-Chin elders; their collective opinion is that not only the name "Miriam's Song" but everything the non-English/Hebrew-speaking 81yo Mendel "Kingbol" and "Yossi" are reported as claiming in this partisan article by Michael Freund is balderdash to put it kindly. Finally, these are NOT your people or your history being discussed, it's mine. You share a religion with the BM, not an ethnicity; the sooner you accept that and get on with supporting them in a practical manner instead of petty wiki comments/deletions, the better their chances of integrating into Israeli society. Migration is tough on anyone, including the faithful. Cheers, Junglebells -- Jinglebells01 23:39, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
From the history page
S/T: "First off, Freund isn't making any claims, he's merely reporting what he's been told, if anyone's making claims it's the Bnei Menashe. Second, this tripe about ppl being surprised is not encyclopedic)"
S/T's editing legend: "putting this back into English". And "poor comprehension and poorer writing".
The para in question which S/T has since changed (snore): Michael Freund reports that the Bnei Menashe have a chant they call Miriam's Prayer[3]. Apart from the fact that this will come as news to the millions of Kuki-Chin-Mizo who have celebrated the Sikpui Festival all their lives, the same article states that "a century ago, when British missionaries first arrived in India's northeast, they were astonished to find that the local tribesmen worshiped one god, were familiar with many of the stories of the Bible, and were practicing a form of biblical Judaism". By all empirical accounts, the entire tribe were animists at the time of the arrival of the missionaries.[citation needed].
1. Aha! So we agree that "if anyone's making claims it's the (few thousand) Bnei Menashe, not the several million-strong Kuki-Chin-Mizo tribe as a whole. Religion can make people believe anything. See Rastafarians.
2. When I can be bothered, I'll trawl again for citations previously deleted by unhelpful people.
3. "tripe about ppl being surprised is not encyclopedic" : So true. There is absolutely no account of astonished missionaries arriving in the jungles of NE India to find a form of Judaism let alone people familiar with the Bible. And let me assure you those busybee missionaries and rajwallahs wrote a lot of books about their adventures among the *savage heathens*.
And S/T, do I have to set a bush on fire to convince you that those of my people who have heard of this claim were not only surprised but bemused. The Sikpui Hla (like a rose:)is the Sikpui Hla; you can rename it all you like but it's still the Sikpui Hla. For some reason, Geldof's mob trilling "and there won't be snow in Africa this Christmas time" comes to mind.
4. Truly, your English is far superior to that of this humble tribalwallah and I bow before it, if not to your argument.Jinglebells01 01:33, 19 October 2007 (UTC) BTW, tripe is YUM, especially in a fiery hot Kuki-Chin-Mizo stew, and menudo of course.
What, taking your ill-mannered, ill-informed comments apart is verboten?? Could this be yet another attempt at suppressing information? Surely not!! As for my *rubbish* vs your *truthiness*, perhaps it's time other admins checked it out, if only to remind you to mind your manners. Jinglebells01 02:02, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
Much better. "Please" and "thank you" - so civilised, yaar! And out of respect for your newly found manners, I'll wait until the next round of suppression (yawn) before filing a request. Cheers, Big Ears, Junglebells Jinglebells01 23:02, 21 October 2007 (UTC)
My, oh my: notice that Junglebells, Jinglebells01, Hellsbells222, Hellsbellsinheaven, etc. have done most of the edits through the history of this page? Can anyone say SOCKPUPPET?? Divebomber1 10:41, 23 October 2007 (UTC)
Also wish to add (before I REALLY get blocked for some trumped-up crime) that it's because of my collective contribution to the BM page that it's been rated B and mid-level importance. It is also the most linked-to page on the BM. The only stuff I delete are things I find redundant from my own contributions and peopel are welcome to revert if they disagree. What I don't like is the attempts by various people to delete wholesale chunks of relevant information. I'm interested in continuing updating the information as it comes to me via various sources so let's see if I get to do that or get suppressed. Junglebells 01:53, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
...block notice. According to your block log, you have not been blocked at all. That user (User:Divebomber1) who added the templates either jumped to conclusions or were trying to trick you. NF24(radio me!Editor review) 22:47, 26 October 2007 (UTC
Cheers for that, NF24-- Junglebells ( talk) 19:26, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
I would remove the annal style that starts out sporadically and grows towards the end. That isn't very Wikipedic in style. Starting off each annal entry with a present tense verb even though the annal is from some years ago is also quite disorienting and makes this article seem very unprofessionally written from an English standpoint. -- Sephiroth9611 ( talk) 21:39, 12 October 2008 (UTC)
As a non-expert in this subject I will say that the timeline "style" of the article is very un-Wikipedia like and doesn't make a lot of sense when the dates are out of order. I would at least unbold the dates and put them into a sentence structure but this topic is totally unfamiliar to me.
Absolutely no idea about this so called Chalianthanga and his vision. May be because something about this chalianthanga and his vision appeared on this article, people (who've read this article) might think that he is some kinda Prophet of the Bnei Menashe. But am here to clarify that WE (the bnei menashe living in Manipur and other parts outside Mizoram) has not even a slight idea about this guy and his vision. So publishing something about this guy and his vision, and claiming that he played a role (not only a small role but a big one as according to the article) in all these events regarding the Bnei Menashe claims as part of the lost tribe is absolutely baseless. Yosm ( talk) 11:49, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
Corrected numbers in the Infobox and Lead based on the actual content of the articles; note range in estimate of numbers and those wanting to convert and emigrate. Parkwells ( talk) 18:17, 9 May 2013 (UTC)
The article seems tilted toward Israeli issues, internal politics and relations with India - significant for showing the larger effects of people changing identification, but it also needs more on the Bnei Menashe and their lives since this journey began, both in Israel and India. Parkwells ( talk) 01:03, 10 May 2013 (UTC)
An image should be added to show these what these "Jews" really look like. Winston S Smith ( talk) 23:46, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
This Haaretz article contains new revelations about R' Amar's ruling and other matters. I can send a copy to anyone who asks. Zero talk 08:32, 19 February 2015 (UTC)
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Their flag should be added 182.176.222.89 ( talk) 08:32, 23 June 2024 (UTC)